# I Can't Afford to But 2 Lathes!!!



## T53C (Apr 24, 2012)

Hi there and hope ya’ll are doing ok! 


Ok now…here’s my dilemma…I’m a dreamer and for those who have read my earlier posts now know I’ve been toying around with the idea of retiring in a few and don’t want to come home to twiddle my thumbs, and so, turning pens and small items on a Mini or Midi will be the order of the day! 


Presently, I can’t afford a lathe right now because of too many “Irons” in the fire, but I want to start preparing for this eventuality by gathering some turning tools leading up to that “Big” all important purchase…the lathe! :redface:


I don’t want to buy a lathe twice because of making a wrong choice, and chew on this…since I live on the island :island:, I would have to pay the initial cost, freight, insurance plus at least 45% customs duty…and so the wiser the choice would put me over the top. 


I will set my budget at $1000 to start this venture, and will now start saving up now! 

And so, if you were me, what would it be a Jet, a Rikon, a Delta, a Turncrafter Commander or none of these! Also, I can’t afford a hobby although it may start out this way…I wish to make ends meet from this venture. :musical-note:

So help me out here with a choice that will do me justice…hint, hint…I’m leaning toward a Delta 46-460 but for those of you who have the experience in these matters, please set me straight as to the “Pros” & “Cons” on all these lathes etc. 

Oh BTW…I should also mention that GrantH provided me with a great list of tools I should get for starters…thank you Grant! :handshake: 
In the meanwhile I will continue my quest for knowledge on Pen Turning etc! :glasses-nerdy:


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## 76winger (Apr 24, 2012)

The Delta has got a lot of good reviews here, but then so has the Jets. To get it off my chest, the first think in my mind is if you can't afford one now, how are you going to afford one later after you retire? You'll find a lot more threads of everyone talking about how you don't make tons of money making and selling pens (with a few exceptions). And if you haven't done any turning yet, how do you know your going to like it for the long haul once you retire and go at it all the time? 

My first recommendation would be to look around for a used one, of what ever brand, that works good and try turning for a while to verify you really do like it before sinking a lot of money into a good one for the long haul. If you like it and get a good one, then you have the other to use for a backup, or "polishing lathe" while the new one gets used for the grunt work of turning. And if you decide you don't like it, then you've got less invested in the used one and it will be easier to sell for what you spent rather than at a loss.

I welcome to you to pen turning and wish you the best! But as with any new venture I'd recommend entering slow and cautious before diving in completely. It just reduced the burn factor if something doesn't work out and you have cancel your plans. 

Good luck!


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## The Penguin (Apr 24, 2012)

definitely keep an eye on craigslist in the USA is you have someone in a town that can go make a purchase for you. I've scored 2 new/used lathes that way recently.

and if you're getting into this "hobby" (obsession) hoping to "make ends meet" - you might need to reconsider. :biggrin:


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## monty8867 (Apr 24, 2012)

*Jet 1220*

New to turning myself. Started last September with a Jet 1220. After the fact I was looking at specs for the woodcrafter lathe. Seems to be a Jet clone. A guy came to our wood turners club to do a demo and brought a Woodcrafter. Didn't get a lot of time to look at it but it seemed solid. everything lined up well. Seemed to work very well for what he was doing. 
With your budget and added costs the Woodcrafter may be your only choice. Don't be scared of changing the belt to change the speed. Not quite as easy as a dial but the mini and Midi lathes with variable speed still require you to change belts, just not as often. They do offer variable speed through a range. 
I am actually looking at the 10 inch Woodcrafter, non V/S, as a second lathe.
BTW I got into penturning for the same reason, I am going to retire in 5 to 6 years. It all depends on heath care and Medicare.


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## thewishman (Apr 24, 2012)

Started with a Jet 1014. Moved up to a Delta 46-460 and LOVE it.


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## plantman (Apr 24, 2012)

Tony: Let me throw you a little curve on lathes. I have been using a Taig Micro Metal Lathe for over 25 years, and I bought it used from a miniture maker that made items for museums and high end clients. Why a metal lathe? Small, tabletop, lightweight, inexpensive, accurate to + or - 10,000th of an inch and, will give you a perfect straight line cut. A metal lathe will do anything a wood lathe can do plus a lot more. My main tools are the high speed cutters held in the tool post, and fine metal files used for finishing, Micro sanders to 12,000 grit. I do have mini lathe tools as well as full size tools if I want to do something fancy. In all the years I have had this lathe, the only thing I have replaced was the belt that came with it. All parts can still be obtained from the manufactuer for a very low price. ( sales@TaigTools.com). There are so many advantages to a mini metal lathe, I may have to write an article about it. Check my pens under "plantman" in photo section. Jim S
P.S. If you want me to come down for a week or two this winter to give you some tips, let me know!


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## T53C (Apr 25, 2012)

Hi Guys…and thanks for your prized insight!!!!

I don’t know if you folks have ever read this biblical verse from Proverbs 11:14 which reads; “When there is no skillful direction, the people fall; but there is salvation in the multitude of counselors.”

No truer words have been spoken, and from you Guys here at IAP I must say that you are simply one of those “the multitude of counselors.”
With that said I would like to say to Dave ALL your points are well said and will be taken into account…but have been talking to my Wife? LOL sounds awfully familiar.

And now to Jim S. (Plantman) are you talking about this micro lathe below…

View attachment 74521


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## PedroDelgado (Apr 25, 2012)

Try Harbor Freight.


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## OOPS (Apr 25, 2012)

I was paralyzed with fear when making a decision to purchase my first lathe.  I too "didn't want to make the wrong decision the first time," and this led me to making no decision at all.  I finally decided to purchase a Harbor Freight lathe, which many at the time looked upon with derision.  I decided that if I didn't like pen turning, I could always get a portion of my money back, and the lathe was only $110.  As it turns out, my Harbor Freight lathe is a fine lathe, and the tool snobs who paid 5 times the money for their lathe can talk all they want.  In the end, you will find that there are plenty of uses for a second lathe, so don't worry about making a mistake on a first purchase.  You can get all kinds of advice on this site.  I would say a majority of turners really like a lathe with a variable speed control.  I know I would never have a lathe without it.  

My brother has a Jet and a Rikon.  He likes them both.  I know other turners who own the Delta and are very happy.  I don't know any Turncrafter owners.  There have been quality control issues over the years with that unit, judging from what I have read here.  I don't know if the problems have been solved.  

Hope this helps.


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## joefrog (Apr 25, 2012)

I'm new at this as well -- I decided I didn't need anything huge or with an exceedingly long bed, mainly due to space limitations.  I went with something that I can expand the bed on later if need be (via an extension), and has enough bells & whistles to do the things I can do NOW, as well as most of the things I want to do later.  

I went with the Delta 46-460 and LOVE it.  Easy speed change belts, variable speed, good power, and reversible.  

I only have a few actual turning tools, but I did splurge and got the Nova G3 chuck set from Woodcraft.com when it was on sale (it does go on sale periodically).  It came with three or four sets of jaws for a variety of things I haven't even done yet.

It's fun, it's relaxing... and I'm learning a LOT.


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## Knucklefish (Apr 25, 2012)

First lathe was a Jet 1014. Sold that about a year later and moved one notch up to the Jet 1220VS. Should have started with a 1220VS so I could turn larger bowls.


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## warthog (Apr 25, 2012)

I have the Turncrafter Commander...I love this lathe. I think the most important part is to buy the very best one you can afford and get real familiar with it. If you scrimp when you do finally lay down the mopney for one...you'll live to regret it.


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## AnachitlPut (Apr 25, 2012)

Don't buy any thing less then a Jett or the delta. The rikons are crap and don't even try psi. Delta has the est deal. It's way better then the jet plus it's will last longer and it's cheaper.


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## Justturnin (Apr 25, 2012)

I am not sure you can go wrong with any of the lathes you mentioned.  I would say the number one thing you should look for would be Variable Speed.  If you can find one that is Reversible that is a huge plus for sanding bowls and such.

Mentioned above was a Metal Lathe.  The only draw back I can think of on that is size.  If your sole purpose is to turn Pens, bottlestoppers and other small items then it is fine, but if you want to make a bowl you will be limited by the 7" or 9" swing.  Larger than that and you blew your $1k out of the water.

I use a Rikon 70-100 Variable Speed and love it.  I picked it up used from the classifieds here.  It has a 12" swing that I have yet to take advantage of and also I can pick up bed extensions for about $150 and make it twice a long, not that I need it now but if I do its an option.  There is really no reason to buy new unless you know what you want and cant find a used one.

As for brand, only take advise from folks that have owned what they are talking about.  It is easy to fall into the whole 'Chevy or Ford' argument but you will find that most that do have never owned both.

Just my $.02.  This is a great hobby but the learning curve can be  great.  Those great finishes you see don't just happen, there is a lot  of trial and error.

Good luck and I hope to see some work from you one day.


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## BSea (Apr 25, 2012)

I have the Delta 46-460.  But I wouldn't turn down the jet 1220VS.  they  are just about the same IMHO.  The Delta does have a reverse feature,  but I've hardly used that, and could get by without that for sure.  For me, the VS is something I wouldn't want to do without.  Even with changing the belts from time to time.


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## jjjaworski (Apr 25, 2012)

My first lathe was a Oneway 1224 since I wanted something for bowl work. I've had it for 10 plus years and have done all sorts of work on it.

My next lathe was a Jet 1014 . I picked up a Klein micro lathe from a retiring woodturner a few years back and just got a Rikon 70-100 Variable Speed lathe. I've yet to fire up the Rikon but it will work for what I have in mind, small work to free up the Oneway.

You might consider joining or visiting a local woodturning club to pick some more brains and possibly get a hands on on some of the lathes available. Search the American Association of Woodturner's website for local chapters.

Jim


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## bobjackson (Apr 25, 2012)

I've used a Jet 1014 for 10 years and still use it as my #1 pen lathe. I have a Harbor freight mini I use for polymer clay pens and some finish work also.


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## moke (Apr 25, 2012)

I have both a Delta 46-460 with extension and stand  and a little Rikon 70-050. I started with an Excelsior. Don't start there...make sure that whatever you buy is MT2.

I think the Delta is the best lathe I have ever turned on, but if cash is an issue, you may consider Rikon. I disagree with what was said about the Rikon, I have have good luck with it.  It is no Delta or Powercraft, but it doesn't cost as much either.

Don't leap just yet, watch some of the sites, specifically Woodcraft, the sales are great. Then spend the bulk of your monies on the attachments that will take you to doing better things....chucks, turning tools, calipers...etc.

Then if you get to the point where you can sell a few pens, or have saved a few more sheckles, spring for a Delta. Then use the Rikon as a second lathe for buffing or drilling, etc....

Just my .02


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## PenMan1 (Apr 25, 2012)

I am in complete agreement with Moke. I own a Delta 46-460, Jet 1014 VSI and did have the little Ricon variable speed lathe. The Ricon is not in the same class as the Jet or the Delta, BUT it has the important things such as 1x8 headscrew, MT2 tapers on the head and tail.

MOST IMPORTANTLY, the little Ricon is frequently on sale. I bought mine new on a Woodcraft sale for $149 (some time ago). Just recently Woodcraft had the Ricon on sale for $199 and free shipping.

My advice would be to get the Ricon the next time they offer it for $199. It has plenty of quality to make a few pens for sale. Then, with some pen sales under your belt, you could buy the Delta (all of the Ricon accessories will fit both the Delta and Jet) and turn the Ricon into a buffing or drilling station.

The SOONER you can start selling, the sooner you can start putting away a little money.

Just my 2 cents worth.


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## PenMan1 (Apr 25, 2012)

I would stay away from the Grizzly, Harbor Freight, Excelsor, Turcrafter and CarbaTec wood lathes. Many of these lathes have "known" issues and in many cases parts availability is a serious issue.

The last thing you want to do is to buy a cheap lathe and spend more money on parts, adapters, etc that you would have spent by buying a quality lathe in the beginning.


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## KenV (Apr 25, 2012)

Will add an insight --  power supply and voltage.   The small DC motor variable speed drives are very tolerant of power fluctuations, smaller voltage differences, and differences in hertz.   By small I mean that they will run on 100 volts, 110 volts, 120 volts with some loss of power, but generally acceptable performance -- loss of torque and power happens especially at low end of motor speed - so that is where the "generally" comes to play.


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## MattTheHat (Apr 25, 2012)

I'll throw another curve in...

If it were me and I could only have a single lathe, I'd be looking for some flavor of the Seig C4. It's a metal lathe, approximately 8" x 15" or so. Depending on which supplier you choose, they are available with variable speed, which as other have suggested is indeed very nice. 

To that I would add a quick change tool post and an assortment of holders. You could use one of the cutting tool holders clamp down on a piece of round steel that you turned with the lathe, and that would be used  as a tool rest for use with wood turning tools. 

You'd get the best of both worlds--a capable metal lathe on which to do threading and other things that can't easily be done on a wood lathe--and with the shop-made tool rest, could also be used as an (almost) midi-sized wood lathe. 

-Matt


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## plantman (Apr 25, 2012)

Tony: Plantman here. Can not open your attachment to see if we are looking at the same lathe. I suggest you go to the web site and get a detailed look at it with all the specks and prices. I should have also mentioned that I use a 15 inch Harbor Freight wood lathe ( $109.00 ) for drilling and turning pen blanks and bigger objects, and a Shop Smith for turning larger items.   Jim S


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## trooperjd (Apr 25, 2012)

I have a 70-100 Rikon and it has been flawless with heavy use for over a year.  Rikon recently upgraded their warranty to 5 years.  They also have variable speed models and sell upgrade kits for those not variable speed.  My friend has a Jet mini and we have compared our lathes.  My Rikon is a tad bit larger in size, but we both agree access to the belt and changing speeds are a little quicker with the Rikon.  My Rikon is not as quiet as the Jet but not much difference.  These are my personal experiences and observations.  Good luck.


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## wolftat (Apr 25, 2012)

I own 3 Rikon 70-100s, one has the variable speed conversion and is my main lathe, I also own a delta 46-460 and if I was forced to get rid of a machine, my Delta would be the one that would be gone.


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## PenMan1 (Apr 25, 2012)

wolftat said:


> I own 3 Rikon 70-100s, one has the variable speed conversion and is my main lathe, I also own a delta 46-460 and if I was forced to get rid of a machine, my Delta would be the one that would be gone.



Wow! This just shows how much a "personal thing" lathe selection really is!
I had a Ricon, Jet 1014 VSI and a Delta 46-460. I only have room for two lathes, so I had to make the "hard decision".

For me, it came down to selling the Ricon. Simply because of where it lived made it very difficult to change belt positions (my Ricon VSI had the belt change door in the rear, making it impossible to put it up against the wall).

All three lathes were excellent lathes, the Delta and Jet just met my needs better.


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## T53C (Apr 25, 2012)

Hi all...Man I did not expect this type of "Fire Storm"...but this is what I was looking for minus the "Bias"...but I have to add that if you have experience in these lathes or others...Be My Guess and "swing-away"!!! Thanks once more for all this input and insight!!!

To Plantman, see if this link below works!!!

Taig Tools - Desktop Milling Machines and Lathes.


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## Gilrock (Apr 25, 2012)

Yeah I guess I don't know what I'm missing because I started with the Rikon 70-100 and other than not having VS I've thought the lathe was great.  I recently got a metal lathe the Jet 9x20 but for most of my pen making activities I prefer to use the Rikon.  The metal lathe is nice for making a consistent diameter tenon but for typical penturning I find the cross slide is hard to get out of the way so I like using the wood lathe.  Woodcraft has the Rikon 70-100 with the VS conversion already installed for $280 right now.  I would buy that if you can.


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## mrcook4570 (Apr 25, 2012)

Your $1000 budget is probably a bit on the low side.  You will find that the lathe will be the least expensive investment in turning.  All of the tooling and accessories will add up to much more than you realized.


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## Rfturner (Apr 27, 2012)

I own an older model of the turncrafter comander. It has been a great lathe hundreds of hours BUT if i had to do it over i would go with the Jet. I have used several lathes and there is a difference in quality. There is an old saying Buy once Cry Once. I wish i would have waited a little longer for the Jet. That is not to say that i have not made some nice pens on the Turncrafter. one of the advantages of the jet was that it is more manageable to move by myself. It has slightly smoother operation and better craftsman ship. 

WARNING: 
What ever you think it will cost triple it and you'll be in the ball park for what the hobby will cost you. If you are looking at a $1000 start up expect it will be around $2-3000 because there will be tools and such that you will deem neccessary to better achieve faster production. Just saying from experience, Good luck on your ventures welcome to the woodworking vortex


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## plantman (Apr 27, 2012)

Hi Tony: Plantman here again. Thats it!! When you go to the web site they have a 5 page parts and information list you can print out. You can also add a milling attachment and power feed to this unit. Penn State Industries offers a screw on precision headstock mandrel for turning pens, part # PKM-AL $17.95, that includes a 3/4 x 16tpi attachment, mandrel shaft, a FREE 7mm drill bit, knurled brass nut, and 5 bushings.   Jim S


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## TerryDowning (Apr 27, 2012)

I've been keeping out of this as I don't have any of the lathes on the poll list.

Thought I'd throw in a plug for the Shopsmith.  I love mine.  It has almost all of the tools I need for the entire shop.  While a new one is way out of your price range, used ones often with quite a few attachments and accessories are definitely doable.  Of course this depends on what you are looking for in terms of equipping your shop.  If it's small lathe work only, then a decent midi lathe is the way to go.

Just my .02 dollars on the subject.

Terry


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## nava1uni (Apr 27, 2012)

I have to disagree with the negative statement about Rikon.I have a midi Rikon 70-100 and have used it very hard for the last 5 years.  It is a work horse.  The only thing that I have had to do is replace the belt due to my own in experience when I first bought it.  I can turn up to 10 " bowls with little vibration.  The belt is easy to change and takes only a few seconds so I don't miss not have a dial variable speed.  It is a solid piece of equipment with great customer service.  I also have a Rikon band saw and drill press that are all great tools.  I also have a Jet 1014 with a dial variable speed and I still use the Rikon more as it is a heavier tool.


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## Richard Earl (Apr 28, 2012)

There is so much information already here I am not sure I can add more, however... If you are only turning pens then you don't need a large lathe. I started with a Jet 10x14 and only went up to a Jet 12x20 because I started turning bowls. But that led to wanting to turn even larger bowls and I now have a Nova DVR XP. So if you want to keep cost down don't start turning bowls. 

On the money side you can, if want the hassle of craft shows, possibly break even, at least in terms of the cost of materials. You might get back your investment in equipment if you keep it very simple. But, for me, it's a hobby and I am retired. I don't expect a hobby to turn a profit. Compared to what bass fishing cost me, including a boat and storage, this hobby is free. I figure I am paying for the enjoyment and for that you often have to pay extra.


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## Wright (Apr 28, 2012)

I'm new to pen turning as well. I bought the Delta 46-460 and I love this lathe. I thought about the Jet lathe but decided on the Delta. Hope you have as much fun as I do learning how to make pens!  Good Luck


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