# Anyone feel like....



## ladycop322 (Dec 17, 2015)

helping me out?  I want to take my penmaking to the next level and learn how to make kitless fountain pens.  I need a list of items/tools I will need, i.e., special mandrels, etc. to get started.  

Also, if you can direct me to an awesome how-to video, I would certainly appreciate!  I am more visual and need to 'see' than 'read' a manual.

Thanks in advance!  Hope you all have a very MERRY CHRISTMAS and a HAPPY NEW YEAR!

LOVE, PEACE, & HEALTH <3

:turtle::turtle::turtle:


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## mredburn (Dec 17, 2015)

You can make kitless pens on a wood lathe but a metal lathe would offer quite a few advantages.  If I remember right you were limited for working space. So another piece or equipment you cant move easily may not work for you.
#1- You will need a Tap Guide and a die holder for the tap and dies you will need to use.
Here is one sample of a tap quide
Tap Guide, 2MT Short, Fisher 3104 - LittleMachineShop.com
a die holder 
Die Holder 2314 - LittleMachineShop.com

both from Little Machine shop buy you may find other elsehwere.

You will need to pick a brand of the Nib and feeds you want to use or rob El Grande kits of the front sections or Exotic Blanks has a couple of front ends you could buy the taps for and just use those.
Exotic Blanks :: Nibs, Bushings, Bits, Tubes & Parts :: Fountain Pen Nib Sections & Nibs

If you choose Jowo or Bock or Schmidt you will need the specific taps for them and make your own front section/feed housing.


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## BRobbins629 (Dec 17, 2015)

Michelle - I think the easiest way to start is by using one of the Berea Churchill/El Grande sections.  For this you will need a 10x1 metric tap ( would also recommend getting the die in case you need to chase the threads on the section.  I would also get a 12m or 13m tap and die set for the upper and lower barrel. ( no need for triple start at this point).

As for holding the barrels, take a look at Skiprat's o-ring pin chuck in the library.  I would make one 7/16" for the cap and a smaller one for the lower barrel.  There are other more fancy ways to do this, but these are easy and work well.

For your first ones, try using easy to tap materials such as alumalite or ebonite.  Will save a lot of frustration.

Once you get the cap and barrel to work, concentrate on the clip.  I made several of my first ones this way.  Start easy and work your way up.


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## jttheclockman (Dec 17, 2015)

This does not happen overnight. This takes different tools and a different mindset. There is a ton of info here but you have to be willing to put the time into reading and viewing. There are many variations to the depth of kitless you want to go. Many people first start out making closed end pens and then graduate up. You can go as far as making all the components yourself or combining making kits and kitless. 

Here is a starting thread that may interest you. and the library is full of info. 

http://www.penturners.org/forum/f50/need-help-making-kitless-fountain-pen-132984/


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## Smitty37 (Dec 17, 2015)

ladycop322 said:


> helping me out?  I want to take my penmaking to the next level and learn how to make kitless fountain pens.  I need a list of items/tools I will need, i.e., special mandrels, etc. to get started.
> 
> Also, if you can direct me to an awesome how-to video, I would certainly appreciate!  I am more visual and need to 'see' than 'read' a manual.
> 
> ...


If you want to start with an existing front end, I have a ton of Classic Vintage front ends and I could let you have a bunch for no more than the shipping.  I don't know what tap you would need, but they would allow you to get some practice on the cheap.


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## jalbert (Dec 17, 2015)

If you decide you are serious about pursuing kitless pen making, I would suggest purchasing a metalworking lathe. I have the Grizzly 7x14" mini metal lathe and it works perfectly fine for what I need it for: Plus it is relatively cheap. I've done kitless pens on both the wood lathe and metal lathe, and would not choose to ever do one on the wood lathe again (quite possibly one of the most frustrating penmaking experiences of my life!). The metal lathe will also let you easily and accurately make all the mandrels that you will need. 

I believe this is the tutorial I followed when I first started:
http://mkmk.com/swiwt/PDF/kitless_pen.pdf

As well as watching the kitless pen making videos on this guy's YouTube channel:
https://www.youtube.com/user/Steve4948/videos

The taps and dies I use are as follows:
Section to body: M10x.75 (I also use this for threading the cap finial to screw into the cap over top of the clip ring). I use a 9.25mm drill bit for this hole.
Cap to body: M12x.75. I use an 11.25mm drill bit for this hole
Feed housing: I use Jowo nib units, so for a #6 unit, I use a M7.4x.5 tap (purchased from Silver Pen Parts), and a 6.9mm drill bit for the hole.

Obviously the list of tools could go on and on. A tailstock drill chuck and die holder are necessary, as someone mentioned previously, as well as cutting tools if you decide to go the metal lathe route. I like the indexable cutting tools that accept either carbide or high speed steel inserts, such as this:
https://littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=4132&category=1208242246

I would also strongly recommend a replacement quick change tool post. I have this one and love it:
https://littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=2461&category=-419988835

Anyway, I hope this wasn't too confusing. I started making kitless pens this past summer and thought I would share some of the tools and equipment I found to be necessary and helpful. If you have any questions, feel free to PM me. Good luck!

-John


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## ladycop322 (Dec 17, 2015)

What wonderful information I received!  Thank you to all who responded.  I will start collecting videos and info after Christmas and look forward to Jonathan Brooks teaching kitless at the FLGAPG in February!  Sooooo excited!


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## Penultimate (Dec 18, 2015)

I recommend The Pen Turner's Bible by Richard Kleinhenz. He gives two designs with dimensions that you can use as a starting point. There are good pointers in there too including making mandrels. 

Good luck and have fun.


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## ladycop322 (Dec 20, 2015)

Mike, 

Where do I find the Pen Turner's Bible???


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## cal91666 (Dec 20, 2015)

http://www.amazon.com/The-Pen-Turners-Bible-Creating/dp/0941936619


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## cal91666 (Dec 20, 2015)

Following your thread.  Hoping to gather some information as well.


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## Penultimate (Dec 20, 2015)

Greetings
I recommend Alibris.com. They have used books at low prices. 

Pen Turner's Bible: The Art of Creating Custom Pens book by Richard Kleinhenz | 1 available editions | Alibris Books

Good luck

Mike


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