# tool sharpening



## mdwilliams999 (Mar 20, 2012)

I have gotten by for a year using my neighbors 8" grinding wheel for sharpening my chisels.  He has a Delta variable speed *' with a white stone (not sure of the grit) and fine grey stone (don't know the grit).  He also invested in a sharpening system (V pocket jig and grinding platform).  Over all he has somewhere between $300-$400 invested.  Overall, I find it to be adequate but certainly not impressed.  I will admit that much of it could be me (or my neighbor) not doing it all right.  Bottom line - not happy with the final results.  The chisels are sharp but not that sharp.  Cutting wood is fine but stone and acrylic is just about impossible.  I am using a carbide tip for those and works fine, but I really need sharper chisels.

I have a woodworking show coming up in 2 weeks and I know from past years that it can be a good opportunity for buying sharpening systems.  I have been looking at the smaller Tormek, Penn State Sharpening System, Wolverine, Sorby etc.  They all can get expensive quick, but I need something that will do the job and doesn't take a lifetime to master.  Afterall, I want to turn pens, bowls etc. not be a master chisel sharpener.

What advise do you have on a system?

Thanks
Mike


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## isustrik (Mar 20, 2012)

I have a Tormek and I appreciate the ease of replicating bevels, especially odd/experimental ones. Plus the fact that you can get other jigs down the line really expands its use. I found it really easy to use after watching the included DVD.


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## The Penguin (Mar 20, 2012)

I have the 8" slow speed grinder from Woodcraft, a wolverine jig and varigrind jig.

a very experienced turner taught me to sharpen - and now I just touch them occasionally on a 120 grit wheel.


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## mdwilliams999 (Mar 20, 2012)

Has anyone found that they can sharpen their chisels enough to cut Trustone or acrylic blanks?


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## Akula (Mar 21, 2012)

mdwilliams999 said:


> Has anyone found that they can sharpen their chisels enough to cut Trustone or acrylic blanks?



Those should be no problems turning..very common items

I sharpen mine by hand (very very seldom do I need to use the grinding wheels).  You can buy all the extra tools you want to get the same results (just faster)

What kind of problems are you having?


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## yort81 (Mar 21, 2012)

*go for the Tormek*

I have the tormek T7 .... it was an ouch in the pocket book, for sure... but it only hurt once.... let me tell you about sharp and ease of use and replicating bevels....Once you learn (yes there is a small learning curve)..but once you learn... you will be surprised at how you got by sharpening the way you do now!

For me... it now takes me about two minutes to set up.... a quick pass on the stone, with the correct bevel, and to hone... then im back at it... if it is already set up for the gouge.... 30 seconds...and im back at the lathe with a gouge you can shave with.

Troy


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## bitshird (Mar 21, 2012)

HSS tools should sharpen up nicely on a 120 grit "white" wheel but at to cutting stone, I don't think you'll get HSS tools to hold an edge long enough, But Acrylic, should not present many problems.
I use a wolverine jig on an 8 inch slow speed grinder with a 60 and a 120 grit wheel for my bowl gouges, on the rare occasion I use them,  and just do my skews by hand, Honing also helps, (the tools last longer) but since I can't use a skew for beans, I mostly just stick with carbide.


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## leehljp (Mar 21, 2012)

Tool sharpening is one area of extreme importance that is often overlooked by those just starting out. I make a pen that requires it to be turned so that the wood is as smooth as if it were micro meshed, but from the tool only. Can't use sandpaper on it. So, a very smooth finish without MM or SP requires a SHARP tool and light touch.


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## kovalcik (Mar 21, 2012)

I use the Woodcraft slow speed grinder and the Blackhawk sharpening jig from Capt Eddie for my gouges.  Total cost <$150. Hand sharpen my skew with a diamond stone.  4 or 5 strokes per side and it is ready to go. Tools are plenty sharp enough to get a good finish on wood and acrylics.  Never tried trustone.


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## lorbay (Mar 21, 2012)

I now use my new CBN wheel for all of my tools with a wolverine jig on an 8 inch slow speed grinder.
Lin.


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## mrcook4570 (Mar 21, 2012)

Some trustones are very hard and will dull HSS tools very quickly.  Others are very easy to turn.  One member (I think it is randbcrafts) has very good descriptions of many trustones on his site.


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## ren-lathe (Mar 21, 2012)

mrcook4570 said:


> Some trustones are very hard and will dull HSS tools very quickly.  Others are very easy to turn.  One member (I think it is randbcrafts) has very good descriptions of many trustones on his site.


I buy all my tru-stone from R and B, & they have very good and accurate descriptions on hardness. Carbide is definitely the way to go when turning tru-stone or M3 blanks.


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## ctubbs (Mar 21, 2012)

I have a VS Delta grinder sitting beside my Grizzly wet slow grinder. I use both but mostly the slow wet system, very similar to the T7.  The slow wet unit does the best job and mostly is used for stropping and touch up.  Once the edge gets bad enough to need grinding, the wet wheel comes into play.  The Delta has now been relegated to lawn mower, axes, shovel and hoe sharpening.  Find a system you can learn and use it.  There are many great systems available.  I mostly use carbide tools now for a variety of reasons, but when HSS tools come into play, there are few things that turn better than a truly sharp HSS lathe tool.  Learn how to make the perfect edge on your tools.  It will be time very well spent.
Charles


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## Gilrock (Mar 22, 2012)

I think I'm similar to the original poster.  I've spent quite a bit and I'm not that happy with my results.  I've watched a lot of YouTube video and I'm pretty sure I'm doing it right.  I got the slow speed grinder from Woodcraft also and it doesn't seem that slow...I'd hate to see a fast speed grinder.  I got a full complement of the Wolverine jigs, Vari-Grind2, etc.  Used a diamond dresser to true the wheel.  I'm trying to remember the grit wheel the guy at Woodcraft sold me cause I'm pretty sure it was rougher than 120.  I'm thinking it's an 80 grit but it is a white wheel.  I remember telling him that the website I read online told me to get a 120 grit wheel and the wheel he sold me was the only one they had and he said that's what everyone uses.  When I'm sharpening it feels like the material is removed too fast.  I get a really nice uniform grind but it's nowhere near as sharp as the Easy Wood carbide tools so I tend to use them 90% of the time.  They work so much better I've turned entire bowls with the Easy Wood Finisher tool.

The problem is if you don't have an expert to show you you're stuck digging for YouTube videos hoping you find the right one.  I'm gonna have the same problem with my new metal lathe.  I know there's a lot of information I don't know and I'd really like to find a local machinist and be mentored.


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## jd99 (Mar 22, 2012)

I have a variable speed 8" grinder with wolverine jigs also. It only takes a few of seconds to sharpen tools while I'm turning.


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## The Penguin (Mar 22, 2012)

if you're having trouble sharpening, get off You Tube and find a local turning club. Surely there will be someone there that will be happy to teach you to sharpen your tools.

you might even make some friends there, too. 

:biggrin:


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## Gilrock (Mar 22, 2012)

Oh so you think it's nothing to do with having an 80 grit wheel?

The only club I know of doesn't meet at a convenient time for me.


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## The Penguin (Mar 22, 2012)

sorry - yes, I think an 80 grit wheel is too course - my local mentor would tell me to use that only for rough removal of material if you are changing the shape/grind of a gouge or scraper.

like I said earlier - I use 120 grit wheels for sharpening.


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## kovalcik (Mar 22, 2012)

"The only club I know of doesn't meet at a convenient time for me. 		"

Pardon my saying but this sounds a little like a cop out.  Learning to sharpen your tools is THE most important skill you need for wood turning. Second is making sure you are using the tool correctly. You don't need to go to every meeting.  If you cannot find the time to go to even one meeting, email the club and ask if some of the members are willing to help outside the meetings.  I have yet to meet the woodworker who does not want to share skills and knowledge.  Other resources to look at are your local Woodcraft if you have one, the shop teacher at the high school, or if there is woodworking school near you.  

Whatever you do, find some way to learn to sharpen and use your tools properly.  It will make the biggest difference in the quality of your work and could be the difference in sticking with it or abandoning the hobby.  I know first hand.  I gave up turning for many years until I took a class and finally learned how to sharpen and use my chisels the right way.


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## KenV (Mar 22, 2012)

Gil -- there are two AAW chapters for Tucson - acknowledged that one is more general woodworking oriented, but a Saturday Morning once a month should be practical once a while.  

Woodcraft has basic classes at the store up on Oracle and does include teaching sharpening.  

There are some member in the Southern Arizona Woodturners Association who will provide teaching/mentoring for a nominal sum.   A couple are retired and are probably pretty flexible on schedules.

SAZWA Home Page


Ken -- who sno birds in Tucson and attends meetings as a guest


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## TerryDowning (Mar 22, 2012)

The only advice I give on sharpening any more is this.

Experiment and find what works best for you, stick with it and master it. Only you can evaluate the many factors involved in sharpening. Time, money, quality of finish, etc.

for my my hand powered bench chisels and plane irons, I shape, and hone to hair splitting, ribbon shaving mirror finish sharpness by hand, because the edges last a lot longer and the result on my end product is worth the effort.

for my lathe chisels I use a strip sander for shaping and initial grind and then go to a medium grit hone by hand. I put a mirror finish on a lathe chisel once.  After 2 passes the mirror finish was gone and I soon realized the effort was not worth it, compared to a plane iron or bench chisel, the edge of a lathe chisel will just never last.

for my my lawn mower, I sharpen it with a file or a grinder if it's really bad.


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## moke (Mar 22, 2012)

Mike--Gil
First off let me tell you I am certainly no expert at sharpening and probably shouldn't be giving advice, BUT I'll tell you my experience. 

I have two slow speed and two reg speed grinders and a HF buffer. I have more sharpening jigs than most stores, no one to mentor me even though I have looked extensively. I quit trying used a couple of woodchucks for better than a year. While those are awesome tools, they are certainly complimented by conventional tools too. So about a year ago I started a quest to learn this or give up all together. For Christmas I gave everyone a "list" that just had turning and sharpening DVD's. Since that time I think I have done a lot better. I now have about 5 DVD's that talk about sharpening and one that is exclusive for sharpening. They are for the most part, all very different methods. Most do not use jigs at all, so that made it even more difficult to grasp. The one thing I can say that made the biggest difference is that most of them talk about honing. Honing is step after sharpening. I have repurposed a HF buffer with some home-made mdf 4.5 inch wheels. I "hone" my newly sharpened tools and it makes a substantial difference. It refines the edge...then I hone one more time after usage and before re-sharpening the next time. I had to turn the buffer around..the hone has to run "backwards" but it really does help.  It is similar to the "old time" barbers that used a leather strap to hone there strait razors.


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## TerryDowning (Mar 22, 2012)

Sharpening comes in 4 stages
Shaping (getting the basic angle and geometry of the edge) Usually done with a grinder or files and usually only once in a blades life (Unless you want to change the geometry)
Sharpening (Getting the edge sharp enough to actually cut something with)
Honing refining the edge to increase the quality of the cut.
Stropping (That final mirror finish that produces the best possible cuts) This fills the proes of the metal and creates a slick surface for the edge to glide through what it is cutting.

Barbers would spend quite a bit of time on the honing and stropping then maintain the edge with stopping throughout the day.

I will strop my plane irons and bench chisels with leather and buffing compound. My lathe chisels I just stop at at a 1600 grit oil stone honing. I maintain the edge of these with a pocket diamond file or 800/1600 grit oil stone depending on blade condition. It usually only takes a few seconds with the diamond file to maintain the edge. If I'm not happy then back to the bench stones for a minute or two. If the material is abrasive or especially hard on tools (dymond wood/color grain and other laminates, the glue really wears the edges, I will put it against my strip sander set at the correct angle and just go with that) 

When using power tools to sharpen, care must taken not to overheat the metal.


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## Gilrock (Mar 22, 2012)

kovalcik said:


> "The only club I know of doesn't meet at a convenient time for me.         "
> 
> Pardon my saying but this sounds a little like a cop out.


 
Well if I do make it to the local club...its not going to be because I don't think I can sharpen my tools.  I actually think I do a pretty good job...but I strive for perfection.  And I was trying to save everyone a wall of text about how busy I am with that one simple sentence.


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## jd99 (Mar 22, 2012)

Boy I didn't know sharpening was such a touchy subject here. 

I am not the a profesional sharpener (unless you want to talk end mills for metal cutting), but I found the wolverine jigs really improved my skils, and I had better repeatibility.
:biggrin:

Good luck


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## glycerine (Mar 22, 2012)

moke said:
			
		

> Mike--Gil
> First off let me tell you I am certainly no expert at sharpening and probably shouldn't be giving advice, BUT I'll tell you my experience.
> 
> I have two slow speed and two reg speed grinders and a HF buffer. I have more sharpening jigs than most stores, no one to mentor me even though I have looked extensively. I quit trying used a couple of woodchucks for better than a year. While those are awesome tools, they are certainly complimented by conventional tools too. So about a year ago I started a quest to learn this or give up all together. For Christmas I gave everyone a "list" that just had turning and sharpening DVD's. Since that time I think I have done a lot better. I now have about 5 DVD's that talk about sharpening and one that is exclusive for sharpening. They are for the most part, all very different methods. Most do not use jigs at all, so that made it even more difficult to grasp. The one thing I can say that made the biggest difference is that most of them talk about honing. Honing is step after sharpening. I have repurposed a HF buffer with some home-made mdf 4.5 inch wheels. I "hone" my newly sharpened tools and it makes a substantial difference. It refines the edge...then I hone one more time after usage and before re-sharpening the next time. I had to turn the buffer around..the hone has to run "backwards" but it really does help.  It is similar to the "old time" barbers that used a leather strap to hone there strait razors.



I'm curious about the honing, do you wrap something around the mdf wheels?  How does that work, I'd like to hear the process if you'll share, not trying to hijack the thread...


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## stolicky (Mar 22, 2012)

mdwilliams999 said:


> I have gotten by for a year using my neighbors 8" grinding wheel for sharpening my chisels.  He has a Delta variable speed *' with a white stone (not sure of the grit) and fine grey stone (don't know the grit).  He also invested in a sharpening system (V pocket jig and grinding platform).  Over all he has somewhere between $300-$400 invested.  Overall, I find it to be adequate but certainly not impressed.  I will admit that much of it could be me (or my neighbor) not doing it all right.  Bottom line - not happy with the final results.  The chisels are sharp but not that sharp.  Cutting wood is fine but stone and acrylic is just about impossible.  I am using a carbide tip for those and works fine, but I really need sharper chisels.
> 
> I have a woodworking show coming up in 2 weeks and I know from past years that it can be a good opportunity for buying sharpening systems.  I have been looking at the smaller Tormek, Penn State Sharpening System, Wolverine, Sorby etc.  They all can get expensive quick, but I need something that will do the job and doesn't take a lifetime to master.  Afterall, I want to turn pens, bowls etc. not be a master chisel sharpener.
> 
> ...



Mike,
I have been through quite a learning curve when it comes to sharpening.  I started with the Delta vs grinder with the Penn State jigs.  While the grinder is decent, the jigs were very lacking.That grinder is mostly relegated to metal grinding now.

Over the past few years, I invested in the Tormek T7 and also the Woodcraft slow speed grinder with the Wolverine jigs.  The Woodcraft grinder with the Wolverine system will work for everything you need, but it can be challenging to learn how to sharpening some tools.  Its all about the light touch.  As far as turning, I pretty much use the Tormek on spindle gouges and skews.  I sharpening bowl gouges and scrapers on the grinder because it is so fast and easy.  One thing I do not like is the mess from the dry grinder.  Contrary to some comments, the Tormek is a lot less messy!

I don't know if you have attended an AWA meeting yet, but if not, I recommend it.  It is the perfect place to ask questions and get some hands on experience.  The club officially meets on most first Wednesdays of the month.  There are many other times members get together.  Inquire at the Showcase/Totally Turning and you can get all the details.  Some people will be there turning.  We might bump into each other - I'll be the one (about half the age of most turners there) carrying around a camera snapping pics of the show.  Maybe we'll see each other.


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## Ulises Victoria (Mar 22, 2012)

Not trying to hijack the thread, but has somebody had any experience with this machine?

Amazon.com: Work Sharp WS3000 Wood Tool Sharpener: Home Improvement

Thank you.


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## andrewleeheck (Mar 23, 2012)

"Not trying to hijack the thread, but has somebody had any experience with this machine?

Amazon.com: Work Sharp WS3000 Wood Tool Sharpener: Home Improvement"

I got this a few weeks ago and it changed my turning for the better.  Easy to learn and use.  Tip: invest in the tool bar attachment, as it allows you to use the Tormek jigs.  Don't be afraid to play around with the adjustments to make it fit your particular needs.  

Andrew


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## jd99 (Mar 23, 2012)

Ulises Victoria said:


> Not trying to hijack the thread, but has somebody had any experience with this machine?
> 
> Amazon.com: Work Sharp WS3000 Wood Tool Sharpener: Home Improvement
> 
> Thank you.


I have one, but I havent had to use it for the lathe tools yet.
Works great on my other wood working tools (Scary Sharp).


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## Ulises Victoria (Mar 23, 2012)

Thanks guys. My concern was that in the videos I saw it seems too much oriented towards flat planes and blades, not the rounded shapes we mostly use in penturning. Sharpening, or better, learning how to sharpen my tools has became a major issue for me.


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## moke (Mar 24, 2012)

glycerine said:


> moke said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
Jeremy,
Sorry I have been gone a couple of days for work....the honing is two 4.5 inch 3/4 wheels mounted on rhe arbor of an 8" HF buffer.  That's it.  It has to run backwards fromwhat a normal grinder does, so I have just turned the grinder around so the on-off is in the back side.  It is a 3400 rpm unit, so in a previous thread I asked about it and it was suggested that I use 4.5" wheels to aproximate the speed of an 8" wheel at 1750 rpm.  

After I sharpen, I just hand-hold the tool on the honing wheel and it puts a polish or final finish on the edge.....This is not my idea, I got it from a DVD on turning.  It works good, after the tool dulls a little, I re-hone and go back to turning once, then re-sharpen, hone etc...

It is fairly quick, and effortless.  There are many DVD's that mention honing with a diamond file or stone...the extra fine I believe...I just had the buffer and wanted to experiment.  

I would like to hear more about stropping some time that sounds interesting too...


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## glycerine (Mar 24, 2012)

Thanks Mike!


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