# Powermatic large air filtration system



## mmayo (Apr 25, 2016)

I am moving and setting up a new shop.  In this shop I plan to try to reduce dust by buying the large Powermatic dust filtration system.  It sells for around $400 and weighs 70#.  My shop is thankfully large 30'x40' and has a tall ceiling.

IF YOU OWN ONE OR HAVE SEEN ONE IN USE please let me know your opinion before I buy it.  I have read all of ththe reviews and they are very positive.

Thanks in advance


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## mmayo (Apr 27, 2016)

Question two

My ceiling is 30' up. Can I mount this air cleaner or its Jet brother on a wall 10' or so up in the middle (front to back) of the shop?  This is the previous owner's stuff, but how about above the drill press.


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## Dalecamino (Apr 27, 2016)

Mark, that will make a nice shop. You could build pianos in there. I'm just guessing, the cleaner would be more effective if it were located closer to your work level? Maybe? It seems the cleaner would be fighting gravity. This however, comes from a hack who works in a shed :redface::biggrin: Good luck!


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## stonepecker (Apr 27, 2016)

I have never seen the Powermatic system.  For the price it should move a lot of air.  The one thing I would do is keep it closer to the work.  That is where you will be.

You could also have a box fan to move air around........mount a furnace filter on it for the bigger pieces of dust.  OR   Maybe get two of the smaller Grizzly air cleaniers and mount them at opposit end/wals with in the shop.  If you get them on sale, you could save some change.

Love the size.......  Please post pictures of it when you have things in place.

(Chuck's is a studio.   But he calls it a cave.  Nice and snug.)


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## mmayo (Apr 27, 2016)

Trust me, this is a great reality that was included with a very nice new house.  It is tall, very tall almost too tall, but it is what it is.  I cannot imagine getting up to the ceiling without renting a sissors lift.  Hanging a cleaner on 20' of chain sounds problematic though I am open to suggestions.  My two car garage shop ( that had two cars in it every night ) was so full of fine brownish red mahogany dust as we have packed up that I have decided to spend the cash and get an air filter.

I suggested 10' to avoid hitting it. 

What about a wall mount?

If not 10' how high?


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## stonepecker (Apr 27, 2016)

I don't know about Powermatic........But I have mine on a shelf. 6' off the floor.
My cieiing is only 8'. I also have two box fans on the floor to move air. This works wonderful in my 20'x30'

Question......where does the stairway go?


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## mmayo (Apr 27, 2016)

There is a semi huge storage area up there.  The previous owner and builder of the shop built it with two office sized rooms, a kitchen and work area and wait for it, a 3/4 bathroom with a shower.  

I will try the shelf idea since it sounds safe, logical and would greatly facilitate cleaning of the filters.  It will help with power too since there is an outlet right there.


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## stonepecker (Apr 27, 2016)

We need pictures!!!!!!!

Sounds like you got a fantastic 'dog house' when you bought the new place.
Congrats


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## Ed McDonnell (Apr 27, 2016)

In a shop your size, you might find out that a lot of dust is going to settle out before that powermatic air cleaner can get to it.

Assuming your measurements are correct (and ignoring the upper 15' of shop height) you are trying to clean 18,000 cubic feet of air.  Even at it's top setting of 1200cfm, that powermatic unit would only turn the air in the shop 4 times an hour.  (And remember, I ignored the upper 15' of shop height in the volume calc.)

I like to turn over the air in my shop 10 times an hour when I'm making lots of dust.  I think you would want to get to at least 6x or 8x to have a chance at really reducing the dust in your shop.  Two powermatics?

Using fans to move the air around in addition to the air cleaners will likely force dust higher up in the shop.  Unless you keep the garage door open while you work.  In sunny warm California that might be the best solution if the neighborhood allows it.  Get a bigass fan at the back of the shop and blow everything right out the garage door.

http://www.bigassfans.com/

Back to cleaners and a closed garage door.  For a single cleaner I would try to put the unit in the center (like the garage door opener).  For two cleaners I would  mount on opposite walls (once again about the same height as the garage door opener).  Are you sure you have 30' ceilings?  That's insanely high.  For a two story structure I would expect 20' to 24' max.  But maybe things are different in California (or maybe you are 3 stories??)?

Good luck with the new shop.

Ed


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## Curly (Apr 27, 2016)

Great shop with room for a mezzanine if ever needed. 

I advocate getting as much dust at the source, keeping it out of the shop over trying to scrub the air when it is floating around. So I think you should put your money into a ClearVue Cyclone system with big ducts to all the dust generators. When the dust is in the air you are breathing it on its way up to the filter unit.


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## jttheclockman (Apr 28, 2016)

I also agree you need to try to capture as much dust at the source. No matter where or how many air cleaners you install you will still have fine dust. It can not scrub the entire room fast enough to get all dust out. Just impossible. It will make things better that is for sure.


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## mmayo (Apr 28, 2016)

*Dust collection moving ahead...*

Perhaps you might have thought I did not employ dust collection at the tool.  I do, but could and I'll do better in the new shop.

I have these items plus a very good vacuum for my sanding tools.











I just returned from buying this Jet unit





This will have to do for now or I'll need a good divorce lawyer.  I just hope to figure out how to "fly" the Jet in my shop.


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## mmayo (Apr 28, 2016)

My new motto

ATDCATT. All the dust collection all the time.  If you ride a motorcycle you might know this phraseology.


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## mark james (Apr 28, 2016)

I have that Jet unit, installed hanging from a basement ceiling.  I actually do not turn/sand a lot, but in a 15' x 20' area, I see the filter pretty clogged about every 3-4 weeks!  It is GREAT!  Buy a lot of filters.  

I have no problem going through filters - what is in the filter could have been in my lungs.  Actually, earlier tonight I looked at the filter and was amazed at how quickly it needed to be replaced...


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## jttheclockman (Apr 28, 2016)

mark james said:


> I have that Jet unit, installed hanging from a basement ceiling.  I actually do not turn/sand a lot, but in a 15' x 20' area, I see the filter pretty clogged about every 3-4 weeks!  It is GREAT!  Buy a lot of filters.
> 
> I have no problem going through filters - what is in the filter could have been in my lungs.  Actually, earlier tonight I looked at the filter and was amazed at how quickly it needed to be replaced...



Mark those are not reusable filters in those units??? What is it like an air conditioning /heating filter??? I thought they were washable.


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## beck3906 (Apr 29, 2016)

I have one of the Jet filters I placed on top of one of these shelves.  I also bought wheels for the shelves so I can roll it around the shop.  My shop dimensions are somewhat close to yours with the high ceilings so the shelves get it up where I can manage it.

Set the unit about 3-5 feet from a long wall about mid-way of the length.  You're trying to get a circular flow of air around the shop.

Shop Style Selections 74-in H x 48-in W x 18-in D 5-Tier Steel Freestanding Shelving Unit at Lowes.com__


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## beck3906 (Apr 29, 2016)

Buy a good supply of 12x24 filters.  I rigged up a Velcro strap on each end of the intake side to hold a second filter on the outside of the one the unit uses.  I replace that one quite often, the second less often.  

It's amazing how much dust gets into the air even running dust collection at the source.


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## mmayo (Apr 30, 2016)

Thanks all of you.  I visited my new home and shop yesterday and finally saw the shop empty.  Amazing to think I can have my stuff set up permanently and not take it down every night.






I am very pleased with all of your suggestions.  I will employ as many of your ideas as possible.  Color me happy.


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## stonepecker (Apr 30, 2016)

Looks like a lot of happy hours are going to be spent right there.

Enjoy the fun and congrats.


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## mmayo (May 2, 2016)

*Less productive*

After delivering some boxes of paint and other more worthy finishes I took this photo "out" the garage door in the shop.  I may be less productive, but I may build with more oak for some reason.


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## JimB (May 2, 2016)

mark james said:


> I have that Jet unit, installed hanging from a basement ceiling.  I actually do not turn/sand a lot, but in a 15' x 20' area, I see the filter pretty clogged about every 3-4 weeks!  It is GREAT!  Buy a lot of filters.
> 
> I have no problem going through filters - what is in the filter could have been in my lungs.  Actually, earlier tonight I looked at the filter and was amazed at how quickly it needed to be replaced...



I just take the filters outside and blow them out with my air compressor. Can't you do that with that unit?


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## Fish30114 (May 2, 2016)

Yes, you can--I have actually had that Jet for a little over a year, and I have not replaced the original filter--I have blown it out with my air compressor several times though...Oh and BTW a big time idol of mine, famous woodturner Nick Cook, who is sponsored by Powermatic, told me that the Jet is better than the Powermatic--both made by the same company, he even has the Jet filter in his personal shop--along with a ton of Powermatic equipment!!


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## mmayo (May 3, 2016)

I heard the same thing in several places and bought the Jet.


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## stonepecker (May 9, 2016)

OK, You have had all weekend to work on the shop..........How about some new pictures to see what you have done?

Interested minds want to know.


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## stonepecker (May 15, 2016)

Hey Mark....... Here is a bump.   Can you show us what is happening as you put this together?


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## mmayo (May 24, 2016)

*Progress on my dream shop*

OK after way too many boxes unloaded in the house and more than a few honey do's I have started to convert my two car garage shop into a Taj Mahal sized shop. The stuff was densely packed into shelves, pegboard and hung on screws everywhere in the garage. I religiously returned the shop into a garage with two cars nightly. 

No complaints here in any way just a bit overwhelming to make it work now and make it better and logical for the future as the shop is populated properly. 

Bottom line - I love the Jet air filtration unit. I have run it a lot as I cleaned out tons of sawdust in the shop. The external filter went from blue to brown as it captured dust. I have placed it on top of my paint and finish cabinet standing in its side. Love that timer and remote. 

A few photos will chart initial progress. Remember that all of this went up daily and packed away daily too so choices were made for the old shop. A real out feed table is high on my build list as well as full sized tools. 











Many boxes remain and will go away soon as a metal storage rack and plastic bins will house the contents. 






The view out of the window brightens my mood.


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## mmayo (May 24, 2016)

One more note about Tehachapi (Bear Valley Springs)

I have seen ten deer on my property at one time. I have stopped several times to let huge elk pass. My medium sized cocker spaniel has convinced the deer that this is her property and not deer park. ��


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## eharri446 (May 24, 2016)

Look at all of the burls on that tree.


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## mmayo (May 28, 2016)

The oaks and their burls are somewhat sacred here, but if I can get some legally - ok. 

Here is the Jet perched on the paint/finish cabinet. It is just above head level roughly in the center of the shop. 










A Walmart $88 5'x2'x7' storage rack and some plastic tubs aided in organization. 





It will take a few years to replace the bench too drill press and small bandsaw with their full size cousins, but planning has started. A jointer is a must. 

A little more work and the floor will be clear. 

This stack will be a long range tackle box. Building it now is like changing oil during a freeway trip. 





Luckily, everything survived the move and is humming along nicely. I am trying harder than ever to capture dust or at least address it quickly. I have finished a couple of small projects and they feel smooth.


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## stonepecker (May 28, 2016)

Mark, How about a rolling set of shelves? You could place an air cleaner on it and roll it close-by your work.
One thing, do not put 'heavy' items above waist height. Makes it hard to move and keep up-right. DAMHIKT.


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## beck3906 (May 29, 2016)

You may get better air flow in your shop by turning the unit around.  Maybe even moving it.  Sitting like it is allows air flow out of the stairwell and not from the dusty shop.


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## stonepecker (May 29, 2016)

beck3906 said:


> You may get better air flow in your shop by turning the unit around. Maybe even moving it. Sitting like it is allows air flow out of the stairwell and not from the dusty shop.


 


_I believe that Mark is blowing the 'cleaned' air into the shop/workbench area and not towards the overhead door. No matter where a person places an aircleaner.....you will always have this kind of 'problem'. As it sits, what will happen hopefully is that any fine floating dust going upstairs will be drawn into the cleaner._

_With a shop this big, I can't believe that just one cleaner will ever keep it dust free. All a person can do is hope to try to hold the dust down to a small amount._

_It is looking really good Mike. Please post more pictures as you make it your own.:biggrin:_


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## mmayo (May 29, 2016)

The cleaned air exits to the rear of the shop.  I quite agree with the air cleaner vs shop volume, but funds have dwindled from other aspects of the move.  The filter on the Jet has captured much dust as we clean the shop and try to remove the dust of the previous owner.  Each time I snake a hose out front and blow the external filter out, much beige wood dust leaves the filter.  That is dust not on my work or in my lungs. 

My real money is going to firewood, storage racks for it and service of the wonderfully efficient fireplace.  

I plan to supplement the Jet with two 20" box fans with fan buddy filters on the intake side.  They will be floor-based and will help inexpensively.


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## beck3906 (May 30, 2016)

stonepecker;1855428
 
 
[I said:
			
		

> I believe that Mark is blowing the 'cleaned' air into the shop/workbench area and not towards the overhead door. No matter where a person places an aircleaner.....you will always have this kind of 'problem'. As it sits, what will happen hopefully is that any fine floating dust going upstairs will be drawn into the cleaner.[/I]
> 
> _With a shop this big, I can't believe that just one cleaner will ever keep it dust free. All a person can do is hope to try to hold the dust down to a small amount._
> 
> _It is looking really good Mike. Please post more pictures as you make it your own.:biggrin:_


 

I don't believe the airflow will be optimum sitting like it is as the airflow will be circulating into the open stairwell allowing dusty air to get trapped there along with what appears to be a landing over the stairs.  

Pushing clean air past the stairwell would keep the dust from entering the stairway and create a more steady flow around the outside walls of the shop.

But I agree that getting any dust out of the air is good.

I also have a couple of box fans with filters attached to assist my Jet air cleaner.  I use them near the dust source.  Helps with cooling also.


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## hcpens (May 30, 2016)

Put in a lower ceiling then you would have a storage level.


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## stonepecker (Jun 18, 2016)

I know I keep asking but it isn't to pester you Mark.  I just want to see how the shop is progressing.  If I wasn't interested, I wouldn't be asking.

With all that space, it should be wonderful.


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## MDWine (Jun 21, 2016)

Yep, love the pictures, living for a new shop through you!


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## mmayo (Jun 23, 2016)

*My shop at of late June 2016*

Ok OK Here are photos as it exists today.  First, pinch me, second I think OMG each time I go in the door and work.  After 39 years in a wonderful, but cramped 1200 sq ft Long Beach home with a two car garage that housed my shop, this is my new reality in Bear Valley Springs, Tehachapi.

The shop outside





Whole shop from the garage door





Lathe, planer, compressor, bandsaw, part of a workbench, dog bed and yes target for the pellet rifle.





The other side of the shop with _those three doors_, the staircase and my Jet air filter sitting on the finishing cabinet.





A very customized long range tackle box in progress.





Storage rack





My dust collection area.  Soon to get a Jet canister dust collection system.  _Two of those doors are also shown._





Behind door number one is a gym!  I worked out here this morning and try to most days.





Behind door number two is a bathroom with a shower.





Behind door number three is a kitchen/finishing area where I also store most of my fishing equipment.















The stairs up lead to a very large storage area for non-woodworking stuff





















I keep my newly built rod rack here










The shop has the square footage of my entire previous home.  Needless to say, it was impossible to hide my enthusiasm when we visited this home and I saw this space.  I have much to do to grow into and utilize this wonderful work area.  I will make a serious effort at dust collection.

Someone stated that I might be blowing the air exhausted from the Jet upstairs, not so.  If I stand right next to my table saw, near the sink, I feel the clean exhaust air well. You cannot feel exhaust air at all on the stairs.  I always close those doors during any work to keep dust from entering these rooms.





Color me very fortunate and happy with life.


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## stonepecker (Jun 23, 2016)

Mark,
I am impress with what you found.  That is a 'dream shop' in my book.
Put a bed upstairs and you never have to go to the house.

ENJOY it and congrats.


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## MDWine (Jun 24, 2016)

Yep, I can imagine the calls I would get on my cell phone from my wife... "Are you still alive?"...

What a great space, congrats!


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## OZturner (Jun 25, 2016)

Mark, If I had your Palace, I would believe I had "Died and Gone to Heaven".
A question, Does your Good Lady also allow you into the main House, or do you have to stay in your Workshop? 
With the way it is outfitted, If it was me, I don't think it would matter that much to me either way, perhaps with the exception of Meal times, and on a Cold Winter's night, but then again it is in California.
Joking aside, and sharing in your Joy, that you have such a wonderful opportunity to set it up as your experience, and needs tells you!

Great Work, Enjoy (and please keep the photographs coming.)
Congratulations,
Brian.


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## mrtrenier (Jun 25, 2016)

There is one in the local Woodcraft store where I teach.  It moves a ton of air and is quite quiet.  If I had the need, I would buy one in a heartbeat.


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## TellicoTurning (Jun 26, 2016)

I need to get an air cleaner for my shop... I took a board down from my overhead storage earlier this week and it had a measurable layer of dust on it... problem is, in summer I like to work with the doors open and fans running to cut down the heat... an air cleaner would just be sucking in the outside air.  

Love your shop Mark and if you ever get relegated to the dog house, what a dog house you get sent to.... Kinda like when I was raising my son and sent him to his room as punishment.... he had TV, his computer, his toys, his phone... some punishment.


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## mmayo (Jul 4, 2016)

*Back in the saddle again*

My wife has been kind enough to not only let us buy this home and shop, but she regularly comes to the shop to help clean up.  Last year, I made over 400 cedar plugs and six long range tackle boxes!  Yikes!  She would come in around 5:00 and put a stop to the day, by starting to vacuum.  Her ultimate weapon to get me to stop was to threaten to start putting away tools, that got my attention.  She can hide stuff where you will never find it.  It am blessed.

Tomorrow I order a Jet canister dust collector and assorted hoses plus a pyramid cone fo the table saw.  I will get more use out of that existing dust collector too.

I am back tomorrow making chips in my shop after an eight day fishing trip.  I caught this 40# yellowtail and many of his brothers, yum.







If you have never caught one, they kick your %#*&$.

PS I sleep here





You get much more home for your money in Tehachapi compared to Long Beach


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## mmayo (Jul 8, 2016)

*Shop fauna*






We had mistletoe removed from our oak trees and small clumps remained near the shop and guess who likes mistletoe? A buck and three of his ladies. Nice touch after sanding for couple of hours. 

I have 40-50 pens and other assorted woodworking items for sale at the Gallery and Gifts store in downtown Tehachapi. The Tehachapi Valley Arts Association has granted me membership.  I can't wait to turn more.


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