# Need recommendations



## PTownSubbie (Sep 6, 2010)

Well, I put together a quick photo-tent today. I made it out of 1/2" PVC and wrapped the sides and top with some light fabric (believe it is muslin cloth). 




I have two lights. One on the left and one on top. The one on the top is moved to the right of the top to give better light distribution. Both lights are 40W each. I think they will take larger bulbs if that is necessary but I am not certain that it is. I have a little photograph experience but not as much as some, especially at taking pictures of pens. :biggrin:

Any input on the picture? How about the stand? Background?

Please help me get better.


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## monophoto (Sep 6, 2010)

Background is ok.

In a photograph, you eye tends to go to the brightest item.  In this case, that's the white stand.  If you used something darker, that would force the viewer to focus on the pen rather than the stand.

What is the stand made from?  Can you paint it a darker color?


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## PTownSubbie (Sep 6, 2010)

monophoto said:


> Background is ok.
> 
> In a photograph, you eye tends to go to the brightest item. In this case, that's the white stand. If you used something darker, that would force the viewer to focus on the pen rather than the stand.
> 
> What is the stand made from? Can you paint it a darker color?


 
It is just a chunk of PR in Ultra Shimmer. Shaped and sanded to hold the pens.


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## PTownSubbie (Sep 6, 2010)

NewLondon88 said:


> I think you'd be happier with more power. 2 x 40 watts isn't very much light,
> even that close. Compare to a studio that might use a multiple lights of
> 200 or 300 watts each (although probably a bit further away) and a lighter
> diffusion material.
> ...


 
I'll check to see the max wattage of the lamps. 

Is there a good inexpensive lamp that people are using?


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## Boz (Sep 6, 2010)

The base is way to large.  The subject is your pen and the base it is resting on is as large if not larger than the subject.  If you have the ability to crop images you could cut off most of the base.  Additionaly the lighting is not even.  The right side of the pen is in shadow.  Reposition the main light (the one on top) to give you a more even light across the whole length of the pen.  Then use your fill light (the one on the left) to open up the shadows.  Since both your lights are the same you can move the fill in and out to keep the image from getting too flat.


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## PTownSubbie (Sep 6, 2010)

Boz said:


> The base is way to large. The subject is your pen and the base it is resting on is as large if not larger than the subject. If you have the ability to crop images you could cut off most of the base. Additionaly the lighting is not even. The right side of the pen is in shadow. Reposition the main light (the one on top) to give you a more even light across the whole length of the pen. Then use your fill light (the one on the left) to open up the shadows. Since both your lights are the same you can move the fill in and out to keep the image from getting too flat.


 
Thanks for the input. I might have to make the stand a bit smaller and darker.

Can you explain in different terms what is meant by "open up the shadows"? Does that mean get rid of?


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## markgum (Sep 6, 2010)

it kind of looks like a desk lamp that you are using.  Is that correct?  My cheap-o lights I got with my 'tent' are useless and need to get something better.  Maybe my shop lights would do better.  
  Where did you get the lights?  Let us know the wattage of the bulb you get.
thanks.


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## PTownSubbie (Sep 6, 2010)

markgum said:


> it kind of looks like a desk lamp that you are using. Is that correct? My cheap-o lights I got with my 'tent' are useless and need to get something better. Maybe my shop lights would do better.
> Where did you get the lights? Let us know the wattage of the bulb you get.
> thanks.


 
Mark,

They are just desk lamps that I picked up at Office Max a long time ago. Currently they have 40W bulbs but I will go up a bit on them if the stand will allow. I will replace tomorrow and retake some pictures.

I was wondering what type of lights everyone else uses. I am not looking to spend a fortune though.


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## Whaler (Sep 6, 2010)

I use 3 26 watt photo correct CFL lights which are a bit expensive but the daylight CFLs from HD will work. I believe they are 23 watt ( 100 watt equiv.) and you may get by with just 2 of them.
If your camera can be set to manual I would recommend that you shoot that way. Adjust your exposure, take a shot and them take one a tick under and one a tick over and then pick the best one. 
Your light tent looks real good and those lamps should habdle the CFL bulbs with no problem.
Here is a pic of my setup.


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## monophoto (Sep 6, 2010)

Photographing pens is an exercise in portraiture - the good news is that the pens won't complain about how long you take and how uncomfortable the pose it.  The bad news is that they are small, so you have issues with depth of field and exposure.

I don't think the example you have provided is all that bad.  The two suggestions I would make are:

1.  Find a different support/stand for the pens.  Something smaller and darker so that it doesn't detract from the pen itself.  I've seen pen pictures made with stones that worked very well. I normally use a wine cork that has been stained a dark brown.  Anything but white.

2.  Play with the light a bit.  Boz suggested opening the shadows - I agree that the area behind and to the right of the pen in the illustration is too dark and needs to be lightened.  If the set-up picture is representative, the placement of the lights explains the problem.  The light on the left is probably ok, but the top light should be moved to the right and perhaps back.  If you are working in digital, do a series of test images with that light in various positions while holding the left light in one place.  You want 'modeling' (ie, you want the image to depict the shape of the pen), but you also want to even up the lighting just a bit.  

I wouldn't worry about whether the bulbs you are using are too weak.  Because pens are inanimate, if your camera is on a tripod you don't really care how long the exposure is.   I think you can work with what you have - you just need to fine-tune the setup a bit.


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## PTownSubbie (Sep 6, 2010)

Whaler said:


> I use 3 26 watt photo correct CFL lights which are a bit expensive but the daylight CFLs from HD will work. I believe they are 23 watt ( 100 watt equiv.) and you may get by with just 2 of them.
> If your camera can be set to manual I would recommend that you shoot that way. Adjust your exposure, take a shot and them take one a tick under and one a tick over and then pick the best one.
> Your light tent looks real good and those lamps should habdle the CFL bulbs with no problem.
> Here is a pic of my setup.


 
Thanks for the recommendation on the bulbs. The tent is not fancy but I think will work just fine.

I took a photography class but it was camera use not lighting and setup. Most of it was landscape and such.

I shot these in manual mode as I will with most of my pen shots.


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## PTownSubbie (Sep 6, 2010)

monophoto said:


> The bad news is that they are small, so you have issues with depth of field and exposure.
> 
> I don't think the example you have provided is all that bad. The two suggestions I would make are:
> 
> 1. Find a different support/stand for the pens. Something smaller and darker so that it doesn't detract from the pen itself. I've seen pen pictures made with stones that worked very well. I normally use a wine cork that has been stained a dark brown. Anything but white.



I'll work on this one tomorrow maybe. I just like the perch....It sets it up off the ground. Personal preference but I will make a darker perch. 



monophoto said:


> 2. Play with the light a bit. Boz suggested opening the shadows - I agree that the area behind and to the right of the pen in the illustration is too dark and needs to be lightened. If the set-up picture is representative, the placement of the lights explains the problem. The light on the left is probably ok, but the top light should be moved to the right and perhaps back. If you are working in digital, do a series of test images with that light in various positions while holding the left light in one place. You want 'modeling' (ie, you want the image to depict the shape of the pen), but you also want to even up the lighting just a bit.


 
Thanks for the recommendation. I will try that tomorrow. I am working with a Canon EOS XSi DSLR.

So what I gather from your last comment is you think the pen is too two dimensional and you can't really see it in three dimensions. Is that right? So, if I move the top light down to the right rear, that may create more depth?

As far as depth of field. Should a larger apeture (smaller opening) be used to get more depth of field or since there is a single piece being photoed does this not matter?


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## SDB777 (Sep 6, 2010)

Yes, a larger f-stop(f/11 vs f2.8) will give you more depth of field.  If you need to find out exactly what you'll be working with, try this:  >>>>DOF Cal<<<< 


Your pen is very 3-dimensional, if it wasn't-it'd be a PITA to hold....and your light tent will let you see that in your photo's with some adjustments with the lighting.  Good thing digital film is cheap!!!  Take a lot of photo's, look at your EXIF data and then keep doing what works.



Scott (smaller stand, nib somewhat toward the lense) B


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## Hucifer (Sep 6, 2010)

PTownSubbie said:


> markgum said:
> 
> 
> > it kind of looks like a desk lamp that you are using. Is that correct? My cheap-o lights I got with my 'tent' are useless and need to get something better. Maybe my shop lights would do better.
> ...



I picked up a couple of flexible neck desk lamps at Walmart for about 8 buck each. I have 60 watt equivalent CF bulbs, and it seems to work ok. I think I need to add another from the top though...


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