# Where to start?



## jokker78 (Mar 4, 2020)

I'm sure this dead horse has been beat to death.
But when starting to make your own blanks, pen, bowl stoppers. How much is the normal start up cost?


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## Kenny Durrant (Mar 4, 2020)

That's a pretty open question. It depends on what blanks are you looking for. Do you want to cast or stabilize? Sometimes they overlap. I guess these are the two main routes after cutting bulk wood into smaller pieces. Stabilizing you will need a vacuum chamber and pump. Cactus Juice or some sort of penetrating liquid. An oven and thermometer. Casting you'll need a pressure pot, air compressor, resin, and molds. There's probably a lot more but I'm thinking these are the big items.


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## mredburn (Mar 4, 2020)

it can be pretty cheap if you dont want fancy, poly resins like silmar41 are cheap and you can pour them in 5- 6in pvc pipe. A couple small packs of mica or dye and you can have some color.  You  could start under a $100 petty easy.  There are small quantity 2 part epoxy systems that work but you need better molds or they wont come out and probably a pressure pot.   There are 100s of colors of mica by different sources. Dyes from the resin seller as well as soap dyes etc.  Non water based is essential as it doesnt play well with the resins.  
Your really asking "how deep is this hole?"  as deep as you make it.   Paint pots to use as a pressure pot $100 for a small HF one or buy used off Marketplace or craigslist if you can. $250 for a dedicated 5 gallon pot for casting.  You can easily drop a few hundred into this just starting.


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## Dehn0045 (Mar 4, 2020)

Low end for stabilizing is about $75 plus the cost of resin/dyes (pickle jar vacuum chamber, cheap rotary vane pump, hoses/fittings).  On the high end you could probably spend a billion dollars.


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## jokker78 (Mar 5, 2020)

With the vacuum pump, can it be the same kind that you would pull a vacuum on an AC system? 
So I guess I'd like to do both stabilizing and casting. Two different approaches.
Do you use the same pot for both ?


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## Dehn0045 (Mar 5, 2020)

Yes. Yes. Depends.  I've heard that some people use a paint pot as a vacuum chamber, but I wouldn't recommend it.  It is best to be able to see what is happening while pulling vacuum during stabilizing, so a paint pot is not ideal.  There are many different styles of stabilizing chambers, but I think the pickle jar style is the cheapest because it is basically free if you like pickles.  Some of the other styles are easier to use for larger blanks and such, but they are substantially more expensive.

There are a lot of threads on paint pots for casting.   I'd say a paint pot is essentially for doing good casting, there are methods to get acceptable results without one but it is rather limited   There are basically two options - cheap and not certified pots from harbor freight or similar and the ASME certified that are about 5x the cost.


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## RobS (Mar 5, 2020)

Stabilizing, turn key set up:
Cactus juice 1 gal $90
Cactus juice chamber diameter 6 x 12" tall $209  https://www.turntex.com/juiceproof-stabilizing-chamber6x12-detail
Vacpump made in USA: JB Eliminator® Refrig Evacuation Pump, 4.0 cfm, 6 ft. $296 








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Casting Alumilite
$180 2 gals from w/ shipping https://www.turntex.com/alumilite-clear-slow16-lb-kit-detail
$casting powders $128 https://ptownsubbie.com/collections...ders/products/casters-choice-mica-powders-set
casting pressure pot $250 https://www.woodcraft.com/products/...-casting-california-air-tools#details-section
air compressor
molds: https://ptownsubbie.com/collections/blank-molds sky is the limit, very well made.  I would recomend getting at least one of their hdpe molds.  I also like their HDPE rack https://ptownsubbie.com/collections/mold-rack-systems if anything spills on it, it peels off.
I also use pvc pipe with rubber caps for bottle stoppers, shave brushes etc
don't forget mold release $20

their are corners to cut and cheaper ways, this is what I did.  I work full time, and I started with stabilizing at 1 yr, and added casting on my 3rd year.
Good luck


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## ctfolmar (Mar 5, 2020)

I just started doing the same thing. I probably have $300, or a little more in my set-up. 
There are a number of videos on YouTube on how to convert a junk refrigerator compressor into a vacuum pump.  It looks very easy and is dirt cheap. But I already had a vacuum pump for doing a/c work. It has been working great. You can get a similar vacuum pump from Amazon for around $200, maybe less.
I use a 1/2 gallon wide-mouth mason jar I bought from hobby lobby as my vacuum chamber. Youtube has videos on how to use a cookie jar. I plan to do that eventually, but the mason jar is working well for now. The only problem with the mason jar is that I can't get my hand in it. I use a quart size wide-mouth mason to vacuum my silicone before I pour it in a mold.
I have had a few failures and some that have turned out quite nice. Generally I find it quite enjoyable and I feel it has been well-worth the investment. Who knows, maybe one day I'll make some money doing it.


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## ctfolmar (Mar 5, 2020)

I just started doing the same thing. I probably have $300, or a little more in my set-up.
There are a number of videos on YouTube on how to convert a junk refrigerator compressor into a vacuum pump.  It looks very easy and is dirt cheap. But I already had a vacuum pump for doing a/c work. It has been working great. You can get a similar vacuum pump from Amazon for around $200, maybe less.
I use a 1/2 gallon wide-mouth mason jar I bought from hobby lobby as my vacuum chamber. Youtube has videos on how to use a cookie jar. I plan to do that eventually, but the mason jar is working well for now. The only problem with the mason jar is that I can't get my hand in it. I use a quart size wide-mouth mason to vacuum my silicone before I pour it in a mold.
I have had a few failures and some that have turned out quite nice. Generally I find it quite enjoyable and I feel it has been well-worth the investment. Who knows, maybe one day I'll make some money doing it.


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## FGarbrecht (Mar 5, 2020)

For stabiliizing I got a cheap HF vacuum pump and stole a pot from the kitchen.  I used a piece of 3/4 inch clear acrylic as the top and drilled it for the vac tube and a pressure gauge.  Used some RTV red gasket stuff to seal it.  Works great.  Probably around $130

For pressure casting I got a HF paint pot and made the modifications recommended on various youtube videos and hooked up an 8gal HF compressor.  Loud as hell but it works.  Also around the $130 range.


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## howsitwork (Mar 5, 2020)

To return the the original question.

How observant is your partner? How deep are your pockets ? Who pays the credit card bill? How many hiding. ( sorry storage spacers which are not directly observable) do you have ?

Then it comes down to what level of sophistication do you 2ant and the above answers become relevant.

What value do you place on fun?


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## ctfolmar (Mar 5, 2020)

I use a pressure paint pot I found on Amazon for Alumilite blanks. It cost a little bit less than the HF pot and has an 80 psi working range. I had to change out the pressure relief valve because the one it came with was set for about 35-40 psi.  I already had a compressor. Here's a video on the vacuum pump. 



,


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## jokker78 (Mar 7, 2020)

howsitwork said:


> To return the the original question.
> 
> How observant is your partner? How deep are your pockets ? Who pays the credit card bill? How many hiding. ( sorry storage spacers which are not directly observable) do you have ?
> 
> ...


I've got an account of she money ( money she doesn't know )
She is observent. 
I'm thinking about pulling the trigger on the Sorby sharpen system at the moment


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## wolf creek knives (Mar 8, 2020)

howsitwork said:


> To return the the original question.
> 
> How observant is your partner? How deep are your pockets ? Who pays the credit card bill? How many hiding. ( sorry storage spacers which are not directly observable) do you have ?
> 
> ...



  I took a "loan" from the family budget and have repaid it back as I sell my items.  My small business is self sustaining now and is run outside the family budget.  I put all my purchases on the family credit card that gives us air miles in return and pay off my share each month from my business checking account.  I have my own set of books that are my responsibility to maintain.  At tax time my business is wrapped into the family tax return and our accountant sends us the needed paperwork to fill out for each filing year.  Our accountant won't be happy this year, I was profitable when it's all said and done for 2019.  My business is my business and my wife never challenges what I do with it, but I do ask her advice a lot and she is great at getting deals so a lot of time I'll ask her to do my shopping for some items. i.e. tools, band saw blades, plastic bags, business cards etc.  I actually don't hide anything from her, like I said, it's my business literally.  She has her own business making and selling greeting cards and it's treated the same way as my business.  
A bit long winded but I hope I at least answered the questions above.


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## howsitwork (Mar 10, 2020)

I can’t claim , Tom ,  to be even vaguely “self financing “ but it makes me happy making things. 

On that basis my good Lady is quite happy ( as far as I know and I’m not going to rock the boat by suggesting otherwise to her) as it gives her lots of good ideas for presents for me! Although I do admit to sometimes buying it myself and there just could be a small amount of inaccuracy in the costings given . 

Ive never asked her to buy bandsaw blades for me though so that’s an idea

For what to worth  - the above ideas are all great but it comes down, for me anyway, to what value you put on fun? I would suggest going along to a club and trying the hobby out then seeing what you ENJOY using vs what does the job and weighing it  up.

As , over here we may soon be “self isolating “for 2 weeks  if we get a cold or sniffle , I am claiming to be laying in supplies just in case !! Wife is a nurse so sympathy doesn’t come into the equation , that’s reserved for patients.


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## jokker78 (Mar 10, 2020)

howsitwork said:


> I can’t claim , Tom ,  to be even vaguely “self financing “ but it makes me happy making things.
> 
> On that basis my good Lady is quite happy ( as far as I know and I’m not going to rock the boat by suggesting otherwise to her) as it gives her lots of good ideas for presents for me! Although I do admit to sometimes buying it myself and there just could be a small amount of inaccuracy in the costings given .
> 
> ...


Sympathy can be found in the dictionary between **** and syphilis.


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## ramaroodle (Mar 11, 2020)

*Robs's excellent list on the cheap to see if you like doing it. The only thing I bought new was the Harbor Freight pressure pot.* 
Stabilizing, turn key set up:
Cactus juice 1 gal $90   *Start with a quart  $30*
Cactus juice chamber diameter 6 x 12" tall $209  *eBay or Craigslist $50*
Vacpump  *eBay or Craigslist $100*

Casting Alumilite
$180 2 gals from w/ shipping *Start with 2 quarts*
$casting powders $128  * Mica powders   &  Pearlex Powders  $20*

_*Alumilite colored dyes *_ 

casting pressure pot $250   *eBay or Craigslist $50*
rubber mold kit. _*$19.99 Rubber mold kit*_
_*HDPE*_ _*$20 for the molds and the racks*_
I also use pvc pipe with rubber caps for bottle stoppers, shave brushes etc  _*+1*_
don't forget mold release _*Pam vegetable spray *_


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## wolf creek knives (Mar 11, 2020)

howsitwork said:


> I can’t claim , Tom ,  to be even vaguely “self financing “ but it makes me happy making things.
> 
> On that basis my good Lady is quite happy ( as far as I know and I’m not going to rock the boat by suggesting otherwise to her) as it gives her lots of good ideas for presents for me! Although I do admit to sometimes buying it myself and there just could be a small amount of inaccuracy in the costings given .
> 
> ...



As long as you're happy making things thats all that counts.  This can be a pretty expensive "hobby" so taking the loan was the only way I could get started.  In the U.S. I was allowed to right off all my equipment on my income taxes so there's a very strong advantage to having a small business.  And I started very small.  It wasn't until two years ago that I got my break with some customers that buy large quantities from me.  And my wife was the one that approached the customers, not me.  So I owe her the credit on that one.  I also don't buy anything unless it's on sale and I can get a deal for the shop.  As for my wife shopping for me...SHE'S the shopper and gets the deals and saves me a lot of money.  I'm pretty much like most guy's, go to the store, buy meals for a week and be out of the store in 1/2 and hour.  I don't look at the price tag I just buy what I want and get chastised later from, you guessed it, my wife.
I chose to "self isolate" six years ago when I moved to my property in the Rocky Mountains of Montana.  My gate is 3/4 of a mile down our road so I literally can go without seeing anyone for a week or more.  Well I do see my wife daily but I have my shop and she has her craft room so it's not an all day thing.
Good luck and good health with the potential quarantine you might be going through, I don't envy you at all.  You ever get lonely there's a whole bunch of members here that can keep you occupied.


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## howsitwork (Mar 12, 2020)

Craig’s list over here seems to be more about lonesome folks trying to hook up together?? I don t think we’ve really got on board with the rest of it??

HDPE can be made from plastic milk containers if you’re really keen but not to bad to buy. Thanks for the suggestion re pvc tubes and I’ll use demi-john rubber  bungs ( from winemaking days of my youth )  as hey come in larger diameters.


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## ecrouse (Mar 12, 2020)

HDPE can also be sourced from soda bottle caps.  The great part about using them is that they come in a great variety of colors and you can melt/combine them in your wife's panini press (if you don't mind being killed in your sleep )


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## pshrynk (Mar 12, 2020)

ecrouse said:


> HDPE can also be sourced from soda bottle caps.  The great part about using them is that they come in a great variety of colors and you can melt/combine them in your wife's panini press (if you don't mind being killed in your sleep )


That's always looked like a poor option to me.


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## ecrouse (Mar 12, 2020)

pshrynk said:


> That's always looked like a poor option to me.




Which part, the bottle caps, the panini press, or the death part?  

Honestly I've not done any HDPE work, just seen others doing it and it looked pretty easy and like it would give a unique look.  I thought chopping them in to small bits and heating them then pressing them together for a mosaic look might be pretty cool but haven't gotten around to it yet..


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## ecrouse (Mar 12, 2020)

Oh, just realized this HDPE conversation was about molds, not blanks.  There are a couple of people out there that have made HDPE blanks and I thought that looked pretty interesting.


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