# Windows Vista



## Mudder (Feb 10, 2007)

I'm curious.

Are you going to upgrade to Windows Vista?

Why, or Why not?


Please; No Microsoft bashing.

I would just simply like to know your reasoning for upgrading or not.

I was a Vista beta tester and I'm really on the fence as to this upgrade.

The interface is slick and pretty but it takes a lot of resources to run it. I've been with XP since it's inception and I'm comfortable with it.


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## Dario (Feb 10, 2007)

Mudder,

You nailed it... available resources is the key whether one should upgrade or not.

For me, I will wait and see.  Don't want to be the one to find all the (missed) bugs []


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## ashaw (Feb 10, 2007)

Dario

I will upgrade in the near future.  I want the bugs to be found out first by everyone else before I even put it on my system.  I already did an analysis on the system and since it is new no additional hardware is necessary.  From having the software background I know at least the first 6 months bugs will be found.  I big concern is in security.


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## DCBluesman (Feb 10, 2007)

I'll upgrade when I get a new machine.  The advantages, and there are many, aren't valuable enough to me at this point to justify the fact that MS has overpriced it.


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## btboone (Feb 10, 2007)

I've read that MicroSoft has put in a lot of "Big Brother" type security measures in it, and that it checks 30 times a second to see if anything has been tampered with or is not original software.  It will delete that software from the computer or will lock up the operating system if anything changes on the setup like changing out a sound card.  You might then have to wait for a patch to be created by them or pay for a reinstall. In my opinion, that crosses the line to trying to be overprotective and will cause them to lose huge market share.  I'll be holding off until these issues are resolved.


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## bob393 (Feb 10, 2007)

I will upgrade when I replace my computer. For now XP Pro is just fine! Look ma no bugs[]


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## JimGo (Feb 10, 2007)

I alredy have upgraded my laptop.  I have 2 other mchines that I'll be upgrading, too.


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## DocStram (Feb 10, 2007)

Upgrade to Vista?  Not me.  If I upgrade to anything it will be to Linux.


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## Gary Max (Feb 10, 2007)

Al you have a good point-----I am think Apple


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## toolcrazy (Feb 10, 2007)

I'm with Doc, I won't be upgrading, if I do it will be Linux. XP Pro works fine for me. Unless someone comes out with a piece of software that will only run on Vista and I can't live without it, maybe, just maybe. Or, maybe, on a new machine. Or, maybe I'll reinstall XP PRO. But my machine is less than 2 years old, no reason to upgrade for a while.


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## strick242 (Feb 10, 2007)

I am really thinking about Linux myself.  I have been playing around with a Knoppix Live DVD for a while and like it.  I probably would have switched already if I could get my wireless card to work under it.  It's a big step, because I am somewhat of a Windows geek, but am clueless when it comes to Linux.


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## tipusnr (Feb 10, 2007)

I won't be upgrading soon but eventually will have to as XP will soon go unsupported like all the the Windows programs (OSs included).  Unless you are a geek and can code you will not have a choice.  That is just the way of computing.  Computers and their software are made obsolete before they can live out their mechanical life.

They are one of the few tools we use in our shops that can't be rebuilt, restored and respected for long life.

That being said, my main reason for not upgrading is that I neither need nor want all the fancy bells and whistles of upgraded programs.  I like utilitarian, bullet-proof programs that I understand how to use.


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## OKLAHOMAN (Feb 10, 2007)

Not until I'm forced to,as Tip said will have to when XP goes unsupported.


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## schellfarms (Feb 10, 2007)

Our old computer just died, so we bought a new one last week.  It has vista.  So far, the only problem is that some of my old software won't run, so I'll have to upgrade to the latest and greatest...  It seems fairly similar to windows xp as far as function, but we've been too busy to really use it very much.  I'm still trying to figure out some things--like how to set my default page in IE right now.


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## DocRon (Feb 10, 2007)

Don't buy version 1.0 of ANYTHING. Just MHO.


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## arioux (Feb 10, 2007)

Hi,

For your info, XP sp3 is due to be release in 2008 so XP will be supported for at leat 2 more years and probably more.  If you plan on upgrading make sure you run the vista upgrede advisor first,
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/windowsvista/buyorupgrade/upgradeadvisor.mspx
It's free and it's from microsoft.  It will tell you what will and won't work after the upgrade.
I work in IT department and i wont be upgrading before Vista SP1 is available, somewhere next year.  I don't see any advantage (neither the 23 IT specialist that work me) to pay for an upgrade. 
If you absolutely wnat to, stay away from Vista home regular, there is no difference with Xp.  Vista premium as a minimum, because of the Aero interface (256 meg videocard reqired).
Many anti virus software won't work, Nero version 7 and below might not work correctly and many many more software wont work at all.
So remember, "If it aint broken, don't fix it"[8D]

Alfred


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## alamocdc (Feb 10, 2007)

Not for me. It won't let me telecommute.


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## baldysm (Feb 10, 2007)

> _Originally posted by DocRon_
> <br />Don't buy version 1.0 of ANYTHING. Just MHO.



Let's see - 
Windows 3.x (believe there existed a version 1 and 2, but know nothing about them)
Windows 95/98  (ie version 4)
Windows 2000 (version 5)
Windows XP (version 6)
Windows Vista (version 7)

It'll get fixed sometime. 

All of the windows (including Apple) are based on a Xerox machine back in the 70's IIRC.


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## arjudy (Feb 10, 2007)

Probably won't until I am forced to.  XP works just fine for me.


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## Ron in Drums PA (Feb 10, 2007)

> _Originally posted by baldysm_
> <br />
> 
> 
> ...



The first one was called Windows (1985)
Windows 2 
Windows 286 
Windows 386
Windows 3.0
Windows 3.1
Windows 95
Windows 98
Windows NT 3.1
Windows NT 4.0
Windows 2000
Windows ME
Windows XP
Windows Server 2003

So Vista is the 15th version of Windows to come out.

Just in case someone wanted to know


BTW - I installed Office 2007. It's doesn't seem any better than Office 2003, but it sure is prettier.


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## TellicoTurning (Feb 10, 2007)

I have a relatively new computer(about 15 months old) running XP that I'm fairly comfortable with... from what I read about Vista, there are some hardware upgrades that would have to be installed, plus additional ROM ( I think ROM..) new color graphic cards, video cards, and such before some of the older machines will run on Vista.. I don't have any plans to upgrade anytime soon.


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## baldysm (Feb 10, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Ron in Drums PA_
> 
> The first one was called Windows (1985)
> Windows 2
> ...



Don't want to wander too far off course, but I would disagree with Vista being the 15th version. 98 is an patched version of 95 essentially. ME is 98 with more bugs added. NT and server are the business oriented version of windows, and are really a separate development track. 

If you look at the version of windows, even XP is only version 5.1. Go to c:\windows\system32 and right click on win.com. Select properties and then the version tab. On mine, it's 5.1.2600.0. So Vista would be 5.2 or 6, I'm thinking 6, but I'm not sure. 

Before I got into pens, I got my MCSE in NT and also in 2000. Took a couple tests in the 2003 track but was really moving on to pen turning. Throw in a ton of Cisco tests in there as well, couple Novell and IBM AIX early in my career. From 1999 to about 2004, my main job was Cisco networking, security, and VoIP.


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## panini (Feb 10, 2007)

I'll wait till 2014 when MS drop support on XP[]...took awhile to upgrade to XP after 98..[]...can't afford to buy software upgrades let alone build a 64 or 128 bit computer...[]...just upgraded computer with 3 300gig new harddrives for raid setup...spending too much money on penturning...[8)]


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## Ron in Drums PA (Feb 10, 2007)

Scott, maybe I should have said Vista is the 15th flavor of windows.

I always thought ME was a watered down version of NT and Win2000?


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## Ron in Drums PA (Feb 10, 2007)

> _Originally posted by panini_
> <br />I'll wait till 2014 when MS drop support on XP[]...took awhile to upgrade to XP after 98..[]...can't afford to buy software upgrades let alone build a 64 or 128 bit computer...[]...just upgraded computer with 3 300gig new harddrives for raid setup...spending too much money on penturning...[8)]



Here you go Mark
http://search.ebay.com/windows-286_W0QQfclZ4QQfnuZ1QQfsopZ1QQxpufuZx


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## Blind_Squirrel (Feb 10, 2007)

Right now the cons outweigh the pros for me.  Very hardware intensive, lack of drivers, nothing that I can't already get with XP (except DirectX 10, which isn't being used by gamers yet).  

I will wait until there are some applications out there that I want/need that won't run on XP.


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## woodman928 (Feb 10, 2007)

I just got new computers in Dec wifes has XP Pro and I have XP Media we just up graded from ME (that was junk) so I have no desire to upgrade will wait untill the next supper dupper overprice junk comes out. Like some of you I think Microsoft is taking to much control of the system if you cant replace a componet without violiating something. [V]


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## Rifleman1776 (Feb 11, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Ron in Drums PA_
> <br />
> 
> 
> ...



There was a 3.11 in there. That's where I started.


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## Rifleman1776 (Feb 11, 2007)

It is a progression in the evolution of all things with computers. When the time comes for a new computer, I will use Vista. There is no advantage to remaining behind the curve.


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## Mudder (Feb 11, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Ron in Drums PA_
> <br />The first one was called Windows (1985)
> Windows 2
> Windows 286
> ...



To add a couple more

Windows 3.11 (windows for workgroups)
Windows 98 SE
Windows Media Center Edition
Embedded Windows (for PDA's)also known as Windows CE
Backoffice Server

Lets not forget NT4 came as a server and a workstation.
Windows 2000 came as workstation, server, and advanced server.
Windows Xp has a home and professional edition

Seems I forgot a few also:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_NT

and here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Microsoft_Windows

Please don't forget that Microsoft was involved with IBM at one time and worked on the early releases of OS/2


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## Chuck Key (Feb 11, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Rifleman1776_
> 
> There was a 3.11 in there. That's where I started.



I started on a TI-99 4a.  Then on to CP/M, several versions of DOS, OS/2 then Winders.

Chuckie


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## Penmonkey (Feb 11, 2007)

I'm dreaming of a imac......


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## Mudder (Feb 11, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Chuck Key_
> <br />
> 
> 
> ...



I started in school on a PDP-8 that we rented time on from the local college. We graduated to (trash-80's) TRS-80 in my senior year and when I got out active duty in the service and transferred into the reserves I spent $2800.00 on an IBM PC-XT S She ran a blazing fast 4.77 megahertz, had and unheard of 640k of memory and more hard disk space that anyone would ever need, a whopping 20 Megabytes! This machine listed for close to 8 grand when it was introduced but my company commander worked for IBM as a middle manager and was able to get me one for the employee discount. Not to mention they had already introduced the `286. Man I thought I was "Da Bomb"

To contrast that, I replaced my system a few months ago with an HP that has a dual core 2.8 gig processor, 2 gig of memory, a 300 gig hard drive, lite scribe dvd burner and a 20" Viewsonic flatpanel and I paid less than half of what I paid in 1986.


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## Ron in Drums PA (Feb 11, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Mudder_
> <br />e]
> 
> I started in school on a PDP-8 that we rented time on from the local college. We graduated to (trash-80's) TRS-80 in my senior year and when I got out active duty in the service and transferred into the reserves I spent $2800.00 on an IBM PC-XT S She ran a blazing fast 4.77 megahertz, had and unheard of 640k of memory and more hard disk space that anyone would ever need, a whopping 20 Megabytes! This machine listed for close to 8 grand when it was introduced but my company commander worked for IBM as a middle manager and was able to get me one for the employee discount. Not to mention they had already introduced the `286. Man I thought I was "Da Bomb"
> ...



I also started on a TRS-80 with a cassette tape to store data and programs. it used to take 20+ minutes for a 8k program to load.

I later moved up to a IBM 8086 with a single sided 5-1/4 floppy drive.  A few months later I purchased a 10 meg harddrive. Everybody thought I was nuts to buy such a big drive. At the time it was blazing fast!

In December I purchased a Quad Core 2.66GHz system with two 500GB SATA drives (RAID). 

I see 1TB drives are now available, it won't be long before 1PB drives are out. 

The one thing I've noticed is that silly little 10meg hard drive held about as much programs and data as the 250GB in my old system. I guess this is what they call progress.


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## wade (Feb 12, 2007)

I make a point to never run a new Microsoft operating system until at least 1 year has passed since the new OS was released.  By then there is usually enough bug fixes out there that it just doesn't matter.  Although, I plan on sticking to XP as long as possible.  XP is the best MS operating system since Windows 98 SE, and I used that up until 3 years ago.

Wade


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## ilikewood (Feb 12, 2007)

Wow, I haven't heard the term "Trash-80" in a long time!!  I used one of those too!  I also did some work on some CP/M based machines (that too I hadn't heard of for a long time either! H-89s if your wondering) []

Some friends of mine are having problems with their Vista....seems many programs won't operate with it.  I will wait as long as possible myself to upgrade.  We home school our children and most of their curriculum is PC based....I can't risk messing up the year with programs that won't run on Vista.


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## beathard (Feb 12, 2007)

I stated on a Lisa (the predessor to the Mac).  I believe that you need to put the Mac OS in front of the Windows versions.  I believe you would need to put XEROX in front of Mac.  XEROX really messed up when they allowed Mac and Windows to be created using their User Interface.


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## baldysm (Feb 12, 2007)

H89, remember it well! Did you build it from the kit or get it complete?

My dad used to work for a defense contractor. In an effort to train thier employees, you went through a course in electronics IIRC, and after passing the test at the end of the module, you got the next part of the kit.

I spent many hours on the kitchen table with a soldering iron in hand. Dad used it until about 8 years ago, when he decided it was time to upgrade. 

We used both CP/M and HDOS.


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## ilikewood (Feb 12, 2007)

Hey Scott....many hours at the kitchen table with the soldering iron myself!  I was in my teens then, but I was totally infatuated with then even then.[]


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## mdburn_em (Feb 12, 2007)

I too will stick with XP.  I am learning Linux and I am reasonably sure that I will be using various flavors of Linux.  I do have to support Windows machines at work so I will have to know something about them so I will need to have at least one with Vista on it to learn the ins and outs.  I will say that MS has a decent program for non-profits which is why my employer will stick with them.  
It was about a year ago that I was able to talk them into purchasing 10 used computers (1.8 GHz P4's...screamin')  I was able to get rid of the 133's and 166's that were still in use.
Vista?  whew.  I'm a decade from having machines that will run Vista.
Sigh...


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## TellicoTurning (Feb 12, 2007)

You guys must all be younger than me... the only "computer" we had in my high school was a slide rule and an abaccas.  We even had to write all our English papers with a fountain pen.. no ball points allowed.


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## baldysm (Feb 12, 2007)

> _Originally posted by mdburn_em_
> <br />
> It was about a year ago that I was able to talk them into purchasing 10 used computers (1.8 GHz P4's...screamin')  I was able to get rid of the 133's and 166's that were still in use.
> Vista?  whew.  I'm a decade from having machines that will run Vista.
> Sigh...



Ha, I got you beat. I used to work for a local health insurance company that was using Digital LAT and a VMS server until 1999. (Y2k issues). They were the LAST company in the world to be using that version of software for thier records. Before I left, I got them upgraded to async terminals on TCP/IP, thier current level of technology.


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## Papabear (Feb 13, 2007)

There's no way I'll DOWNGRADE to vista without a lot of kicking and screaming.  I use WinXP and Ubuntu Linux and can do anything I really need already.  Already with IE7 I have users that have problems with basic website functions because of microsoft's "security" measures.  I'm not about to let them have control over my machines.  My servers all run Linux and do NOT have frontpage hooks.  For me getting totally away from M$ is almost a possibility.  That day is coming.


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## Scottydont (Feb 13, 2007)

Hi Scott. Long time no speak. There is not anything that is compelling enough about Vista to make me upgrade right now. I am taking a wait and see attitude to see what kind of issues peple run into. I built a PC with a AMD Dual core 64 bit and running two 7800GT video cards in SLI. It is a SWEEEET machine and I want it to stay that way. Users are likely to run into issues with Vista with unsigned drivers not being able to be loaded into the Kernel during bootup. I read a recent artile recommending that if you have a 64bit machine, they recommend upgrading to the 32 bit version to minimize problems as there are very few programs supporting 64 bit yet.

Just in case anyone wants to read it here is the link.

http://361degrees.wordpress.com/2006/06/13/windows-vistato-install-64-bit-or-32-bit-version-x64-vs-x86/


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## RobWalters (Feb 14, 2007)

(I can't believe nobody mentioned Microsoft Bob!  And yes, I know it was just a different interface to Win 3.1.)

I'm sticking with XP/SuSE Linux until my PC dies, for multiple reasons.  When it finally does come time to consider a new box, I'm seriously pondering just selling out to Apple.  At least their commercials are funny. []


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## Ron in Drums PA (Feb 14, 2007)

> _Originally posted by RobWalters_
> <br />I'm seriously pondering just selling out to Apple.  At least their commercials are funny. []




If you think they are funny watch these  
http://www.youtube.com/v/hrpS9m2VF1c
http://www.youtube.com/v/Jg1-ywndVNc
http://www.youtube.com/v/LZtbshemzq8
http://www.youtube.com/v/1UNSfm4Of80


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## gerryr (Feb 14, 2007)

I still miss Windows 1.0.  At least then when I found a bug, I could just switch to DOS and run programs anyway.  I just a new machine in November, I think, after a system board failure.  It runs XP Media Edition and is Vista "ready".  We also got a coupon to get Vista free after release, but I don't know which version.  I used to be real early on the curve with Windows, but with each version there are more and more bugs early on, so now I'm a late adopter.  I won't upgrade before they release SP1 and maybe not even then.


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## Bozz (Feb 14, 2007)

No.  As an IT Administrator, I prefer to let Microsoft work out the problems of newly released software on the masses for a minimum of one year before I install their software on my servers. Or my own home PC for that matter. Usually, one year after the masses have tried their products they've broken it enough times for Microsoft to fix all the issues that should have been fixed prior to release.  Really, most software vendors operate this way.  It has become standard business practice.  Think of Microsoft and software vendors like them as using their customers as free resources of lab-rat, beta-testers and charging them for the privilege.  That is why Bill Gates and Microsoft are the wealthiest entities in the world.


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## Ron in Drums PA (Feb 14, 2007)

Here is a good news item

http://www.breitbart.com/news/2007/02/14/D8N9NRF80.html



> security researchers noted a problem with Vista's improved speech-recognition system, which lets people speak commands to the computer. It turns out that sounds played over the PC's speakers _ on a malicious Web site configured for this very purpose, for example _ can trigger Vista's speech-recognition engine and execute commands on a victim's computer.


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