# IRS Income Tax Return



## Dario (Jan 31, 2007)

Filed mine today...hoping to receive my refund in a couple of weeks


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## jjenk02 (Jan 31, 2007)

I wish I was getting money back[]  I'm not filing till April 15th..


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## ilikewood (Jan 31, 2007)

I'll have mine done before the weekend...efile and direct deposit...fast and effective![]


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## Dario (Jan 31, 2007)

Did that last year and it was FREE.  Tried it this time (yesterday) and I am being charged by H&R Block around $35.00 [!].  Apparently it is only free the first time [].

I printed the form instead and mailed it today, direct deposit of course.[8D]



> _Originally posted by ilikewood_
> <br />I'll have mine done before the weekend...efile and direct deposit...fast and effective![]


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## alamocdc (Jan 31, 2007)

Refund? What's a refund? Haven't seen one in years. But I certainly know how to write a check and send it to them. [!]


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## wood-of-1kind (Jan 31, 2007)

What's an income tax[?] I make pens not money.[)] Will file mine by the end of May. The 'refund' goes to wifey in return for staying out of my shop. Seems fair[]

-Peter-


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## Ron Mc (Jan 31, 2007)

I used to enjoy a refund! The last couple years something has gone wrong and I am now writing checks.[xx(]


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## mrcook4570 (Jan 31, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Ron Mc_
> <br /> The last couple years something has gone wrong and I am now writing checks.[xx(]



Sounds like you need to buy more tools []


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## ed4copies (Jan 31, 2007)

Remember a REFUND is the government returning the money YOU GAVE them, over and above what YOU OWED them.  AND, they hold the money for you interest-free!!!

THIS IS NOT A GOOD THING!!!!![][][]

IF you can end up owing them a couple bucks (not enough to have to pay any penalties), you have calculated well!![][]


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## Dario (Jan 31, 2007)

> _Originally posted by ed4copies_
> <br />Remember a REFUND is the government returning the money YOU GAVE them, over and above what YOU OWED them.  AND, they hold the money for you interest-free!!!
> 
> THIS IS NOT A GOOD THING!!!!![][][]
> ...



I know...but it still give me an incredible feeling when I get my money back. As Mastercard says...PRICELESS. []


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## ed4copies (Jan 31, 2007)

Dario,

Feel free to send me as much as you want this week or any week.  I will send it back to you 6 weeks after you request it -NO CHARGE!!!!!


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## ed4copies (Jan 31, 2007)

Of course, you have to request it NEXT YEAR!!!


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## dubdrvrkev (Jan 31, 2007)

I look at it two ways. 
First way, them theiving SOB's using my money to line their pockets and fund all their nonsense committees, and everything else they can dream up as to why they can spend my money smarter than I can, and so they can fund all the programs that I need, but am not smart enough to know that I need them. I read somewhere that the new Speaker of the House said something to the effect that we should all be taxed 100% on our stock market investment profits. Who knows, probably twisted up somehow... we can hope.
Second way, I like to have paved roads, police, and fire protection even though I have to pay for it and a few million "guests" get it all for free.

I'm still trying to find the break even point. But I'd rather have a return than have to pay them yet more money.


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## Ron in Drums PA (Jan 31, 2007)

> _Originally posted by ed4copies_
> <br />Remember a REFUND is the government returning the money YOU GAVE them, over and above what YOU OWED them.  AND, they hold the money for you interest-free!!!
> 
> THIS IS NOT A GOOD THING!!!!![][][]
> ...



LOL

I've been lucky enough not to get a refund for years


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## PenWorks (Jan 31, 2007)

August 15th is the deadline for extensions and the Sept. 15th for Corps & LLC's
so I won't think about it till then.

I wonder if I will be alive when there is a real tax revolt? You know, someday it has to come. I'm with Kevin, don't mind paying for the neccesities, but the pork barrell just keeps getting bigger at our expense.


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## ilikewood (Jan 31, 2007)

Ed, Not always the case.  I can calculate all I want, but with the adoption benefits I get (bribery for adopting 3 kids), the number never is right.


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## Geo in Winnipeg (Jan 31, 2007)

> _Originally posted by PenWorks_
> <br />I wonder if I will be alive when there is a real tax revolt? You know, someday it has to come. I'm with Kevin, don't mind paying for the neccesities, but the pork barrell just keeps getting bigger at our expense.


You're not alone Anthony. The pork barrel is alive and well north of the border too.[!]


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## ed4copies (Jan 31, 2007)

Perhaps we should redefine:
Calculate:
The process of arriving at a number that is CLOSE to the desired result.  Sometimes the result of an extremely accurate hurl of a pointed object, frequently called a "dart".  For synonyms, see "unlikely".[:0][:0][:0]


BETTER???????[][]


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## ed4copies (Jan 31, 2007)

Anthony,

Sounds like you may OWE money.  SEND IT TO ME NOW!!!!!! 
I will protect it for you and send back when you file.  Since you are an especially good friend, I will only charge you a pittance, say 10% for this rare service.  (Less if you can convince Ron to do so, also!!)


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## wudnhed (Jan 31, 2007)

Ray and I write checks every year[]

We don't mind paying for needed things for our country but we're trying to figure out what idiot got a job telling someone to put "5 miles per hour" signs on all our dirt roads in our valley to keep the dust down.  You have no idea how many roads that is, hundreds upon thousands.  I need a job like that!!!!!

Pork Barrels[V]


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## alamocdc (Jan 31, 2007)

Sounds like we're all in the same boat. Not trying to get puliticul here, but I'm all for abolishing the Infernal Rip-off Service and going with a Federal Sales Tax. That way we simply pay based on what we spend. And everyone knows, the more you make, the more you spend. Equitable for everyone. Just thinkin' outloud agin.


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## jeffj13 (Jan 31, 2007)

> _Originally posted by ed4copies_
> <br />Remember a REFUND is the government returning the money YOU GAVE them, over and above what YOU OWED them.  AND, they hold the money for you interest-free!!!
> 
> THIS IS NOT A GOOD THING!!!!![][][]
> ...



QFT.

I'm always amazed at people who are pleased at having given an interest free loan to the government.

I'd much rather write a $500 check than get a $2000 refund.

jeff


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## Dario (Jan 31, 2007)

> _Originally posted by jeffj13_
> <br />
> QFT.
> 
> ...



Jeff,

I am all aware of what I should do and yes I am giving the Gov't free loan...but that is what I want to do.  I save my money that way...I know too that I can put it in the bank and earn interest but it doesn't work for me that way.

I just hope you (and others) would respect my choice...wrong or not.

Thank you


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## Ron in Drums PA (Jan 31, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Dario_
> <br />I save my money that way...I know too that I can put it in the bank and earn interest but it doesn't work for me that way.
> 
> I just hope you (and others) would respect my choice...wrong or not.
> ...



No problem Dario, heck it's your money!

Fact is there are more people like you who look forward to a refund than like me who like to pay out on tax day. 

People look forward to that refund for at least 40 years of their working life.  What they don't imagine is the long term gain they are missing out on.

Sightly off topic, did you know what credit card companies call people who pay they credit card bill in full in month.... Deadbeats!

I like being a deadbeat.


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## Dario (Jan 31, 2007)

LOL.  Ron, in that case I don't mind being a deadbeat also!  

I know that...take advantage of the CC for a month thing [] and maybe even a cash back and don't let them take any interest from you []

EDIT IN:
I think some of you know me to some degree and I am no moron.  There is a reason to my madness.  This is not permanent and some things have to be dealt a certain way (this way for now)...maybe later I can shed more light to it.  For now that is all I can say.


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## Geo in Winnipeg (Jan 31, 2007)

I didn't think I was a deadbeat - but in this case I'm glad I am[]


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## TellicoTurning (Jan 31, 2007)

This may be the first year in about 15 that I don't pay.. Back when I was working I tried to balance it so I would pay a couple of $100 on April 15.. usually didn't work out to only a couple though.


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## johncrane (Feb 1, 2007)

We all have too pay to live in a free world. l dont no why they call it free.[:0]


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## Ron Mc (Feb 1, 2007)

Well'p it looks like my wife and I did something simply fantastic this year! No check writing and we get a piddly refund that is under $100.00! That's the way to play the game.[]


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## cd18524 (Feb 1, 2007)

I'm with Dario.  Wrong or not I like my refund.

Chris


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## Jerryconn (Feb 1, 2007)

I have been struggling for years now trying to get that "dart" to hit the right mark. I have to write a pretty good sized check every year, but last year was the first year in two or three that I did not have to pay a penality ... whew. I guess I am getting a little closer to the target.  I would love to get within a C note on either side of Zero. I too do not send mine in by snail mail until the 15th of April. 
I'm with Billy.... National Sales Tax or fair tax all the way!!!


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## jckossoy (Feb 1, 2007)

I work for that company (no hate mail please, I get enough from my Business Units), and if I don't file, I get thrown in the slammer, lose my job and get fined[V].  BTW, you have until April 17 this year due to the Emancepation Day in DC.  Normally, this would only occur for states that file in Andover, MA, but this year you all get to sweat a little longer[].  Always try and file electronically (that's my area), even for those that have to pay.  Remember, you file paper and an error is made in transcription, your still liable.

A National Sales Tax or a Flat Tax won't work, unless you like paying 35 to 40% taxes (this came from econimists).


PS:  Plant a tree for Tu B'Shvat (New Year for Trees).  Eventually, you'll have more wood to make pens[].
Kol Tov,


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## Mikey (Feb 1, 2007)

This is the way I look at it. I don't always have $800 to fork over to someone, so if I can have someone take out $20 a paycheck extra and give me back the $$$, then I feel better. Not only that, but $20 in the bank plus interest isn't going to get you anywhere upwards of $20.02 at the end of the year. We get charged %%%% in interest rates when we borrow, and the companies think it's great that they offer us 2% back on our cash. 

Sure, I make no interest but I'd rather the govt use my money for 1% something good than have a corporation use my money so they can give people credit at 25% interest.


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## woodbutcher (Feb 2, 2007)

Have any of you heard of the Fair Tax Book? It is about a workable plan to eliminate the IRS and we would pay as you go. This plan is currently working it's way through Congress. The book spells it out in plain simple language. You might buy a copy at your local book store. Runs around $10.00


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## woodbutcher (Feb 2, 2007)

Posted - Feb 01 2007 :  12:46:25 PM US Eastern Time        
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I work for that company (no hate mail please, I get enough from my Business Units), and if I don't file, I get thrown in the slammer, lose my job and get fined. BTW, you have until April 17 this year due to the Emancepation Day in DC. Normally, this would only occur for states that file in Andover, MA, but this year you all get to sweat a little longer. Always try and file electronically (that's my area), even for those that have to pay. Remember, you file paper and an error is made in transcription, your still liable.

A National Sales Tax or a Flat Tax won't work, unless you like paying 35 to 40% taxes (this came from econimists).



      READ THE BOOK!! BY the way who are these "economists"? The state of Florida has used this system for decades. Florida has a strong economy and no state income tax. The Fair Tax Book explains it all. Is anyone besides myself a little concerned when an envelope with an IRS return address shows up. The layering of taxes on consumer goods is an expense no one including the Govt profits from.


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## PenWorks (Feb 3, 2007)

> _Originally posted by woodbutcher_
> <br />Posted - Feb 01 2007 :  12:46:25 PM US Eastern Time
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> A National Sales Tax or a Flat Tax won't work, unless you like paying 35 to 40% taxes (this came from econimists).



Maybe it would work if the goverment spent 40% less of our money, build less bombs, invade less countries and then rebuild them.


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## alamocdc (Feb 3, 2007)

Oh uh, lookie what I started. Sorry, Jeff![:I]


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## PenWorks (Feb 3, 2007)

Billy you didn't start this. It started over 100 years ago when somebody sold the goverment something. The contractor screwed the goverment, the politician lined his pocket and then ordered 100 more [!] I wouldn'd doubt if we are still ordering muskets from someone []


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## jckossoy (Feb 3, 2007)

The economist came from both sides, Republican and Democrat.  To eliminate the IRS is folly.  Who do you think is going to collect it, the states.  They have enough problems collecting their own taxes.  As for Florida, yes they have no State tax, but their Property and sales taxes are higher than states with state taxes.  If you want to see how a flat and national tax works, ask someone in Europe.  Their National tax is anywhere from 20 to 40 percent, and their flat tax is approaching anywhere from 30 to 50 percent.  Like it or not, the US tax structure is better than most.  And I do agree, we spend way to much on contractors.

Just to let you also know, I've worked for the IRS for 19+ years and no, I don't even do my own taxes and I don't deal with the tax processing, I do Project management now after programming for 20+ years.  I go to an accountant (IRS employees have a greater chance of getting audited than someone who makes over 150K/yr).

Kol Tov,


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## darbytee (Feb 3, 2007)

With all due respect Jeff, I would expect exactly that response from an employee of the IRS. I would react in a similar way if there was a movement of people trying to eliminate my job. 

As far as the comment "Who do you think is going to collect it, the states", that is the whole point of the fair tax. The federal government still collects the tax, only it is collected as a sales tax based on what each person chooses to purchase rather than an income tax. I understand that the fair tax is a combustible topic. The numbers are easily skewed by anyone trying to promote their side of the issue. I am personally a fan of anything that would take any amount of power away from the government and put it in the hands of the people. 

By the way, I live in Tennessee, which has no state income tax. Our sales tax is only 2% higher than North Carolina, where I used to live and pay state income tax as well as an annual property tax on each of my vehicles. I have no problem paying a higher sales tax since I have a choice in what I buy.


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## jckossoy (Feb 3, 2007)

As far as you expecting that from an IRS employee.  Remember, we have to pay taxes too.  I'm not going to get into a debate of whether a flat or national tax would work.  As I said before, I don't have anything to do with the tax laws, no one in the IRS does.  I'll tell you who you can blame.  It's Congress. We have to collect, but Congress creates the tax laws.  The IRS gets no leeway, even when the tax legislation is passed in mid-December (which tends to happen yearly).  Also, it could be worse.

I will give some examples.  A flat tax of 20% would hurt the poor more than the rich.  A national sales tax would hurt the poor even more, because they really don't have any disposable income.

Think about it for a while.  I've had this same argument with my father-in-law and the figures just don't add up.

Kol Tov,


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## ericw95 (Feb 3, 2007)

Sorry Jeff but I have to disagree. You are throwing out a number of 20% for a flat tax without consideration that even the poor will have more money to spend because they would not have an income tax taken from their paychecks.  

Besides all the loopholes in the tax code would be eliminated.


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## Mikey (Feb 4, 2007)

> _Originally posted by ericw95_
> <br />Sorry Jeff but I have to disagree. You are throwing out a number of 20% for a flat tax without consideration that even the poor will have more money to spend because they would not have an income tax taken from their paychecks.
> 
> Besides all the loopholes in the tax code would be eliminated.



Eric, you would be dead wrong. First, only the federal tax would be different. Each state and city is still free to tax. Last time I checked, I was taxed at the same rate for city and state regardless if I made 20k a year, 40k a year, or more. Second, poor people pay little to no federal tax anyway. In fact, i would put the number at far less than 20%. So, if you started adding 20% to everything, then the poor would be worse off. Heck, not just the poor as defined by the govt, but the people or families making less than say 60k or year or possibly even more.

Also, in my area, taxes on a gallon of gas run roughly .60 a gallon, which is a heck of a lot more than a flat 20%. why, because of state and local. What do you think would happen if the feds reduced that tax on a gallon? The state and local lawmakers would swoop in and take that $$ without us ever seeing a cent in price reduction. Why? They see it as money that we've been paying, so they an benefit from the availability of the $$.

If people really wanted their taxes to mean something, then we've got to push our lawmakers to plug loopholes they give their lobbiests' corporations, and we've got to make them stop spending foolishly. Vote them out often until they get the message.


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## DCBluesman (Feb 4, 2007)

I love debates like this!  If all of the lurkers posted their thoughts, we'd probably have 437 different solutions for the issue of taxation.  Fortunately, that would let ever member of the House of Representatives vote for a different bill. 

The issue of taxation is really not so much about the revenue side as it is about the spending side.  Even with our relatively high taxes, we still have a deficit.  That translates into we the people asking our government to spend money that we are not ready to contribute.  Each of us will argue with some part of the spending and defend other parts.  There really isn't a plurality on most of the spending issues, just a series of compromises.  

Tree huggers think big business should carry more of the burden since polution and destruction is viewed as being caused by big business.  The poor want to tax the rich, saying that their fortunes are made from the sweat of the less fortunate.  Republicans want Democrats to pay.  Liberals want conservatives to pay.  Nationalists want to stop foreign aid.  From every home, a self-indulgent cry is issued.  "Save MY programs and cut the OTHER GUY'S programs...and give me my tax money back."

If it were really as simple as "just tax everyone the same percentage", don't you think some Presidential candidate would do this?  And if it were thought to be workable, wouldn't that make a Congressman or Senator re-electable for life?  

As for the "progressive" tax rates, that is a misnomer.  Our tax rates are progressive within very specific ranges of income....TAXABLE income.  And that's another complaint.  Two taxpayers earn the same amount of income from the same job.  One takes out a loan for a mortgage, the other opts to rent.  The mortgage owner gets to reduce his taxable income for interest and property taxes.  The renter gets no break.  Some see this as the rich getting richer through ownership, albeit subsidized, of real property that appreciates.  Should the government subsidize one taxpayer's investment?

Over the next 2-1/2 months there will be thousands of articles written on this subject.  Read, digest and think about them, trying not to let your bias cloud your intellect.  Reflect on the "other guy's" side of the issues.  There IS an answer out there, but it does not lie in any one person's view.  It will come through a series of reasonable discussions and compromises by by representatives of all walks of life.  At least that's the way it is suppose to work in a representative-based government.

Tax Freedom Day is May 11 this year.  Until then, you are working to pay your municipal and Federal taxes.


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## Chuck B (Feb 4, 2007)

I also do like Dario I have extra taken out & get a decent return at the end of the year. I like it that way.

Chuck


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## jeffj13 (Feb 4, 2007)

> _Originally posted by ericw95_
> <br />.......the poor will have more money to spend because they would not have an income tax taken from their paychecks.
> 
> Besides all the loopholes in the tax code would be eliminated.



Eric,

This would not be true.  As a general rule, the poor pay little to no federal income taxes.  Numbers provided by the IRS show that the top 50% of wage earners pay 96% of federal income taxes. 

Looking at an example, because of the standard deduction, a married couple making less than $17,000 would pay no taxes.  That same couple making $32,000 would pay $1500 in taxes (assuming no deductions for state or local taxes).  Assuming that this couple would need to spend most of their $32000 to live, even a 10% national sales tax would cost this couple significantly more than the current system.

jeff


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## wudnhed (Feb 4, 2007)

I'm glad Tax Freedom Day is May 11th, hubby and I will be in Vegas, yippee![]


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## Ron in Drums PA (Feb 4, 2007)

> _Originally posted by DCBluesman_
> <br />I love debates like this!  If all of the lurkers posted their thoughts, we'd probably have 437 different solutions for the issue of taxation.  Fortunately, that would let ever member of the House of Representatives vote for a different bill.
> 
> The issue of taxation is really not so much about the revenue side as it is about the spending side.  Even with our relatively high taxes, we still have a deficit.  That translates into we the people asking our government to spend money that we are not ready to contribute.  Each of us will argue with some part of the spending and defend other parts.  There really isn't a plurality on most of the spending issues, just a series of compromises.
> ...



Absolutely right.

One more thing to consider, the federal government considers you "the rich" if you own a house, even a small one. 

One way to keep our spending down would be term limits for our congressman and senators. Think of any career politician and you'll see what I mean.



> _John Adams (1735 - 1826)_
> "In my many years I have come to a conclusion that one useless man is a shame, two is a law firm, and three or more is a congress."


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## woodbutcher (Feb 4, 2007)

jckossoy
Member



USA
219 Posts

Member Since:
Feb 09 2004

My Photos
 Posted - Feb 03 2007 :  10:54:53 PM US Eastern Time        
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As far as you expecting that from an IRS employee. Remember, we have to pay taxes too. I'm not going to get into a debate of whether a flat or national tax would work. As I said before, I don't have anything to do with the tax laws, no one in the IRS does. I'll tell you who you can blame. It's Congress. We have to collect, but Congress creates the tax laws. The IRS gets no leeway, even when the tax legislation is passed in mid-December (which tends to happen yearly). Also, it could be worse.

I will give some examples. A flat tax of 20% would hurt the poor more than the rich. A national sales tax would hurt the poor even more, because they really don't have any disposable income.

Think about it for a while. I've had this same argument with my father-in-law and the figures just don't add up.

Kol Tov,


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jeff (Yaakov) in woody Columbia, MD

Everything must be done with joy. Even remorse can be with joy.
--------------------
Sometimes it happens that you set out to do something with the best of intentions -and you end up with what appears the opposite.

Know with absolute certainty -because this is a tradition of our sages -that if your true intent is good, then only good can come out of it. Perhaps not the good you intended -or care for -but good nevertheless.

quotes from the Lubavitcher Rebbe. 


   I gotta give you credit for admitting you work for the IRS. The same agency that gives out wrong information 87% of the time and then penalizes the poor slob dumb enough to believe it. There is another workable wayto collect taxes. Please people read the book! All the concerns Jeff (the tax man) has are addressed there. Congressman John Linder Co wrote the book. It will work and it is time to get the dreaded April 15th off our backs. I cannot explain it all here. You have to read the book. The poor are as well or better considered under this plan. NO one understands the present tax laws. NOT EVEN THE IRS!!! The Fair Tax is not a flat tax. Ken, I challenge you to read the book and explain to me how this plan will not work. All the major book stores have copies at around $10.00 or so. An arguement is meaningless if you stand in ignorance. Like I keep saying Read The Book!


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## woodbutcher (Feb 4, 2007)

jckossoy
Member



USA
219 Posts

Member Since:
Feb 09 2004

My Photos
 Posted - Feb 03 2007 :  10:54:53 PM US Eastern Time        
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As far as you expecting that from an IRS employee. Remember, we have to pay taxes too. I'm not going to get into a debate of whether a flat or national tax would work. As I said before, I don't have anything to do with the tax laws, no one in the IRS does. I'll tell you who you can blame. It's Congress. We have to collect, but Congress creates the tax laws. The IRS gets no leeway, even when the tax legislation is passed in mid-December (which tends to happen yearly). Also, it could be worse.

I will give some examples. A flat tax of 20% would hurt the poor more than the rich. A national sales tax would hurt the poor even more, because they really don't have any disposable income.

Think about it for a while. I've had this same argument with my father-in-law and the figures just don't add up.

Kol Tov,


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jeff (Yaakov) in woody Columbia, MD

Everything must be done with joy. Even remorse can be with joy.
--------------------
Sometimes it happens that you set out to do something with the best of intentions -and you end up with what appears the opposite.

Know with absolute certainty -because this is a tradition of our sages -that if your true intent is good, then only good can come out of it. Perhaps not the good you intended -or care for -but good nevertheless.

quotes from the Lubavitcher Rebbe. 


   I gotta give you credit for admitting you work for the IRS. The same agency that gives out wrong information 87% of the time and then penalizes the poor slob dumb enough to believe it. There is another workable wayto collect taxes. Please people read the book! All the concerns Jeff (the tax man) has are addressed there. Congressman John Linder Co wrote the book. It will work and it is time to get the dreaded April 15th off our backs. I cannot explain it all here. You have to read the book. The poor are as well or better considered under this plan. NO one understands the present tax laws. NOT EVEN THE IRS!!! The Fair Tax is not a flat tax. Ken, I challenge you to read the book and explain to me how this plan will not work. All the major book stores have copies at around $10.00 or so. An arguement is meaningless if you stand in ignorance. Like I keep saying Read The Book!


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## jckossoy (Feb 4, 2007)

One, let get the facts straight.  The IRS does not give 87% misinformation, we give 95% accurate information.  Remember, all the IRS does is collect the taxes, we don't get to keep it.  It all goes to the Treasury.  As has been pointed out several times, taxes pay for alot of the things we all take for granted.  No taxes, no military, no FEMA, no education programs, and this is just a few.  There is no argument that the current tax code is complex. Some of the laws date back to the beginning of the agency.  The programming for the tax code is more complex than the code that launches the Space Shuttle.  And we have it ready to go January 1 every year.

Think about it for a while.

Kol Tov,


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## woodbutcher (Feb 5, 2007)

I HAVE THOUGHT ABOUT IT FOR 50 YRS. Why don't you spend $10.00 and a couple hours and read the book. 95% IS NOT TRUE. 13% IS. I know you are used to telling people where to get off. It won't work here. The IRS is so out of touch with reality. The days of destroying lives to the point of suicide in some cases may be coming to an end. The Fair Tax will easily fund the government and all the pork barrel projects as well. Millions of hours are spent annually to wade through the mindless morass referred to as  a tax code. Don't misunderstand. I am not upset with you. We are fellow turners and I would prefer to remain non antagonistic. Changing thigs will not remove you from work. If you would simply take a look at the Fair Tax Plan You could at least state an  objection to a particular point. Think about it.


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## LEAP (Feb 5, 2007)

Isn't the theme of this forum CASUAL CONVERSATIONS?


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## Dario (Mar 28, 2007)

Update (and to contrast the "IRS SUCKS" post)

Refund received last month.  Paid off the lathe and still have a couple grand tucked away [8D]...actually much less now since I went buying (tools and wood) again [B)]

I like it much better this way than having to scrounge some to pay them.  As I said (and mentioned by some), not the best way to save but works for me.


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## ed4copies (Mar 28, 2007)

Man is best advised to KNOW YOURSELF.  IF this is the method of saving that works best for you, USE it.

I do not want to engage in any "argument" over taxation.  I will say the IRS said I owed them over $300,000 many years ago.  They issued over 100 levies and liens.  About 18 years of arguing, with several different local agents, engaging and paying 3 different attorneys, losing banking relationships, finally going to  "IRS court", where it was determined that we were a "textbook case" of what could go wrong.  We paid the roughly $3,000 we owed and got a full release letter.

Meanwhile I watched a local cop who owned a bar get "worked up" enough over his IRS troubles that he had a heart attack and died.  Local agents are paid to ENFORCE, not attempt to be ACCURATE.  This is, IMO, where the injustice lies.

I believe most of the agents ARE good people, their JOB DESCRIPTION is the problem.

FWIW.

I learned to LIVE WITH life's little challenges.


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## jckossoy (Mar 28, 2007)

Just remember, based on legislation a year or so ago, the IRS has contracted with collection agencies to collect deliquent taxes.  People complained that we are bad, bbut these guys are truly ruthless.  There is pending legislation to cancel this, as it could be considered a Privacy Act violation (Congress passed this not the IRS, we have to obey the laws, too).

Kol Tov,


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## Ron in Drums PA (Mar 28, 2007)

> _Originally posted by jckossoy_
> <br />Just remember, based on legislation a year or so ago, the IRS has contracted with collection agencies to collect deliquent taxes.  People complained that we are bad, bbut these guys are truly ruthless.  There is pending legislation to cancel this, as it could be considered a Privacy Act violation (Congress passed this not the IRS, we have to obey the laws, too).
> 
> Kol Tov,




Uoy got that right, these people only get paid on what they collect. So whose side do you think thet are on?


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## ed4copies (Mar 28, 2007)

You want someone on YOUR side, go to the ADVOCATE.  Doesn't that sound like someone to HELP YOU???

They are trained and paid by the IRS.  THEY don't know the code that DEFENDS taxpayers, as many attorneys don't either.

Thank God for the internet, learn to read the tax code and cite it to them, it won't SOLVE the problem, but it DOES get IRS off your back, to move on to an EASIER target.


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