# Setting up a kid to turn pens on a budget



## jbo_c (Nov 22, 2013)

My son(13) thinks he would like to turn pens and other smalls.

I would like to set him up for Christmas. Need the budget to fall under $300 all up(preferably less). That seems to be a challenge at best, since we have none of the tools.

There's tons of info out there. So much that it's a little frustrating trying to find what I need.

Would like to set him up to be able to turn things like pens, s/p shakers, fishing lures, things in those size ranges. 

My main concern beyond the cost, is set-up. If I'm going to give it to him for Christmas, he's going to want to turn his first pen before he goes to sleep that night. I can't afford not to have all the pieces. So if I go the cheapo route with, say a HF lathe and tools, what extra chucks/mandrels, etc will he have to have. (I'm not above finding a lathe on craigslist, but I still have the same problem and the cost doesn't seem to be much less than the ones at HF, though I realize they might ultimately be higher quality)

I need a list of minimum what he'll need to open boxes and turn a pen on day one and can't seem to find it. Surely there's one out there. I've done lots of reading and not been able to feel like I can nail that down.

Thanks for any help.

Jbo

PS. Yes, I'll expect to be doing some turning myself as well.


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## Smulax (Nov 22, 2013)

Here is a list of what you should start with in my opinion
Safety glasses/ face shield
Lathe
Chisels
Sandpaper (100-400 grit)
Friction polish or wax as a finish
Mandrel 
Bushings
Slimline kit
Blanks
7mm drill bit
Ca glue
Sander or end mill
I'm sure I forgot something that more experienced turners will add
Good luck.  P.S. YouTube might have a video on the topic. 


If you pm me your address I can send you some kits with blanks that already have the tubes in them.


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## jbo_c (Nov 22, 2013)

There is a Grizzly Mini Lathe for sale semi-locally with tools for $150, which seems to be pretty reasonable from what else I've looked at.  Compared to a similar price for the HF lathe and tools with a 20% coupon, the Grizzly may be a much better deal.

I just don't know anything about this stuff.  I'm a tinker with the car guy, not a woodworker.

   Jbo


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## jbo_c (Nov 22, 2013)

Thanks for the offer on the blanks, Smulax.  If I figure out for certain I can afford to do this for him, I may take you up on that.

    Jbo


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## cwolfs69 (Nov 22, 2013)

im sure that a HF lathe would be fine for a start and then your sure of what you are getting. there small one, part #95607, will be fine  Harbor Freight Lathe Page. since Smulax would send you some blanks and kits, i have a mandrel which will fit that lathe, some bushings for slims, a nut and a few blanks for drilling and turning later should you want them. in addition i have some pressure wax i would be glad to include as well. i may eve have an extra pen mill i could spare as well. just drop me a PM and we can discuss what you need. i have some sanding material i can help with as well. 

Anything to help get young folks started in the hobby.


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## cwolfs69 (Nov 22, 2013)

jbo_c said:


> There is a Grizzly Mini Lathe for sale semi-locally with tools for $150, which seems to be pretty reasonable from what else I've looked at.  Compared to a similar price for the HF lathe and tools with a 20% coupon, the Grizzly may be a much better deal.
> 
> I just don't know anything about this stuff.  I'm a tinker with the car guy, not a woodworker.
> 
> Jbo




the HF lathe is $129 and you can getg a 25% coupon on line almost any time. the 20% is always on line.


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## edicehouse (Nov 22, 2013)

Where are you located?  That would make it so maybe some of the people local to you could give you some pointers.  I would be leary of craigslist since you are not too framiliar with the tools and stuff.  Maybe someone local to you would be willing to help you look.


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## jbo_c (Nov 22, 2013)

I'm in Atlanta.  I sure appreciate all the offers for help.  Sounds like I might be able to pull this off.

With the HF lathe, isn't there something I will need to change out from stock as far as the head and tailstocks go?  Need to make sure I pick up those pieces too if I'll need them.

I need to get a book and do some more searching so I'll be a little ahead of him at Christmas and can be at least some help to get him started.

   Jbo


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## jbo_c (Nov 22, 2013)

Oh.  I'm in Gainesville, GA.  - about 40 miles north of Atlanta.

Looking at the HF page, it says that lathe comes with #1MT stocks.  Seems like I've read #2 is really the standard.  That's what I was thinking I would need to change out.  Yes?  No?

Thanks again for all the help.


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## Dan Masshardt (Nov 22, 2013)

He will prob not be turning a pen before bed unless you buy pre tubed blanks or drill and glue them for him in advance.


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## Justturnin (Nov 22, 2013)

I hear the HF lathe is a good one but there are still some other things you need.  If looking for a one stop deal the PSI starter kit looks good and I hear good things about the lathes there too.  About $50 over budget but really simplifies it.  At the very least it gives a short shopping list.

Basic Pen Making Starter Set with Turncrafter Commander 10 in. Multi Speed Midi Lathe at Penn State Industries

If you want to go that route create a log-in and sign up for their emails.  I think they have a 10% off right now.  Usually saves you shipping fees at least.


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## Dan Masshardt (Nov 22, 2013)

Couple things to mention 

You need a way to drill blanks.  Do you own a drill press?

If you use traditional high speed steel tools, you need a way to sharpen them.  This is not optional and he will be frustrated and get nowhere with dull tools. 

As an alternate, you could buy a carbide insert tool to start.  These are very popular with many pen turners. 

I feel like I need to share an opinion though, you are free to disagree.  This is an expensive hobby. Even if you can get him started for $300, are you prepared to spend another $200 or easily more on January to keep him going when it's not Christmas anymore?


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## Alchymist (Nov 22, 2013)

jbo_c said:


> Oh.  I'm in Gainesville, GA.  - about 40 miles north of Atlanta.
> 
> Looking at the HF page, it says that lathe comes with #1MT stocks.  Seems like I've read #2 is really the standard.  That's what I was thinking I would need to change out.  Yes?  No?
> 
> Thanks again for all the help.



No. You can't change it. It is what it is. The #1 taper is a standard taper, just not as common as #2. Only thing about it is that you have to buy all the taper accessories in a #1, and if you later move to a bigger lathe, it will almost certainly be a #2. There are adapters to go from a #2 to a #1, but not an ideal situation. If I were buying any type of wood lathe, minimum would be a #2. However if it's a one and done type of thing, it is a little cheaper.


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## jbo_c (Nov 22, 2013)

Good to know, Dan.  I think SMulax is going to hook me up on that, but I'll know if that doesn't work out.

But your comment does bring up:  I don't have a drill press(yet).  So, A) are there enough options in pre-drilled blanks to keep him busy  and/or B) What will we need to use the lathe to drill blanks?  I've read that's an option, in fact, some seem to think that's the best way.


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## firewhatfire (Nov 22, 2013)

Here the biggest thing you need to know.  Go and take him to this event here.

http://www.penturners.org/forum/f76/21st-georgia-chapter-meeting-116511/

THis is a great group.  They will help him more in one morning than you can get out of all the books available.


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## edicehouse (Nov 22, 2013)

Georgia - International Association of Penturners

Go here.  There are quiet a few members in that area.  Check your local woodcraft, often they have a pen turning demo.  I know the one in the area I live is free.


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## randyrls (Nov 22, 2013)

Yes;   A visit to the local Woodcraft store is always in order.  Also check out the American Association of Woodturners for a local chapter.  They often have members that are will to mentor and you may just be able to take a pen and blank and get a feel for what is involved.


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## Dan Masshardt (Nov 22, 2013)

Drilling on the lathe is a great option.  You need an scroll chuck or dedicated pen blank chuck and a Jacobs drill chuck that fits your tailstock.  

Another $100 or more depending on what you go with.  

Again, my comment about $$. 

Here's an idea.  Why don't you take up turning as well?   It can be something that the two of you share together.  

And you can make shift knobs for your cars.  ;-)


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## jbo_c (Nov 22, 2013)

Good points about the $$ Dan.  If his interest takes off, we'll spend the money.  I'm definitely interested in checking out my interest level too.  Neither of us does much without the other at this stage.  We'll see.

Realistically, I think we'll turn a few pens right away, maybe a pepper mill(that one's me) and probably play with doing some stickbait style fishing lures.  Then interest will fade a little for both of us.  His sprint kayak team will start hitting the lake again and the turning will mostly be a winter pursuit for Christmas and birthday presents mostly.

That's part of why I'm trying to manage the initial outlay as much as possible.  Like I said, we'll see.

I do appreciate all the help.

    Jbo


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## jbo_c (Nov 22, 2013)

I like the idea of a one-stop-shop.  Might be worth the extra $50 since I have no idea what I'm doing.  Wondering if it wouldn't come out about the same as buying separate parts anyway.

Would this one be OK for turning the slightly larger projects I mentioned, like a pepper mill?

Does it really have EVERYTHING to make the first ten pens? 

Finally, I read several pretty unflattering reviews of PennState's customer service last night.  Has anybody dealt with them recently?

Thanks.

    Jbo


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## ed4copies (Nov 22, 2013)

I have a free tutorial on making peppermills and there are numerous YouTube vids on turning pens.  A FREE way to learn the basics.  As you watch, make note of the tools you think you will need.

For peppermills, pay close attention to the "through hole" size-----they are usually 1 & 1/16 inch--not a drillbit found in most "sets".

Good luck, feel free to PM or email me for more info
turning@exoticblanks.com
Ed


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## pinelumber (Nov 22, 2013)

*christmas gift*

Well the HF lathe you really cannot beat for the price.  They have 2 1 bench top 1/3 hp  #95607 on sale for 129.99 and a full sized one #67699 with a 7" disc sander built into the headstock for 139.99 I have a 25% coupon wich would get you down to $112.22 or $97.49 PM me if you are interested in the coupon.  They also have a good deal on stip sandpaper, lathe tools  and small tubes of ca glue. 

Dennis
Pinelumber:bananen_smilies104::RockOn:


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## Dan Masshardt (Nov 22, 2013)

I haven't done a pepper mill yet but it certainly looks more involved.  You need a couple different Forstner bits right and possibly an extension.  And a chuck. And a Jacobs chuck.


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## kovalcik (Nov 22, 2013)

I buy from PSI a lot without any issues. Though I have never needed to call their customer service and never bought a lathe from them. 

The starter kit is pretty good with little fluff. The only thing I see missing from the starter kit is sandpaper, goggles, and paper towels. You will also need something to set the lathe on. 

The only issue I see is I do not know how sharp those tools will be out of the box. If you order before time, maybe take them to someone and have them sharpened and get a quick tutorial on how to use them so you can show your son.


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## Jim Burr (Nov 22, 2013)

I've done a few dozen mills....they do need some level of precision. Couple things I noticed missing from the "Needs" list was a Jacobs chuck or drill press and breathing protection...face mask is more than inappropriate for turning anything.


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## walshjp17 (Nov 22, 2013)

As was noted previously, make sure you have the tools you buy sharpened  by someone who knows how to sharpen lathe tools.  Using the tools as  they come out of the box will be very frustrating as they are no way  near sharp enough to turn anything but the softest of woods -- and that  wont be pleasant either:wink:.

Alternatively,  as Dan noted, you could have your son start out with carbide insert  tools (PSI sells a set and Easy Wood Tools has starter tools) which will  work nicely out of the box.  They will work well with pens, bottle  stoppers and pepper mils, but to get the full experience of turning, he  should learn to use the traditional lathe tools and learn how to sharpen  them.

Visiting a local pen turning or wood turning club is an  excellent idea.  Most clubs welcome young turners and there are folks  with decades of experience who are more than willing to share their  secrets.  He will find many mentors at the IAP and/or AAW affiliated clubs.

As  Ed Brown noted, use YouTube to find videos on pen turning.  In fact, Ed  has a great series for beginning pen turners avialable on both his web  site (Exotic Blanks :: How To Videos) and in the library here on the IAP Forum (look in  the Offsite Tutorials tab).  Chad Schimmel  (Chad Schimmel - YouTube) also has a nice  series for beginning pen turners.

Finally, most Woodcraft stores  have inexpensive classes and pen turning is usually on the schedule  fairly regularly.  Might be a nice father/son outing to take a class  together even if he is the only one who ends up doing the turning.  You  will end up knowing what it takes to make a pen and what he is going  through when he steps up tot he lathe.


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## Olsarge (Nov 22, 2013)

I have been using Penn State for several years and the last few years the customer service has been great.  I ordered on the 19th and 20th and both orders are out for delivery today the 22nd.  I know some people seem to have a problem with Penn State, but from what I have seen and read, they bring it on themselves.  JMO


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## jbo_c (Nov 22, 2013)

Well, I talked to my wife and the full kit from PennState isn't in the budget.  Looks like I'll be getting the HF lathe and sweating over making sure I have everything he needs for that.

I'll be back.

Thanks for the help so far.

    Jbo


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## kovalcik (Nov 22, 2013)

Okay, lets start with SMULax's list since that looked pretty good.

BARE BONES PEN TURNING:

Safety glasses/ face shield 
IMO for turning pens on a mandrel safety glasses are sufficient. 
2 pair $20 ACE hardware

Lathe $130 Harbor Freight

Chisels HSS set of 3, $30 PSI
http://www.pennstateind.com/store/LCPM3.html
( or Carbide pen genie $60 )
Carbide Magic Pen Genie at Penn State Industries
I usually recommend HSS chisels, but since you cannot sharpen, this may be the exception.

Sandpaper (100-400 grit) 5 rolls in a box. $23
Abrasive Rolls: 5 Rolls for Sanding at Penn State Industries
Barrel Trimmer
7mm Basic Barrel Trimmer: Steel Cutter at Penn State Industries
Friction polish or wax as a finish $25
Mandrel #1 MT $18
#1 Morse Taper Maxi-Mandrel at Penn State Industries
Bushings (Come with mandrel)
#1 MT 60 degree live center $20
Live Tailstock Center w/ 60 deg point - #1MT at Penn State Industries
Slimline kit 10 funline chrome $15.50
Funline Slimline Chrome Twist Pen Kit at Penn State Industries
Blanks predrilled, enough for 10 pens no tubes $12
EZ Mini Pen Blanks Hardwood Mix 20 Pack 9/16 in. x 9/16 in. x 2-1/32 in. at Penn State Industries
7mm drill bit (Predrilled blanks )

Ca glue ~$20 (Go to Woodcraft)

Total $314.00 ($344 if you go for the carbide tool)

Sign up for PSI email list and get a 10% off code.  
Have I missed anything crucial?


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## jbo_c (Nov 22, 2013)

Wow.  Thanks for the list.  I do have safety glasses, so that saves me $20.   

And I'll get the 20% coupon at HF to save another $20.

Maybe that'll cover shipping.


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## Dan Masshardt (Nov 22, 2013)

Super glue you already have is fine for getting started.  You can skip ca on a budget.  

If your just messing around, you could probably use some carnauba car wax I something.  Defiantly not ideal, but if the money's not there, you can still make a pen. 

Also on a budget, no need for the sandpaper rolls.  See what you already have.  Go to the hardware store and buy single sheets or a multi pack for literally a couple bucks.


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## firewhatfire (Nov 22, 2013)

Harbor Freight in Atlanta, Georgia with Reviews & Ratings - YP.com


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## Brian G (Nov 22, 2013)

As a novice pen turner that started less than 6 months ago, I recommend a mandrel saver #1 MT Pen Mandrel Saver Package at Penn State Industries set, which lessens the_ need_ for a 60° live center until you decide you _want_ one.

I understand the desire to immediately start making a pen, but if budget is of concern, maybe the first week or so should be focused on learning how to use the lathe and the chisels. You don't have to have pen kits right away. Let your son decide which pen style he'd like to try.  Give him a gift card to one of the vendors, and then he can learn how to place an order on his own.

I think I would have benefitted from turning scrap blanks down to bushing size, and fussing with exactness and technique before jumping right into a pen. Scrap 3/4" blanks, drilled down the center with a 1/4" drill by hand-drill is good enough to start. Practice shapes, sizes, profiles, sanding, and finishing. Then do a pen.

p.s. You're a good dad for encouraging a hobby that might become a life-long passion.


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## Cmiles1985 (Nov 22, 2013)

PSI (via Amazon) has a nice starter set (#3) for $128. It basically has everything but safety glasses and a lathe with #2 MT headstock. For $28 more you can get the kit that includes the pen press (I wish I had bought this kit when I started out). Both kits include hardware and per drilled blanks for ten pens. I had no idea what I was doing when I dove in head first a couple of months ago, but I love turning now! I bought a lathe off of craigslist to start with $120 for the lathe and a scroll saw). Sounds like the larger HF lathe would be ideal if you can't stumble on a good CL/eBay deal. I happened to get lucky on the deal I found. The guy bought a PSI lathe in '91 and ended up never using it! Good luck to you and your son, and I hope everything works out!


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## stonepecker (Nov 22, 2013)

At the age of 13 you are making an investment that is more then common.

I would take him to several group meetings. See if there is a starting class or class instrustions in your area. Get him started this way BEFORE putting out the kind of cash you are talking about. Even a local turner that is willing to instruct him is better then spending on this hobby only to have him loose interest 6 month later.

JMHO

P.S.......  And I also am willing to send you some blanks if your son takes to the hobby.  Just send me a PM with your address.


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## sschering (Nov 22, 2013)

For a first set of pen kits I really liked the single tube starter kit from PSI..

You get to try a few different styles that all used a 3/8 tube..
I had a lot of fun with it.
Single Tube Pen Bundle: 5 Pen Kits, FREE drill bit and FREE Bushings at Penn State Industries

From day 1 I did turn between centers..  I'd rather spend $$ on a live center and dead center than a mandrel set..

Only down side is tbc slimline bushings are hard to get these days but you can fake it with the slimline manderel bushings and a piece of 6mm brass tubing or rod.
the rest of the standard bushings are fairly easy to get..


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## JD Combs Sr (Nov 22, 2013)

Brian G said:


> ...I understand the desire to immediately start making a pen, but if budget is of concern, maybe the first week or so should be focused on learning how to use the lathe and the chisels. You don't have to have pen kits right away. Let your son decide which pen style he'd like to try.  Give him a gift card to one of the vendors, and then he can learn how to place an order on his own.
> 
> I think I would have benefitted from turning scrap blanks down to bushing size, and fussing with exactness and technique before jumping right into a pen. Scrap 3/4" blanks, drilled down the center with a 1/4" drill by hand-drill is good enough to start. Practice shapes, sizes, profiles, sanding, and finishing. Then do a pen.
> 
> p.s. You're a good dad for encouraging a hobby that might become a life-long passion.


Ditto what Brian said. And BTW you can get good results in pen turning with a single carbide tool such as the "Pen Genie" and you can use your lathe tail stock as a pen press, just fit a piece of hard wood or plastic into the head stock hole and another into the tail stock hole(or get these) and presto you have a pen press.  With it you don't have to get sharping equipment.


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## TDE (Nov 22, 2013)

You can also get sandpaper rolls at harbor freight. It only has four rolls the finest is 400 grit but it is only $10.00 Good luck. Ted


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## Woodkiller (Nov 23, 2013)

Woodcraft here is having a Black Friday sale & they have a package of 30 slim lines & 30 blanks for $60. I don't think you can beat that deal anywhere, and that should be a great start. 
You can ask around at work or wherever and find a woodworker that may drill your blanks for you. You can go to Ace & get sandpaper for under $1 a sheet that will last a while. You can get a toggle clamp & a 2x4 & make a pen press for a few bucks. I got some toggle clamps at tractor supply for $5 each. 
 I use a harbor freight mini lathe & have for a while with no problems. It works and my full size craftsman is collecting dust.  I really feel bad about it too. 
While at harbor freight, get some of the plastic divided boxes they have to organize your bushings, tubes, etc. in. It helps a lot. 
Get a bottle of CA glue & some one step polish, it is fairly simple to use and works well. 
Spend hours on YouTube watching videos. After a while you will know just about enough to get started, this forum will fill in all the blanks. 

Later on if you guys decide to stick with it, look into dust collection( shop vac or dust collector), sharpening system of some sort, bandsaw to cut your own blanks from found woods, disk sander(lots of uses), & a casting kit to make your own blanks. You can easily get carried away here, so be careful & have fun together.


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## jbo_c (Nov 23, 2013)

More good info.  Thanks.

So "Woodcraft" is a store name.  I was thinking everybody was just talking about any store that sold woodworking supplies.  Don't know where one is locally.  I'll have to see how to find out if we have a good place.  I'm sure in Atlanta somewhere, but I don't get down the much.

   Jbo


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## Dan Masshardt (Nov 23, 2013)

jbo_c said:


> More good info.  Thanks.  So "Woodcraft" is a store name.  I was thinking everybody was just talking about any store that sold woodworking supplies.  Don't know where one is locally.  I'll have to see how to find out if we have a good place.  I'm sure in Atlanta somewhere, but I don't get down the much.  Jbo


  I'm sure you'll be fine in Atlanta finding places.  But home improvement stores won't be much help for pen stuff

Woodcraft is a chain of franchises.  If you sign up for the local stores email they may send you a 10% off coupon.  

Also, getting in their list will give you a coupon for your birthday month.


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## Drb007 (Nov 23, 2013)

I agree with Dan about the caution of $$$. My daughter turns 3-5 days a week and has been doing so for the last year. I was a bit surprised at how much I spent to get started. My dad loaned up his Jet mini lathe and I still spent hundreds on all the little things. Since then I have purchased two lathes of our own. However, she is definitely sticking with this, so now the costs are mostly covered by her profits in selling her stuff. Teaches her how to balance her books

On the other hand, my dad's neighbor went with the HF lathe and I bet he has less than $300 in his set up. 

One thing I didn't see on anyone's list...micro polishing pads. Let's you get a MUCH better finish on anything you turn. Worth the money!!


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