# Hard finish safe to come into contact with mouth



## skubasteeve (Aug 7, 2014)

Hey everyone... I am trying to figure out which hard glossy finish (for wood) is safe to come into contact with the mouth, I am looking at making some wooden tips on some projects that will be held with the persons lips.


----------



## monophoto (Aug 7, 2014)

I got into a conversation with a wooden flute maker at a show a couple of weeks ago.  He was telling me that he originally used polyurethane on his flutes, but more recently has been using a mineral oil/beeswax combo so that he could avoid the dreaded 'food safe' debate.

The general opinion is that all finishes are safe once the solvents have evaporated and the finish has fully cured.  That said, the issue is that people are all different, and there are a few people who have strange allergies that aren't shared with the general population.  The problem is that what constitutes 'safe' for those folks is going to be different.  Even the supposedly safe beeswax finish can be problematic for people with unusually serious allergies to certain kinds of plant pollen.

That would lead to the conclusion that the only truly safe finish is no finish, but even that's problematic because some people are allergic to the wood itself.


----------



## skubasteeve (Aug 7, 2014)

I am not too concerned about the allergy, it is whether something such as CA/WT finish will cause other problems chemically.


----------



## kovalcik (Aug 7, 2014)

You have to decide what you believe, and maybe more importantly, what your customers believe. 

1) All finishes are safe once cured.
2) Only specific FDA approved brands are safe. (Even though they contain the same ingredients that non-fda approved finishes contain.)
3) Food grade oil and beeswax finishes are the only safe finishes. 

For myself, I would have no problems using a wiping varish, poly, or CA finish on an item for myself. My bowls that I sell have a mineral oil/beeswax finish.


----------



## carlmorrell (Aug 7, 2014)

I use walnut oil from the grocery store on wooden kitchen stuff.  But it does not leave a glossy finish.


----------



## raar25 (Aug 7, 2014)

Of course any oil from a nut tree could cause alergic reactions to sensitive people.


----------



## Crashmph (Aug 7, 2014)

Try looking into Craft Coat from Eco Advance.  There are venders here that sell it. It is a water based hydrogenated linseed oil mixture.  There are no terrible fumes to deal with and it is eco friendly.


----------



## KenV (Aug 7, 2014)

It makes some difference where and how the mourh works.  Big differences between a smoking pipe, a musical instrument, and a blowgun with darts.

Had a friend that chewed up a pipe stem 2-3 times a year.


----------



## penmaker1967 (Aug 8, 2014)

i use butchers block on my items that will contact  with mouth it gives a good shine once dry and it can be found at any lows hardware stores


----------



## Wildman (Aug 9, 2014)

I use mineral oil (laxative & not industrial or baby oil) as a food safe finish on my bowls.  I do not bother with wax instead give those buying my bowls small little of mineral oil to re-apply as required. I do not buy into discussion once a finish is dry it’s safe for food contact.  Have been to CFR looking at chemicals safe for food contact, never found a wood finish by name or chemicals listed as food safe on wood.  

Food-Safe Finishes - Fine Woodworking Article

Lot of research into indoor pollution talks about out gassing of paint and wood finishes.  Today low VOC finishes rule for indoor use, but not for mouth contact. 

Product labels & MSDS do not always list all hazardous chemicals in their products.  Still need to pay attention hazards & warnings listed.


----------



## skubasteeve (Aug 14, 2014)

Thanks for all the replies... I am looking at doing the mouthpieces (drip tips) for these vaporizers that people are using nowadays in place of cigarettes.


----------



## its_only_me (Aug 16, 2014)

Acrylic, then you don't need a finish. Have a look at this thread

Harry


----------



## steve worcester (Aug 17, 2014)

kovalcik said:


> ....
> 
> 1) All finishes are safe once cured.
> 2) Only specific FDA approved brands are safe. (Even though they contain the same ingredients that non-fda approved finishes contain.)
> ...



This is the current belief with woodturners, yes. But I have a hard time believing that a CA finish or any finish that has isocyanates would be human safe when dry (since food is already dead, I will use human safe instead). There are also polyesters used in woodturning that use cobalt in the mix, and I am pretty sure that wouldn't be either. 

While these may be on the outside of the spectrum for what most people would use, we need to quit saying all finishes are food safe. When it was just oils and lacquers, that was probably true, but I would even challenge Bob Flexner on this in todays world.

Now, based on what you are trying to make, I would think the glycols in the gap fluid might break down any finish, so I agree with Harry, acrylics or man made material. Besides, they'll dig (yep, I said dig) the swirls and stuff in the patterns of the acrylics. Look for high detail figure since its small pieces. Some other options might be antler, bone, ancient ivory (mammoth) and just bare wood.


----------



## kovalcik (Aug 18, 2014)

Just a general question on why you would not trust a CA finish to be safe but would trust a random acrylic or other man made material that you don't know what chemicals were used in the making.   I am not suggesting acrylics are unsafe, but I have heard this claim a couple of places and don't really understand it.  Especially since CA is now widely used for closing wounds.   Seems that anything that could get into the blood stream should be safe enough for mouth contact.


----------

