# Bounced check



## Tuba707 (Jul 23, 2007)

Hey all,
  Some real-life advice needed here.  Did an irrigation repair the other day for some something-for-nothing people (I'm sure you all know people like that.)  Did a great job, did even more than my bid covered, and then I have to stand in the rain for 1 hour to wait for them to bring my check, I deposit it, and it bounces.  I get charged a fee and I'm out over $300.  And the best part is, these jokers seem to think I'm a kid and I can't do anything about it (no, I'm not really optimistic about this being a simple accounting error on their part).  The bank will not give the check back so I can't redeposit it.  Oh, and no, they won't return my calls.  Legally, I am not allowed to take the $150 worth of parts that I installed OUT, either.  It is on their property, so it now belongs to them, fair or not.  

Any helpful suggestions on recourse that I have in this situation?  I think they expect me to roll over and play dead or something, but it is not going to happen.  

Thanks - any advice is appreciated. 
-Joel


----------



## alamocdc (Jul 23, 2007)

Joel, with large personal checks I always get their DL # and if they bounce it, I press charges. Passing "bad paper" is still illegal.


----------



## Tuba707 (Jul 23, 2007)

I have their names and address, of course, as well as the home number and two cell numbers.  

Any chance I can get their DL# from the GCPD(local)?


----------



## dalemcginnis (Jul 23, 2007)

You could try suing them in small claims court. You don't need a lawyer for that. That might scare them into paying. If it doesn't then once you win in court you can get their wages garnished.  Assuming they're working of course[]


----------



## Tuba707 (Jul 23, 2007)

Well, at risk of making true Christians look bad, they both (husband and wife) are "ministers" of some sort.  Don't know what kind of wages that gets them. 

I will keep the small claims in mind.  I have considered that, at least to scare them.


----------



## Verne (Jul 23, 2007)

Don't know abuot SC but in TX you send them a cerified letter (they don't have to accept it, you just have to send it) and then you take them to small claims court. The court will help you with the paperwork, you pay to have them served. Go to court. Win. But they may still not pay, however, they will have the judgement against them. Oh, and they usually have to pay your costs. Vern


----------



## Tuba707 (Jul 23, 2007)

In SC it is a misdemeanor and they can be charged civil penalties of 3x the amount of the check.

That should get them thinking because the state won't walk away like they expect me to.


----------



## LanceD (Jul 23, 2007)

In Louisiana you send them a certified letter wait 10 days and if they don't pay turn everything to the District Attorney's office and let them do the rest. You get your money for the check , any fees from the bank, the fees for the certified letter and 25.00 to 50.00 extra. It takes a couple of months but if they don't want to go to jail for passing bad checks you are just about guaranteed to get paid.


----------



## MarkHix (Jul 23, 2007)

If they stiffed you, they probably stiffed others.  Many years ago, I had to collect bad checks from customers.  I called 2x a day, every day.  Home, work, whatever number I had.  The first and only letter always said 10 days or i would file charges.  When it was a preacher, yes, I left messages at the church.  Several times the message was specific enough to include charges filed.  I even filed a few.  Sooner or later, I collected.  

or...

Stand in front of the church on Sunday morning with a sign.


----------



## Tuba707 (Jul 23, 2007)

I got the church address.  They never told me the name of it, but I found it =)

It is not in a neighborhood that you would want to stand outside with a sign in.  I wonder if they would mind a guest speaker?


----------



## fiferb (Jul 23, 2007)

Have you tried knocking on the door and talking to them in person?


----------



## Tuba707 (Jul 23, 2007)

Not yet - it just bounced.  They live about 15 minutes from me, actually in quite a nice neighborhood.

That will happen tomorrow if my calls remain ignored.

Bruce, how are you doing, man?  I passed Exit 9 on 385 today and thought of you and Sandee.


----------



## wudnhed (Jul 23, 2007)

Just for the future, when I get a larger check instead of depositing, I cash, keep the money a few days and then deposit.  You have your money and the bank has to collect from the person who wrote the check.  Sorry your having to deal with this!


----------



## Ron Mc (Jul 23, 2007)

Be sure and file an "intent to apply a construction lean on the property". This should get their attention because they will never be able to sell their house if you have to file the lien.


----------



## RonRaymond (Jul 23, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Tuba707_
> <br />I got the church address.  They never told me the name of it, but I found it =)
> 
> It is not in a neighborhood that you would want to stand outside with a sign in.  I wonder if they would mind a guest speaker?



Then park on the street in front of their house with your sign!  You did say they live in a nice neighborhood, right?[}]


----------



## TBone (Jul 23, 2007)

Check you local laws, in NC you can NOT garnish wages.  Only government can do that.  Also around here if you cash the check, they'll deduct it from your account or they'll check the balance immediately.  Small claims court is probably your best option.  If you can't garnish in SC, you'll get a lein against their property.  I don't understand why the bank didn't return the check.  You should have that for evidence.


----------



## pilot1022 (Jul 23, 2007)

Joel, first of all go and talk to the people in person, it might be just a honest mix up. In calif the small court are about the same in all states. Usualy the small claims court will have a free advisor you can talk to and walk thru the process. But talk to them first.


----------



## toolcrazy (Jul 24, 2007)

If all else fails, turn it over to a bill collector. You may loose half, but at least you will recover the cost of your parts.


----------



## CaptG (Jul 24, 2007)

I take bad checks to the local district attorney and usually after a letter from him (or her), they make good.  Give the DA's office a call.


----------



## Jeff-in-Indiana (Jul 24, 2007)

It might be different in different states, but, if you go to THEIR bank and cash the check, the teller will be able to let you know immediately if the funds are there ... 

I will have to say, as RonMC said, having a Construction Lien against their property, assuming they do not just rent the place, would be delayed, but sweet justice ... imagine losing the sale of your house over $300 .. hahah .. it would certainly be a bad day in their world.


----------



## IPD_Mrs (Jul 24, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Tuba707_
> <br />
> The bank will not give the check back so I can't redeposit it.



I am at a loss here.  How does the bank keep the check and not give you the money?  If the check is returned then you should have received it in the mail and it should be stamped NSF.  This allows you to present the check a second time.  Once a check has been returned the second time it will be marked that it was presented twice and to not present again, usually with some of the account or routing numbers missing from a hole punch.  

So if the bank will not return the check then they are obligated to give you the funds.  You cannot file against them without the returned check.


----------



## PR_Princess (Jul 24, 2007)

Joel,

I do not know what the laws are like in your neck of the woods, nor how the check 21 laws apply. 

But see if you can't first get the NSF check in your posession. Then take that check over to the bank on which it was drawn and ask them to "put it in for collection". (Most banks will do this for you - at least up here and if you know to ask). It means that the bank will put, and hold, that NSF check (can be NSF presented only once) ahead of any other withdrawl that that person will make. So, as soon as they deposit funds into that account, you get paid first. Other stuff of theirs' may bounce, - but then the banks like those fees. [}]

Again, I do not know the system where you are, but it may be worth looking into.


----------



## Rifleman1776 (Jul 24, 2007)

Bad checks happen. But what amazes me most about this incident is that the BANK WON'T GIVE IT BACK. That check is your property. The bank has no right to keep it unless they pay on it. Do file a mechanics lien on the property. Go see the local prosecuting attorney. And send a certified letter to the people demanding payment. You might also call the state banking commission to ask what to do about the bank not returning YOUR check. Don't let yourself get stiffed. That is one of the biggest reasons independant contractors go broke. They don't get paid, can't pay their suppliers and it's all downhill. Let us know what happens.


----------



## Tuba707 (Jul 24, 2007)

I got in contact with her today.  Told me she had tried to call (no message was left and my cell is on 24/7).  She had to hang up on me last night because.... she was in a seminary class!  But, come to find out, she really doesn't want to go to small claims court and pay the civil fees and get a misdemeanor on her preaching record... So she is mailing me a MO when she gets the money in just over a week.... but I am going to go pick it up from her, since I don't know if it would ever make it to the mail....

Thank you all for the advice, I certainly learned a few things about doing business through this.  I will update when I recieve my money from them.  If there are still problems, you can bet that they will have a lein on their house, a court date, and all sorts of fees. []

RE: the bank, they are mailing me a copy but said they couldn't give the check back to me.  Sounds like that is a lot of you-know-what.


----------



## woodbutcher (Jul 24, 2007)

Dawn has the correct info. I ALWAYS take checks to the bank they are written on, generally 3-5 days after receiving them. If it will not clear I leave it for collection. I am serious about collections in business matters. You should be too. By the way what's this wait a week crap?


----------



## TBone (Jul 24, 2007)

Continue to push the bank, I can't see how they can keep your check and not pay.


----------



## Rifleman1776 (Jul 25, 2007)

> _Originally posted by woodbutcher_
> <br />Dawn has the correct info. I ALWAYS take checks to the bank they are written on, generally 3-5 days after receiving them. If it will not clear I leave it for collection. I am serious about collections in business matters. You should be too. By the way what's this wait a week crap?



The bank keeping the check is serious business. Unless state laws there are really from left field, that check is the personal property of the person it was issued to. I would see a prosecutor about that and report to the proper state or Federal banking board.
'Wait a week' is classic deadbeat put-off. I was debt collector at one time. Rule #1 is "Believe nothing".


----------



## ctwxlvr (Jul 25, 2007)

For the bank keeping the check, it all depends on how it was deposited, if it was a deposit in a box then it would be sent to a processor and then shredded after a image of the check was captured(part of the check 21 changes) the image of the check is just as good as the original for collection purposes. I went through this about a year ago.


----------



## Mudder (Jul 25, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Rifleman1776_
> <br />
> 
> 
> ...





The Check Clearing for the 21st Century Act, "Check 21" law changed all that. A bank is NOT required to return a check anymore.


----------



## TBone (Jul 25, 2007)

In lieu of returning the check, wouldn't they be required to return a copy?   How are you supposed to redeposit?


----------



## Rifleman1776 (Jul 25, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Mudder_
> <br />
> 
> 
> ...



Interesting. Not understandable, but interesting.


----------



## Malainse (Jul 25, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Tuba707_
> <br />  So she is mailing me a MO when she gets the money in just over a week....



Go to her house and get the cash...  This mail and MO thing sound like another scam..."Oh, I mailed it, must have been lost".  Also advise her that she need to pay any fee's that the bank stuck you with.......


----------



## Tuba707 (Jul 25, 2007)

That is what I plan on doing.  Like Frank said, another deadbeat excuse.

Pretty weird that the bank is not required to give the check back to you.  Hmmm.... maybe I'm discussing politics and/or being ignorant... but that sounds dumb to me.


----------



## ctwxlvr (Jul 26, 2007)

The bank not having a copy of the check is part of the new check 21 law, they only have to have an electronic image of it on file, it saves them a ton of storage and postage fees.


----------



## ahoiberg (Jul 26, 2007)

okay... if you don't get the money a second time, since you obviously know the irrigation system and they don't, go over and turn the valve off and see how happy they are with brown grass... [}][]...if you're the one who did the installation and/or repairs, you could have some fun with it!

all kidding aside, i reckon you'll get the money someway, somehow... just keep after 'em. after all, you and God know where they live... []


----------



## Tuba707 (Jul 26, 2007)

Just repairs:  If I had done the installation, there would be no need for repairs []


----------



## oldsmokey (Jul 27, 2007)

Joel, you have to check into your local and state laws about contracting and filing in court.  I contracted for many years.  If you do not have a contractors license you may not be able to file.  In Calif. you could contract for under $300.00 without a license.  That might be higher now, I have been out of the business for many years.  If you don't have a license, get it.  You may never need it, but when you do, you will be glad you have it.  I did everything, from a small countertop to a church and a complete restaurant.  I never had a bad check.  I had good contracts up front.  Every customer knew up front that they would be liable for all attorney fees and collection costs.
Contact a local attorney and have contracts made up and then use them for every customer.  Then, when you get the bad check, give it to the attorney and go back to work.  You will have your money soon.


----------



## BigRob777 (Jul 30, 2007)

Joel,
There are straight forward methods for dealing with this sort of thing, in the Bible.  First confront, then bring two brothers.  If you haven't confronted them yet, then you need to.  You may have written that you did this, but I don't have the time to read all 3 pages of posts.  At any rate, this is pretty easy to follow.

God Bless,
Rob


----------



## DougMJones (Jul 30, 2007)

One thing not to do is accept partial payment. I used to own a business and the detective I worked with on these matters always told me not to accept partial payment. If a check bounces it is a criminal matter. If you accept partial payment, it is a cival matter and by taking payment you have agreed to accept your money in installments and then they can't be prosecuted by the police department. May not be the same everywhere but wanted you to know.


----------



## Tuba707 (Aug 7, 2007)

Happy update news -
Apparently, they did not want to risk a misdemeanor and $900+ of civil penalties, plus court fees, etc.  I called very frequently and told her when I was coming to pick the $$$ up - and guess what, I actually got it - minus the bounced check fee - but I was just glad to get the money and get out of there.

Thank you, all, for the help and suggestions - I learned several lessons and I learned a lot about avoiding situations like this, as well as how to handle them if they arise.


----------



## Rifleman1776 (Aug 7, 2007)

Hppy to hear you collected. Granted, it wasn't 100% of everything but that is part of the fact of life of collecting bad debts. I'm sure the experience made you a wiser and, sadly, tougher buisnessman.


----------

