# Jr Gents II Threads



## chigdon (Oct 19, 2010)

I haven't seen a posting about this but has anyone else had problems with the new threads on the Jr Gents II's.  They are a square thread and misthread very bad as far as I am concerned.  I have talked to several folks over at Craft Supply and their remedy is to eventually have part of it injection molded rather than CNC turned and that may be next year.  It is a serious problem for me - anyone else?


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## chriselle (Oct 20, 2010)

Actually, Chris I just made a Jr. Gent II a few weeks ago where I thought the threads were a little "off" as in it seemed it would be pretty easy to cross thread.  My stock of Jr Gent kits are all mixed up so I don't know what is new or older stock.  I though it was just an isolated case but yes....it will be a concern if I get more like that...


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## PenMan1 (Oct 20, 2010)

THEY ARE HORRID! 

CHECK for "thread" boogers. I bought 100 of them and they all had thread boogers! Got about 30 of them to work acceptably (a bunch got out), tossed the rest. Can't afford to ruin my reputation!

Then see Ed Brown or Ernie MacFarlane for Tritons. Less expensive, better quality, and a new look that sells much better for me!

I'll NEVER buy another Jr. Gent II kit...only warranty issues I've ever had. Fool me once shame on you.....Fool me twice, shame on me!


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## PenMan1 (Oct 20, 2010)

For What it's worth, It's the plastic center band thread adapter that is just WRONG. You can save the tubes, the bright work and the refill. This minimizes your losses!

OR you could send 'em back... and they'll send you more THREAD BOOGERS!


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## turbowagon (Oct 20, 2010)

They also no longer seem to be compatible with the older components.

I tried to swap in a postable endcap from an older kit, and ruined the threads in the cap.


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## PenMan1 (Oct 20, 2010)

turbowagon said:


> They also no longer seem to be compatible with the older components.
> 
> I tried to swap in a postable endcap from an older kit, and ruined the threads in the cap.


 
This is the most FRUSTRATING component set that I no longer make. Joe, if you need parts and pieces, let me know. I;n a packrat. I throw nothing away. But I'm over this plastic P.O.X.


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## SteveG (Oct 20, 2010)

I will add to the clamor. Have been having same issues with Jr Gent II CB threads lately.  Have asked for and gotten replacements from CUSA, and it is hit-or-miss.  Some replacements were just as bad.


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## Chris Bar (Oct 20, 2010)

What happened?  Is the problem where they are made (and where is that....China?).  Was ready to order a bunch to make for Christmas gifts, so now I guess they will need to just use sign language.  Glad I happened upon this post.


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## chriselle (Oct 20, 2010)

YES....just separated out the new Jr. Gent II's and all 8 of the kits have those horrible threads....actually quite unusable.  The vendors selling these kits should be alerted to this.  I won't be using them and won't be buying any more in the future.


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## Lenny (Oct 20, 2010)

I had someone pull one apart thinking it was a snap cap at a recent craft show. Totally destroyed the threads! Guess I can't fault the kit for that one though.


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## chrisk (Oct 20, 2010)

What do you all mean when you say "new": weeks, months...?


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## snemrow (Oct 20, 2010)

*Thread Boogers???*



PenMan1 said:


> THEY ARE HORRID!
> 
> CHECK for "thread" boogers. I bought 100 of them and they all had thread boogers!


 
I'm not familiar with this description, or maybe I'm just not digging deep enough.:tongue: Does anyone have a picture of said booger? Or a more in depth description. I just got a bunch of Jr. Gents for gifts and would like to be able to check them!

Thanks


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## RDH79 (Oct 20, 2010)

To those that have bad ones. Are they the ones that have ARTISAN on the label? This seems to be the new name for them and the newes batch that I have gotten.


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## tbroye (Oct 20, 2010)

I was just getting ready to order some more.  Guess I will hold off or use something different.  I will try the ones Ed sells as a replacement.


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## diamundgem (Oct 20, 2010)

I will throw my 2 cents in also. Yes, I have had problems with the gent 2. I am sitting here now with one that want screw in. I tried to run a tap into the threads to see if they would straighten up but I didn't know the right tap size. It's one of my favorite kits. I hope they get it fixed


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## mick (Oct 20, 2010)

If I'm not mistaken the newer "square threads' were introduced over a year ago so I don't think that's the problem. Now it could be a bad batch...boogers included. I've only ran into one with this problem and it was only on one of the multiple starts. I "chased" the threads by running a dental pick around the threads. Took a few tries but it fixed it.


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## zig613 (Oct 20, 2010)

I experienced the same problem.  I purchased 30 JR Gent II kits (gold titanium) earlier this spring (before they introduced the new name ARTISAN) and had problems with about 6-7 kits.  The caps did not thread on smoothly.  CSUSA provide replacement parts.

I didn't have any problems with the 10 JR Gent II black titanium kits that I had ordered at the same time.

Wade


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## ed4copies (Oct 20, 2010)

tbroye said:


> I was just getting ready to order some more.  Guess I will hold off or use something different.  I will try the ones Ed sells as a replacement.




I have had a couple questions about this, so let me clarify, please.

I purchase CSUSA product from CSUSA--100 kits at a time, and get their standard discounts. (25%)  So my products will be no better or worse than CSUSA, if it is THEIR kit.

I also have started representing Berea as a distributor (same as AS and Ernie at Beartoothwoods).  In that vein, I have the Triton component set (we try not to say "kit").  They are very similar in design to the Jr. Statesman, but about half the price.  PM me and I will invent a "trial program" for you.:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:

But if you purchase the Jr. Gent (and, probably the Jr. Statesman) from me, I appreciate it, but it will be no better than CSUSA offers.    Sorry, the truth hurts!!!:frown::frown:


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## Toni (Oct 20, 2010)

I am not following this thread as I dont know what "boogers" are in relation to threading.  I have a Jr.Gent where the threading came apart. This was the first time I have had a problem with this kit.  I would appreciate if someone could explain it for us dummies


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## toddlajoie (Oct 20, 2010)

I bought my first and only Jr Gent IIs about 6 months ago and thought that it was VERY difficult to get the threads matched up when posting the pen. (yes, threads looked square to me, but since I'm a newbie and these were my first, I didn't think there was anything wrong, and I haven't purchased more simply because I haven't had the opportunity, I do LOVE the kit...) One of the kits was made as a gift and the other is one of my regular carry pens, and it did smooth out after a week or so of use, and now threads easily and regularly every time. Not a "solution" per se, but it is what it is...


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## wizical (Oct 20, 2010)

I just went through my Jr. Gents after reading this thread, mine are fine! bad batch maybe.  But instead of jumping the gun, lets find out what the problem is!


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## pianomanpj (Oct 20, 2010)

I don't know if the following link addresses the issue, but there is an article by Richard Kleinhenz on the Pen Maker's Guild website that discusses a way of dealing with the threads of jr. statesman and jr. gent. You can find it here:
http://www.penmakersguild.com/articles/improvingstatesman.pdf
Hope it helps!


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## Rmartin (Oct 20, 2010)

That's very dissapointing. The Jr. Gent II is one of my favorite pens.


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## phillywood (Oct 20, 2010)

OK, I just ordered my first order of Jr. Gent.s, so should I expect problems according to this thread? I have not received them yet, or do you all suggest that as soon as I get them examine them and send them back or should I rescind the order before those guys shop them?
any advise would be greatly appreciated.


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## Toni (Oct 20, 2010)

Philip I have made a dozen of them and one of them the threading is shot. I dont think they all have threading problems.


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## wizical (Oct 21, 2010)

usually for me, out of ten JR. Gent Kits I buy, one of them will fail....Not every pen kit is perfect and never will be...so instead of jumping the gun and spreading rumors....lets get the facts and to see if there is a fix for it!


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## workinforwood (Oct 21, 2010)

I have some too, and all of them screw together, but some of them it seems like you have to be real gentle and patient to find the sweet spot.  I was thinking this sucks.


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## workinforwood (Oct 21, 2010)

pianomanpj said:


> I don't know if the following link addresses the issue, but there is an article by Richard Kleinhenz on the Pen Maker's Guild website that discusses a way of dealing with the threads of jr. statesman and jr. gent. You can find it here:
> http://www.penmakersguild.com/articles/improvingstatesman.pdf
> Hope it helps!



yea...how many people can even do what he is saying to do???  Me...I CAN do that, but is it in my interest to do so, and why would I have to adapt a kit to make it work in the first place?  I think maybe I have to just make what's left then move on.


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## chriselle (Oct 21, 2010)

OK.....I just looked at this a little more...here's what I'm finding.  The delrin cap thread isn't mating with the metal threads like they used to. ...like it the article posted earlier.  

But, my older Jr. Gent II pens that I made last year all thread fine into the new delrin cap thread.  Which leads me to think that maybe it's the metal threads that are the problem....hmmm.  Let me know what you guys think.


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## chrisk (Oct 21, 2010)

The real problem for all of us is while our final products are one-of-a-kind items, we have to trust mass produced mechanisms... Really disappointing.


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## chrisk (Oct 22, 2010)

Well... seems that I solved the problem with the above negative thought...

I checked about 16 kits (15 RB + Ft Jr Gents II + 1 Jr Statesman) and only 3-4 Jr Gents II Fountain pens had some problem with their threads alignement.

May I suggest that one of us who knows some people at Craft Supplies forwards this topic? And maybe they could give us an official explanation? Seemingly a lot of us are concerned. My 0,00002...


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## kevrob (Oct 22, 2010)

I haven't had a problem with the kits matching up as far as threading is concerned.  I am a little worried though - I kept one of the pens as a "me" pen, and my brand new pen that I made over a month ago had the threads pull out of the cap, well broke out, I didn't pull the cap at all.  I think this may be the same thing Toni eluded to above, so now I too am worried about offering any of these for sale.


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## phillywood (Oct 22, 2010)

Toni said:


> Philip I have made a dozen of them and one of them the threading is shot. I don't think they all have threading problems.


Toni, I can appreciate what you said. I do believe in positive outcome too. However, I look at it this way. these kits are mass produced, but your/our pens are not. the supplier gets paid and they do not deal with your reputation, they don't care what you do with them whether you make them for you or me or sell them, they got paid. On the other hands when we take time to create something then you put in your time and effort and creativity into it and when you hand it over to some one for sale or as a gift your name is on it. If you keep selling or giving away pens that don't hold up then you are going to get a bad reputation as he/she does not care about what kind of pen he sells. this is crucial for our future growth as an artist. i can appreciate what the tutorial says. But in reality why pay for something that you have to go back and try to fix their problem just to keep your reputation form being tarnished?


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## renowb (Oct 22, 2010)

I have had a problem of such on the Classic pens. The threads seem to gall from the boogers or chattering of the threads. Don't know, but I kept that one.


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## ldb2000 (Oct 22, 2010)

Ok first , the article that was mentioned has nothing to do with this problem http://www.penmakersguild.com/articles/improvingstatesman.pdf If anyone had bothered to check that article is dated 6/12/2005 , a little before this problem is mentioned or has everyone been having this problem for 5 years and now just starting to complain . Second , if anyone thinks it will help then just give it a try . It don't take a super penmaker to make a little sleeve to go inside the barrel , and lastly the article also mentions the Jr Statesman , anyone having a problem with them too ? As far as I remember they only changed the Jr Gent threads .
If there is a problem with the Jr Gent design , why is it that we are just hearing about it now ? They changed the thread design well over a year ago to the new square threads and at the time this was hailed as a great improvement . Could it be that there was just a bad run of parts ? If this problem is as widespread as everyone is saying then I'm quite sure that CSUSA has had thousands of reports and they will get it fixed or already have and the new kits are coming .


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## DCBluesman (Oct 22, 2010)

I make a lot of these and did notice when the supplier went to square threads. I'm fortunate in that these new threads have not been unusable for me. A little work breaking in the threads and I've been able to make them work and work well. And they do stay more reliably closed!

I've been around long enough to remember the hew and cry to go to square threads due to caps occasionally coming loose in a shirt pocket. And I remember folks complaining about the double length delrin insert that they use to use. Folks complained that the longer piece of delrin made it difficult to disassemble the pen.

Poof! The supplier made some changes to accommodate the demands of the pen maker.

Let's also look at the other side of the coin, the supplier's perspective. The most expensive Jr. Gentleman component set is $17. If we use a common markup, often cited on this forum, of 4x, that puts the supplier's price at $4.25. From what amounts to $4.25 worth of parts, a $5 piece of barrel material and what some say is less than an hour of work, some expect to get $300 or more for their pen. 

Rather than complaining about the occasional quality isue, perhaps a better approach would be to see if the supplier couldn't provide for better QC and tighter adherence to specs for another $5 - $10 per set of components. Just a thought.


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## workinforwood (Nov 1, 2010)

I don't want to smear any particular company. Yes they made a change, yes CSUSA has obviously distributed a bunch of inserts that are of poor quality. Hopefully they will make a few changes to adjust.  What I do however want to say is that Dayacom did not make these kits. They say that CSUSA has gone to a Chinese supplier to make most of the parts for the JR kits as well as many other kits of theirs. No doubt a move to save some money..I get the business aspect of it. I just want to let people know that Dayacom is most likely not the root of this issue.  Dayacom also told me that they will be stamping all their parts, especially the inserts in the very very near future, so that they can't be blamed for problems not resulting from them. They say they have strict quality control and every threading component is computer matched and hand tested before it leaves.


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## zig613 (Nov 1, 2010)

Jeff...

I have been trying to follow this thread because as noted in my previous post I did experience some issues with the cap not threading smoothly on the JR Gent II I purchased in June.  CSUSA provided a fix by sending replacement parts.

Can you clarify your reference to the Chinese supplier of JR kits.  Are you referring to the Apprentice JR Gent or the JR Gent II kits?  Because the last order of JR Gents II I recieved in June were Daycom kits, at least that is what is printed on the bag.

Thanks,

Wade


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## workinforwood (Nov 2, 2010)

I don't know all the facts or both sides of the story Wade. I talked to Dayacom regarding Jr Gent II pen kits <which also means retro, statesman and a few others> and they said that most of the ones sold by CSUSA are not from Dayacom, they are Chinese clones.


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## DCBluesman (Nov 2, 2010)

My last order of Jr. Gents and Jr. Statesman are in bags marked "Dayacom Taiwan".


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## workinforwood (Nov 2, 2010)

My last order of Jr Gents are in bags that say CSUSA Jr Gent II.


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## zig613 (Nov 2, 2010)

FYI...

I contacted CSUSA earlier this morning re the manufacturer of their JR Gent II kits.  Here is their reply.  Hopefully, this will help clarify some of our discussions in this thread.

Wade

xxxx

Wade,
                Thank you for your inquiry concerning the origin of the Artisan Jr. Gent II/Jr. Statesman II pens.  These are still being made by Dayacom in  Taiwan.  We have not and have no intentions of changing suppliers on these kits.  What may have been mentioned on the forum you saw was our new Apprentice Jr. Gentlemen’s pen.  This is an economy version of the Artisan brand Jr. Gent II.  The Apprentice brand pens do come out of China and as a result the quality is not as high as the Artisan brand pens.  Rest assured Wade that the kits you have been purchasing have been (and will continue to be) made by Dayacom and not outsourced to a different manufacturer.  Please let me know if you have any further questions.

Best Regards,

Sam Gubler | Technical Support


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## workinforwood (Nov 2, 2010)

They don't make it any less confusing! lol.  So I guess I bought Artisan brand kits last time.  You know...I've screwed up my orders at CSUSA so many times I can't count that high..and no doubt every time was me not paying attention..ordering ballpoints instead of rollerballs, or full size gents, or non postable kits..you name it including not understanding the plating ID's, I screwed it up! :biggrin:


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