# Dipping Enduro?



## stinger (May 21, 2006)

I've been attempting to learn to apply Enduro using Wayne's method and I think I understand it but it seems to require a lot of practice to get applied smoothly without rings. My experience is that if I have rings, I tend to sand through into the wood.[V] So I am wondering if anyone has had any success dipping with Enduro and if it is worth trying this or practicing more with Wayne's technique. 

Thanks.


----------



## Nolan (May 21, 2006)

Funny that crossed my mind at first but I didnt try it, instead I just kept praticing. For me I sanded through also until I fallowed the part about sanding at lowest speed. Takes longer but I can better control sanding. I also sand perpendicular in the beginning so I get rid of rings. I also put on extra coat of finish (figured I will do this till I get better at smooth finish coat). Good luck

Nolan


----------



## pmpartain (May 21, 2006)

I have also been attempting Enduro.  Same difficulties.  I haven't been using Viva paper towels.  I've heard that is a big deal.  I've also heard to use Bounty paper towels.  I've just been trying another pen this morning.  Since I've been sanding through, I've been trying thicker and thicker coats.  Now I have a milky film all over the blank when I'm done with a coat.  Takes a long time to dry that way to apply again.  I've noticed to not get the rings you have to "float" the paper towel on the finish and not touch the wood.  I did get one pen to turn out with one sand through.  Looks great except for that spot.  Pen will be a gift and the guy likes it as is.  Wayne did straighen me out on dropping the finish onto the blank and not the paper towel.  That was a big help.  I'm wondering how to separate the bushings from the blanks when the finish cures.  I'm not good enough to keep the finish off of them.  I bought the small sampler from Beartooth, so I don't have enough to try dipping myself.  As a side note, Beartooth has the best customer serivce and fastest shipping that I have ever seen.


----------



## wayneis (May 21, 2006)

Every time I see someone write about "Wayne's" instructions there is something that they are doing different but the one thing I see in common is that you are all unhappy with your results.  I'm really beginning to wonder if any really did read the instructions or if you are all real men, LOL you know the ones, they never need instructions and never read the darn things.

The finish IS SUPPOSED to look milky when you put it on, it clears up when it dries.  Dring dependes on the climate, in the summer when its nice and warn my finishes dry in minutes but in the winter I'm looking at close to ten minutes.

In my opinion you need to use VIVA paper towels.

When sanding, use a backer block that came with your MM and start with either eighteen or twenty four hundred grit MM.  You Do Not have to sand very much, its not a sanding contest, maybe it should be.  Only sand until smooth then you are just polishing.  The rubber backer block helps you so that your MM is only sanding the high spots.  If you don't use the block you will end up sanding through the finish most likely.

As far as getting the bushings off the blanks there are two ways, one when the finish is dry just snap the bushing and it will come right off.  Next take a razor blade and cut carefully around the blank. 

Its really not that hard Guy's.

Wayne


----------



## pmpartain (May 21, 2006)

Well I'm glad you took the time and effort to write down your method.  Once you pointed out my mistake of applying the Enduro, I saw it right away in the instructions.  I'm not unhappy with the results, I've had one success and it's great.  I'm unhappy with my performance in getting the result.  With every new thing I've tried in this craft, I had to make the obligatory dozen mistakes before I could get consistent results (probably on mistake #8 now).  Same here with this new process.  With this last one, I got impatient and started sanding too early.  The finish wasn't cured and it just peeled up leaving a huge bald spot.  One more mistake that had to be made before I had it down pat.  I think most people start with friction polish.  That finish is super easy with decent results.  This finish is really great and requires a little effort to get the result.

Thanks much,
Mark


----------



## angboy (May 21, 2006)

[}]Hey Wayne- I have a complaint too- I think my bottles of enduro must be defective! For some reason, everytime I use it, I don't have any of these problems, so there must be something wrong with it! [}]

Please don't anyone take offense, I'm not trying to be critical of anyone who has had problems, maybe I'm just lucky! I did modify the "Wayne" instructions in that with the first bottle, I don't do the third coat with the lathe not running and I don't go the opposite direction- I do all three coats the same. And that's just because I tried the doing it with the lathe not running once and that was hard for me, so I just gave up and thought I'd try it the easier way and it seemed to work fine.

With the posts about people having problems, I went back and looked at my pens. I tend to alternate between the enduro and lacquer, with no rhyme or reason as to why I chose either for a specific pen. At this point I can't remember for sure which ones I did with enduro, but I don't see any that cloudy or the finish is sanded through. And I'm pretty sure I would have noticed that problem as I was using it if it had been happening. Maybe I'm just blessed when it comes to finishes because I've never had any problem with a CA finish in regards to how it looks (in my opinion at least) or with even getting the hang of how to do it.

Anyway, I just wanted Wayne and anyone else that hasn't tried it to know that there are people who've used it without any problems. I know this post doesn't do anything to help out those that are having problems, and again please don't take this as critical. (Of course now the next pen I try to finish with either enduor or CA will probably come out looking like s%*$*!


----------



## stinger (May 21, 2006)

I really only asked about dipping. I've read all the other threads about other people having problems and didn't intend restart a thread on what I am doing wrong with the method or in any way critisize it. Just asking if anyone has any experience with an alternative.


----------



## KenV (May 21, 2006)

Wayne -- put me into the pretty much all success with enduro.  I do use the sanding sealer to do just that though.  I was turning spinners guages for my spouse this weekend with checker board blanks.  Used both Paudak/Maple and Walnut/Maple.  After rough sanding, I added a dose of sanding sealer and proceeded to the next grit or two.  Added another dose of sanding sealer and then went to the next grits.  I used the P grits through 2000, gave them one more dose of sealer and finished with enduro.  No bleed of colors and no colored dust in the maple.  

I have buffing capabilities and if I do find a flaw in application, the buffing puts Enduro to a great gleam without a problem.  I have learned to let it cure before buffing though.  Good product with good results.


----------



## Johnathan (May 21, 2006)

I still have my cans ready to go. I look forward to working and learning another finishing technique.


----------



## wayneis (May 21, 2006)

Thanks angboy, I think that I was starting to get a complex.  As far as how you do the sanding sealer, between yiou and I well I now do the same thing.  I've been to lazy to write up another set of instructions to modify them.  Another thing that I have changed is that I now do not use sanding sealer on stabilized blanks, I go right to the Enduro.  I put on about three good coats let it cure and sand with MM.  One last thing that I should add is that until it has fully cured you should not put the pen in a case that has elastic straps that hold the pen in place.  The elastic ends up putting little rings in the finish.  Once it has cured it is hard and you will then have no problems.

Wayne


----------



## Nolan (May 21, 2006)

Wayne,
For the record I to am happy with enduro. I even posted in another thread that I thought it would be my finish of choice. That was after my first pen with it. I have READ and followed your technique to the tee with great results. But also have sanded through on one pen thats when I decided to go four coats untill my skills are good enough that I can apply my Milky coats with less rings. BTW with sanding block (which I didnt get with my MM) how do you do pens with coves and such? I seem to be doing pens for people that arent "straight" they have shapes so to combat that I have chosen tho sand parallel to the pen the knock down the ridges.
Nolan


----------

