# CA Faults



## jttheclockman (Mar 14, 2009)

The use of CA as a finish is always a topic of importance here and there are those that are looking for the ultimate application technique so the search goes on. I was talking with a member here and he brought up some good points about using CA that I was wondering about myself. I have not had the time invested in making pens to be able to track reliability and flaws when using CA as a finish. So I thought I would throw the questions out here and am sure the long time users will be able to jump in. 

Has anyone had problems with any of your pens due to the use of CA, down the road???  Has there been failures due to cracking in the finish???  Has there been cloudiness due to adhesion problems???  Has anyone had their pens returned because of the use of CA???  Has there been chipping??? It doesn't matter if you use straight CA or CA/BLO. Just state what you used. Does the amount or type of CA cause problems??  

Are these problems avoidable or are they inevitable???  Does wood shrinkage play a factor in the use of CA???  Thanks all for the replys.


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## hunter-27 (Mar 14, 2009)

First off, HAPPY B-DAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  AS far as the ca goes, It has not given me any more cracking issues than any other finish, any cracking I have had was due to the wood not the finish I believe,  As far as other problems, I have had few but slight cloudiness on oily woods was one of them, this has been a non-issue as of late, after I started putting a single coat of BLO on before I start my ca, and heat it up with friction to ensure it is dry and then go to the ca I have not seen it as an issue.  I'm sure others more qualified than myself will chime in with more help.


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## Rudy Vey (Mar 14, 2009)

JT, I always use a few pens of my own, so I can see how the finish and the plating holds up. So far, I have had only one issue with a CA finish on a pen.
I made my wife an IBO Sierra and finished it with old CA. This finish would not hold up. After a few days in her pocketbook, she complained that the finish started to flake off. I took the pen and with my fingernail I could easily scrape off the finish. So, I sanded it off and applied a new one with fresh CA, and it looks now after 2 year or so very well. This is the only problem I have seen so far.
I made some 50 pens for my employer for Christmas 2007 and see many colleagues using theirs daily, and I always take a look at them when I can - they look all still great.

The only problems with pens I had was cracking of the wood after some time of use, my list is:
Bloodwood, Pink Ivory, Ebony and Lignum Vitae.


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## leehljp (Mar 14, 2009)

You sure ask a bunch of questions! :biggrin:

First, I don't make pens to sell, as my work eats up too much of my time. But I do sell some on special request. I love the experimenting and creating. When I retire in two years, I may devote more time to making for the purpose of selling.

Now to your questions - I haven't made enough to qualify as selling professionally. So I have not had any returns. 

I had one crack - that is the finish cracked. The finish was rather thin, the wood was soft and I dropped the pen on concrete. On two or three others that I have dropped, I have had dents and scratches but no cracking. On most of the pens for the past 3 years, I applied a fairly thick coating, and it seems more durable that way.

I have one that was finished two years ago and it has been setting on a piece of cloth in a cabinet - with a small lightweight box on top of it for several months. I found it yesterday and it had impressions of the cloth on it. This is the first time I heard of CA doing this. In the right light, the cloth pattern can be seen.

I would be weary of long term effects of a tight band (in a pen box) on a CA finished pen in warm weather because of this.

Still, I am happy with CA finishes overall.


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## dalemcginnis (Mar 14, 2009)

I use thick CA on my pens, haven't sold enough to really give good feedback but I dropped one of mine from about 30' in the air onto a concrete floor.  The finish survived, the pen lasted about another week before it died from the fall.


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## Thad Nickoley (Mar 15, 2009)

Good morning Dale, 

Was that an drop from 30 feet an accident??? or are you frequently 30 feet off the ground?


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## bitshird (Mar 15, 2009)

I haven't had any problems with cracking, but I did an outside show with no shade, put my pens away then opened up the cases a month later and a couple had developed cloudiness, both on oily wood, but they can bite your butt any way.


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## dalemcginnis (Mar 15, 2009)

Thad Nickoley said:


> Good morning Dale,
> 
> Was that an drop from 30 feet an accident??? or are you frequently 30 feet off the ground?



Dropping the pen was an accident and yes I am frequently up in the air.  I work in a warehouse and frequently have to audit material on the top shelves of the racks so up I go on a "cherry picker".  And yes, I most definitely wear a harness so if I ever fall it's only about a 6' drop till I'm hanging in space waiting for someone to come along and lower the machine to the ground


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## marcruby (Mar 15, 2009)

The only CA finish issue I have is that not only does it look a bit like plastic (and it is, of course).  Bit it wears like plastic.  By which I mean that it gradually, through use, acquires enough scratches so that the finish loses much of its glitter, but it never acquires the patina that more traditional finishes get from use.

I hope that makes sense.

Marc


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## chriselle (Mar 15, 2009)

I've had issues on crosscut blanks with cracking in the finish due to seasonal movement.  Sometimes I've noticed a little sinking of the CA finish after a few months but that was a few years ago when I was really laying the CA on thick.


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## Rudy Vey (Mar 16, 2009)

chriselle said:


> I've had issues on crosscut blanks with cracking in the finish due to seasonal movement.  Sometimes I've noticed a little sinking of the CA finish after a few months but that was a few years ago when I was really laying the CA on thick.


That might be also the cause for cracks in the finish - too thick. I apply about 4 coats of thin CA and it works for me. Others use a lot layers of thick CA, so they building up quite a thickness of plastic. The next time I apply my finish, I measure the thickness of it.


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## PENZZZ (Mar 23, 2009)

I'm happy that I came across this post, as I'm interested in longevity of CA finishes.  I don't build pens, but use CA and other finishes on fly rod reel seat inserts, the wooden barrel inserted into the hardware that holds a fly reel onto the fly rod. I've used CA on inserts that were recently installed on rods, but have yet to put them to use on the stream.

The process I use is to build up a thick layer of CA by applying multiple coats of thick CA, let cure for 4-5 days, then sand down and polish out with successive wet sandpapers.  On a few occasions I polished them then put them into plastic bags only to find that the finish went dull here and there, or the whole insert.  After researching CA characteristics I concluded that even though I allowed the CA to cure for several days the finish wasn't entirely cured and moisture from the wood reacted with the CA causing the dull appearance.  Re-polishing these restored them to a high luster.

Regarding cracking, I haven't conducted any intentional or unintentinal impact tests, but others who do what I do have reported that a sharp blow can/will crack CA.  Otherwise they're happy with the results.


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## bitshird (Mar 23, 2009)

I did a show this past Saturday, and one more pen had clouded on the top/cap section, first time I had opened the folder since early December, again it was on Brazilian Ebony, which is a difficult wood for me any way,the pens have been stored in my office, but out of several hundred pens, I think two being messed up is good, I'll accept a 1% failure rate on any man made thing any day.


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