# Canon SX 160 on sale



## Sylvanite

If you're looking for a decent camera at a rock-bottom price, Canon currently has the PowerShot SX 160 IS (in either black or red) refurbished on sale for $49.99 (normally $135.99).

Canon PowerShot SX160 IS Black Refurbished | Canon Online Store
Canon PowerShot SX160 IS Red Refurbished | Canon Online Store

This is not the greatest camera in the world, but it's plenty capable of taking good pen photos.  I bought one last year.  Most people can't tell the difference between pics taken with it, and with a fancy DSLR.  

I hope that helps,
Eric


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## Dan Masshardt

Black is out if stock.  Ordered a red.  Free shipping.  Thanks for the tip.


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## its_virgil

Eric,
I have that camera and really like it for taking pen pictures. I has manual settings as well as auto.But, I suppose you already know that since you are researching it. I really like having the manual setting...I rarely use the auto features. That is the main reason I have that camera. I also have the prior version of it but the screen has stopped working. The macro setting is really nice.
At that price I may just get me another. Thanks.

My only complaint: Mine uses 2 AA batteries and they don't seem to last very long. 

Do a good turn daily!
Don



Sylvanite said:


> If you're looking for a decent camera at a rock-bottom price, Canon currently has the PowerShot SX 160 IS (in either black or red) refurbished on sale for $49.99 (normally $135.99).
> 
> Canon PowerShot SX160 IS Black Refurbished | Canon Online Store
> Canon PowerShot SX160 IS Red Refurbished | Canon Online Store
> 
> This is not the greatest camera in the world, but it's plenty capable of taking good pen photos.  I bought one last year.  Most people can't tell the difference between pics taken with it, and with a fancy DSLR.
> 
> I hope that helps,
> Eric


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## its_virgil

...and I think Dan got the last red one. If I miss the free shipping I will bill Dan for it:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:

I will keep checking back.
Do a good turn daily!

Don



Dan Masshardt said:


> Black is out if stock.  Ordered a red.  Free shipping.  Thanks for the tip.


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## Sylvanite

its_virgil said:


> I will keep checking back.


Check back again.  I was just able to add both red and black to my shopping cart.

I agree that the batteries don't last as l'd like.  I use rechargeable AA batteries and sometimes have to swap them out during a photo session.  The SX 170 is basically the same camera with a rechargeable battery.  It's on sale (refurbished) for $99.99. 

Regards,
Eric


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## Sylvanite

Black is back in stock


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## its_virgil

Got one. Thnx
Don


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## keithbyrd

How does the sx160 compare to the Canon Powershot Elph 100HS = I have had mine for about a year and was thinking about upgrading.


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## traderdon55

Got one ordered. Once it comes in maybe I will be able to figure out how to post pictures.


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## lyonsacc

Just ordered one.  Now I have to go reread some of your "how to" photo posts.


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## alphageek

HUGE tip for those of you that have (or get) any of the powershot SX series that take 2 AA batteries.

They are weird with batteries... Even rechargeable don't work so hot.   I think it has something to do with the power curve in the camera.

However, in my experience there is a solution... Try a set of Energizer E2 Lithium.   They are NOT rechargeable, and they are a bit more expensive than normal batteries, but they last a VERY long time.   

If you have one of these cameras, I recommend picking up at least one set... Keep your current batteries as a backup and see if I'm right.   I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

Dean


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## Sylvanite

alphageek said:


> HUGE tip for those of you that have (or get) any of the powershot SX series that take 2 AA batteries...


Dean,

Great tip, thanks.  I have a charger that recharges alkaline batteries (which last longer than NiMH), but lithium batteries will indeed have a far greater life.

AA vs. rechargeable battery is not always an easy choice.  In general, I prefer a built-in rechargeable, but for those who travel and may have charger issues, AA batteries are available pretty much worldwide.

Regards,
Eric


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## Sylvanite

For those who may be concerned about image quality, here are a few pen pics that I took with this camera:

















and, of course, this one:






Regards,
Eric


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## thewishman

I got one. Should I send it along with the pens that need to be photographed to you, Eric?:wink:

Your photography is so beautiful!


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## SDB777

Remember, 
Overall refurbished goods will have a shorter life span than that of a new model, however, you buy the refurb'd item at a lesser amount to the new model(that is supposed to make up for the life). 

Test everything when you receive the refurb'd item immediately!  Can't stress that enough...that way if there is still a problem, you might be able to get a return on it.(yes, these refurbs are supposed to be tested before being sent back out into the world).


Canon makes a fine product, the question you need to ask when buying refurb'd items...why is there so many available?






Scott (just saying, research before jumping off the bridge) B


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## Sylvanite

SDB777 said:


> Overall refurbished goods will have a shorter life span than that of a new model...


I disagree.  A lot of "refurbished" products are simply retailer returns.  These are not "used" cameras and there's no discernible wear. 



> Test everything when you receive the refurb'd item immediately!  ...that way if there is still a problem, you might be able to get a return on it.


Definitely *do* test out all the features when you receive the camera.  Unlike most refurbished products which come with a reduced warranty period however,  there's a full one year warranty.  You definitely *CAN* (no "might" about it) return the camera if there's a problem - Canon even includes an RMA label in the box.



> ... the question you need to ask when buying refurb'd items...why is there so many available?


Because every warranted product has some percentage of returns, and Canon sold a ton of these cameras.

If you want more information about what buying "refurbished" gets you, see Refurbished Products.


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## Chuck Key

> HUGE tip



What about AC power options for those long pen photo sessions?  Possibly something like this.

BestBatt.com - Canon CA-PS800 Replacement Digital Camera AC Power Adapter / Charger With DR-DC10 Coupler Cable

John


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## Sylvanite

Chuck Key said:


> What about AC power options for those long pen photo sessions?  Possibly something like this.
> 
> BestBatt.com - Canon CA-PS800 Replacement Digital Camera AC Power Adapter / Charger With DR-DC10 Coupler Cable


If you decide to buy this power adapter, you can get 8% off with the coupon code "HOLIDAY2014".

Regards,
Eric


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## Sylvanite

*Marked Down Even More!*

It looks like red is still out-of-stock, but Canon has marked down the black version to only $44.99!


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## BruceA

*Snagged a black one for $44.99 yesterday!*

Eric, 
This is an awesome tip you've shared! Thanks!

Just to confirm, your three sample pictures shown in your post above...
Are they taken at @ 3ft??  I read your other post about your standard method being that distance.


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## volozhin

Got one. Thanks for the tip.


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## Sylvanite

BruceA said:


> Just to confirm, your three sample pictures shown in your post above...  Are they taken at @ 3ft??


Yes, all of the above photos were taken with the camera placed approximately 3 feet from the pen.

Regards,
Eric


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## farmer

*AC kit*



Sylvanite said:


> its_virgil said:
> 
> 
> 
> I will keep checking back.
> 
> 
> 
> Check back again.  I was just able to add both red and black to my shopping cart.
> 
> I agree that the batteries don't last as l'd like.  I use rechargeable AA batteries and sometimes have to swap them out during a photo session.  The SX 170 is basically the same camera with a rechargeable battery.  It's on sale (refurbished) for $99.99.
> 
> Regards,
> Eric
Click to expand...

 
Its almost as much as the camera.
Canon AC Adapter Kit ACK-800 | Canon Online Store
But you don't have to buy batteries.
Farmer


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## BruceA

Farmer, see Chuck Key's post #17 for the link to the Canon AC Adapter kit for $18.50 - There's a discount code I used from Sylvanite where I purchased the item with shipping for under $21.  For studio work with pens, that's the way to go.


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## farmer

*batteries*



BruceA said:


> Farmer, see Chuck Key's post #17 for the link to the Canon AC Adapter kit for $18.50 - There's a discount code I used from Sylvanite where I purchased the item with shipping for under $21.  For studio work with pens, that's the way to go.


 
Thank you Bruce 

Both of my cameras a gripped and i have extra batteries ,
I can shoot for a day or two when I am doing product shots.
Out in the field I am good for a day or two too.

I have more camera gear then skills.

Farmer


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## BruceA

Eric, do you have any previous posts with pictures of your photo setup?  I'm trying to visualize your 3' distance from pen-to-camera.  Are you using any zoom?  I received my SX160is today, and worked with it for a while.  It's a step towards more control than the my other Canon SD780is that doesn't have manual controls. Thanks-


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## thewishman

BruceA said:


> Eric, do you have any previous posts with pictures of your photo setup?  I'm trying to visualize your 3' distance from pen-to-camera.  Are you using any zoom?  I received my SX160is today, and worked with it for a while.  It's a step towards more control than the my other Canon SD780is that doesn't have manual controls. Thanks-




Hey Bruce,

I just got mine, also. Planning to read through this list of Eric's photography threads in the next few days:

http://www.penturners.org/forum/sea...plog_searchinfo=1&photoplog_searchquery=photo

These may not have the answer to your question, but I was gathering them for myself and thought it would be nice to share.


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## LarryDNJR

How does that one compare to the Canon Powershot A2300?


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## KenV

Thanks for the Tip, Eric.

Upgraded from a Canon of ancient stature to this one.


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## Sylvanite

BruceA said:


> Eric, do you have any previous posts with pictures of your photo setup?  I'm trying to visualize your 3' distance from pen-to-camera.  Are you using any zoom?


Check out http://www.penturners.org/forum/f24/pen-photography-putting-concept-into-practice-128555/.  I didn't include a picture of the camera on the tripod, but if you ran a tape measure (line-of-sight) from the camera to the pen, it would read about 3 feet.  With my DSLR, I typically shoot at a distance of about 2 to 2.5 feet (see http://www.penturners.org/forum/f24/photography-basics-perspective-122430/ for an explanation why), but when zoomed in to fill the frame (yes, I did use the zoom), the SX 160 would not focus closer than 3ft.  That's a reasonable compromise.

Does that answer your question, or would a photo help?

Regards,
Eric


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## BruceA

Eric, Thanks for your explanation.  After I asked the question a couple days ago, I searched on your User Name and "Photo" and found all your articles - and READ THEM.  

Your results speak for themselves as far as a viable approach.  I have been an adherent to the Gerry Rhoades / Ed Davidson method of photographing a pen in a horizontal position straight on.  YOUR photos are crystal clear, using an angle for the shot.  But I think part of your success is that you are FURTHER away from the pen, and your depth of field is not as much of an issue when trying to shoot at 12-14" straight on.   

I would like to see a picture of your setup, too, so I can fully understand the size of your light tent and distances.  I'm using a white translucent Plexiglas 12" square - I might be able to make that work with my new Canon SX160is by setting the tripod back 2-3' and zooming in a bit, then cropping to square - shooting down a bit.

I appreciate again your heads-up on the Canon SX160is deal.  It's got many/most of the same controls as my Canon T3i, which is usually commandeered by my teenage daughter! So it's a good solution for pens.


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## Sylvanite

BruceA said:


> I think part of your success is that you are FURTHER away from the pen, and your depth of field is not as much of an issue when trying to shoot at 12-14" straight on.


Depth-of-field (DoF) is primarly determined by three things (there are other factors, but they are not as significant).  Those are:
Distance.  The greater the distance between the camera and the focal point, the greater the DoF.
Focal length.  The shorter the lens focal length, the greater the DoF.
Aperture.  The smaller the aperture (higher f/stop number), the greater the DoF.
  If you frame the pen the same way using a zoom lens, then when you move closer, you'll shorten the focal length.  One factor reduces DoF and the other increases it.  Whether the combination yields less or more, you can still use aperture to achieve the desired depth-of-field.

Take another look at http://www.penturners.org/forum/f24/photography-basics-perspective-122430/.  In the first photo, the camera was very close (6" or less) yet the entire pen is in focus despite being at an angle.  If that's the perspective you want in your pen photo, then place the camera close and zoom to a wide angle.  As I said before, I generally find that photographing a pen from a distance approximating arm's length yields a more natural looking perspective, which is why I usually shoot from about 2-3 ft away.

At either distance, it isn't necessary to photograph a pen flat.  Choose whatever angle suits your desired composition and then set the aperture to achieve sufficient depth-of-field.

I hope that helps,
Eric


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## Sylvanite

LarryDNJR said:


> How does that one compare to the Canon Powershot A2300?


Take a look at Canon SX160 IS vs Canon A2300 Detailed Comparison


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## Sylvanite

keithbyrd said:


> How does the sx160 compare to the Canon Powershot Elph 100HS.



Check out Canon SX160 IS vs Canon ELPH 100 HS Detailed Comparison


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## dogcatcher

My order got here today, the disc that comes with the camera, my player on my computer has cratered, do I need to use it or can I jus stumble through without it.  Hate to et another computer just for that issue.  My Nikons didn't need a disc player.


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## Sylvanite

dogcatcher said:


> ... the disc that comes with the camera, my player on my computer has cratered, do I need to use it or can I jus stumble through without it.


The disk contains the manual (in pdf format) and some bundled software (file transfer and image editing).  You can get the manual here.  If you have a different image editor, you won't need the bundled software, and you can always transfer files either directly from the SD card (if you have a card reader) or by connecting the camera via USB where it appears like a mass storage device.

So, in short, you don't have to use the included disk to use the camera.

I hope that helps,
Eric


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## dogcatcher

Thank you, I am off to get a new SD card and try this out on the grandkids.


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## Sylvanite

*The advantage of a point-and-shoot camera*

Although compact digital cameras are generally less capable than larger Digital-Single-Lens-Reflex (DSLR) cameras, I'd like to note that small-sensor cameras can sometimes be advantageous.  Pen photography is a case in point.

To explain, let's perform a thought experiment with three imaginary cameras: 
A Canon Powershot SX 160 IS,
An APS-C camera with a crop factor of 1.6 such as the Canon 60D, and
A full-frame 35mm digital camera.
  In this experiment, we'll try to take the same pen photograph (same perspective, same depth-of-field, same field-of-view, and same exposure) with each.  Then we'll see what camera settings we'll need to use to accomplish that feat.  I'll try to keep the technical lingo to a miniimum.

Let's start with the SX160.  It has a 1/2.3" sensor (a mere 6.17mm wide).  That is about 1/5 the area (actually a bit less) of a full-frame 35mm camera.  In photo terms, This camera has a "crop factor" of 5.2.  Don't read too much into that, it's simply a way to compare the "field-of-view" that different cameras have.  Anyway, let's say that we've taken a pen photo with the following settings:
*Distance* - 3 ft away from the pen (to get approximately arms-length perspective).
*Lens Focal Length* - 40mm so that the pen fills the frame.
*ISO* - 100 for minimum digital noise.
*Aperture* - f/4 so the entire pen is in focus.
*Shutter Speed* - 1/30 second (given the available light).
Now let's try to take an identical photo with the APS-C camera.  To get the same perspective, we'll have to put the camera at the same location (remember, perspective is solely a function of distance).  In order to fill the frame (same field-of-view), we'll have to use a 135mm lens (crop factor 5.2 vs 1.6 - the sensor is bigger, so we'll need to zoom in).  We'll keep ISO at 100.  Now, here's where things get tricky.  Depth-of-Field (DoF) is primarily a function of distance, focal length, and aperture.  We've kept the distance the same, but increased the focal length.  To match the DoF, we'll have to use a smaller aperture (higher f/ number).  It turns out that the necessary aperture is f/16. See A Flexible Depth of Field Calculator if you want to play with the numbers yourself.  That is a difference of 4 f/stops - and each stop halves the amount of light transmitted.  In order to achieve the same exposure, we'll have to use a 16 times longer shutter speed - or about 1/2 second.  To recap, those settings are:
*Distance* - 3 ft away from the pen.
*Lens Focal Length* - 135mm.
*ISO* - 100.
*Aperture* - f/16.
*Shutter Speed* - 1/2 second.
Switching to the full-frame 35mm DSLR, to take the same picture, we'd need to use these settings:
*Distance* - 3 ft away from the pen.
*Lens Focal Length* - 200mm.
*ISO* - 100.
*Aperture* - f/22.
*Shutter Speed* - 1 second.
Let's talk about camera shake.  The general rule of thumb is that if you're shooting handheld, then in order to avoid motion blur, you have to use a shutter speed of 1/(lens focal length) or faster.  With image stabilization, that number gets smaller.  The SX 160 IS does have optical image stabilization, so you should indeed be able to use a 40mm lens focal length at 1/30 second without blur.

There's no way (even with image stabilization), however, that you can handhold a 135mm lens for 1/2 a second, let alone a 200mm lens for a full second.  You'll have to use a tripod (and either remote shutter release or self-timer).  Moreover, those shutter speeds are also sensitive to shake from the mirror moving and vibrations from the floor.  For best results, you'll also need to use mirror-lock-up and stand still during the exposure.

If you want a faster shutter speed with the DSLRs, you'll need more light - which translates to more expensive studio equipment.

So, I hope you see that a compact digital camera can have its advantages.

Regards,
Eric


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## BruceA

*Picture of AC Adapter for Canon SX160is*


View in Gallery

This AC Adapter is the one mentioned previously, sourced from here: BestBatt.com - Canon CA-PS800 Replacement Digital Camera AC Power Adapter / Charger With DR-DC10 Coupler Cable

For @ $22., it's worth considering.


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## BruceA

*Using the Canon SX160is*


View in Gallery

Distance: 28 inches from camera
f/7.1
ISO 100
Auto White Balance
1/30th sec exposure
Focal Length 22.2mm, equivalent to 131mm in 35mm Film
+1 Exposure (difficult to get a white background without increasing the exp.)
Lightroom 4 for slight tweak on Clarity, and spot removal
Used overhead and left and right softboxes with 4 bulbs in each

Observations: seems that shooting in the 112 to 131mm equivalent zoom range provides better focus and sharpness.  I used Aperture Priority to try to get the highest number f-stop.  I even used a white-card for custom exposure, and it was still difficult to get a white background.


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## thewishman

That looks nice and focused to me. I'm waiting on my tripod and SD card to come tomorrow... Hurry up, UPS!


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## Dan Masshardt

thewishman said:


> That looks nice and focused to me. I'm waiting on my tripod and SD card to come tomorrow... Hurry up, UPS!



Where does one find a decent tripod reasonably priced?


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## thewishman

http://www.amazon.com/AmazonBasics-60-Inch-Lightweight-Tripod-Bag/dp/B005KP473Q/ref=zg_bs_499310_1

I got this one for $21.49. (Looks like I got the last one) I'm planning to use it in my basement, so I didn't need anything too light or too heavy duty. I wanted a pan head and a quick release - after using a borrowed tripod and camera, the screwing and unscrewing of the camera got old really fast.

The reviews look good. I'll tell you more about it when I get it.


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## BruceA

*Any ideas for a quick-release method?*

Wishman, you bring up a good point - having to mount and then unscrew the Canon SX160 to "any" tripod - the door for removing the SD card necessitates removing the camera.  There's no angle it can be turned while mounted that gives enough clearance to open the battery/SD card door. 

Can anyone make a recommendation on some kind of mount that would work as a quick-release plate but doesn't cover the SD card door?? Some kind of male/female plates that mount between the camera and the tripod top...


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## Sylvanite

BruceA said:


> Wishman, you bring up a good point - having to mount and then unscrew the Canon SX160 to "any" tripod - the door for removing the SD card necessitates removing the camera.  There's no angle it can be turned while mounted that gives enough clearance to open the battery/SD card door.
> 
> Can anyone make a recommendation on some kind of mount that would work as a quick-release plate but doesn't cover the SD card door?? Some kind of male/female plates that mount between the camera and the tripod top...


It wouldn't be that difficult to fabricate a 2" standoff for the tripod screw.  It's a standard 1/4"x20 thread.  I'd go ahead and make one for myself, except that I've taken to using the USB cable to connect the camera, rather than taking out the SD card.

Regards,
Eric


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## thewishman

Yeah, that was my plan, too. Forget taking the quick release plate off, just hook up the cable to the port on the side of the camera


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## dogcatcher

I use a mono pod, homemade version of a shortened walking stick, that the top 2 inches screw off reveling a 1/4-20 shaft.  It works while we are out side as a camera mount, and have used it inside also.  Not as good as a tripod, but better than nothing.


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## thewishman

I REALLY like this tripod. It arrived about 30 minutes ago and I almost loaded it on the quick release plate before I remembered that I needed to install the SD card first. The plate pops off with the release of a latch and is easily removable with a tabbed screw from the bottom side.

At full height it seems plenty sturdy and can be very easily moved into about any position. Well worth the $21.49 price.


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## woodyoureally

I had been shooting my pen pictures with my smartphone and a DIY lightbox and was getting less than ideal results. I grabbed one of these and purchased a cheap light box on Amazon. I am still play with settings, distances, etc but I am Much happier with what I am getting now. Any C&C is certainly welcome.


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## farmer

*pen pictures*



woodyoureally said:


> I had been shooting my pen pictures with my smartphone and a DIY lightbox and was getting less than ideal results. I grabbed one of these and purchased a cheap light box on Amazon. I am still play with settings, distances, etc but I am Much happier with what I am getting now. Any C&C is certainly welcome.


 

#3 is underexposed, I really I thought all of your photos were a little dark to be honest.

I don't why you guys are hell bent to use lighting that has electromagnetic polarized light in it without filtering out the polarized light.
So when the polarized light strikes ANY non metallic SMOOTH surface IT is not TURNNED INTO POLARIZED REFLECTION  AKA GLARE.

You cannot control angle of reflection in a tent.......................
You cannot control polarized light inside a tent inless you make another tent inside Made with linear polarized film, and if that is the case you wouldn't need the light tent after you made the linear polarized tent inside.

If you use a LED flash light you do not need to us polarized filters because LED lighting doesn't emit polarized light.
If you use LED lighting to light up your light tent, by defusing the LED light then you once again created polarized light.

To use LED lighting and you don't want Polarized light in it the LED lighting needs to be direct.

Other words shine the LED light directly on the pen, do not defuse or reflect the LED lighting.

Or use a CPL on you lens and linear polarized film over your  tungsten flash lighting system.

Best is buy the book Light science and Magic and figure it out yourself so you fully understand how to control light and not have light controlling your pictures Exposure.



The Book Light science and Magic will educate you on understanding light


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## Sylvanite

farmer said:


> I don't why you guys are hell bent to use lighting that has electromagnetic polarized light in it without filtering out the polarized light.
> So when the polarized light strikes ANY non metallic SMOOTH surface IT is not TURNNED INTO POLARIZED REFLECTION  AKA GLARE.


Let's discuss what "polarization" is, and how it occurs.  Light emitted by most sources (including Incandescent bulbs, fluorescent bulbs, LEDs, and the Sun) is not polarized.  It can become polarized either by passing through a polarizing filter, or by reflecting off certain surfaces.  Unpolarized light can be thought of as consisting of two equal amounts of light polarized perpendicularly to each other.  When light polarized in one direction is removed (by the filter or reflection), then the remaining light is polarized in the other direction.  Non-conductive surfaces, such as water, glass, or glossy plastic finishes, tend to produce polarized reflections.  Conductive surfaces, like metal, generally do not.

Now, about glare.  Glare itself is not necessarily bad.  It provides the specular highlights that give shape and depth to curved surfaces.  It also reveals the quality of a high-gloss finish.  The trick is to show the right amount of glare.  Glare can be either polarized or unpolarized.  A polarizing filter can remove polarized glare, but not unpolarized glare.

Either way, a light tent's purpose is not to control glare.  Rather, it is to provide illumination from a very wide "family of angles" (to use a phrase from the book "Light - Science & Magic".  Surrounding the item to be photographed with light from all directions helps show off curved reflective surfaces - such as the metal components of a pen.  If you don't illuminate the entire "family of angles" of those parts, you'll wind up with dark (potentially black) spots.  I encourage you to read the next chapter of Light - Science & Magic, titled "Metal".  It discusses ways to manage unpolarized glare and includes a section on using a light tent.  My copy is the fourth edition, and "Using a Tent" begins on page 151.



> You cannot control angle of reflection in a tent.......................


Yes, I can.  Careful placement of small black or white objects, such as bits of paper, within the tent (but outside the field of view) can provide extra highlights or edge definition.  Black tape on the light tent wall can reduce or eliminate hot spots.  An object between the lights and the light tent wall (a.k.a. "gobo") can control the size, shape, and position of a reflective highlight (i.e. glare).

Don't get too hung up on polarization.  Although the polarizing filter is one tool for cutting glare, it is not the only one.  It also does not work in all circumstances.  Remember, "if the direct reflection is polarized, a lens polarizing filter will get rid of it.... If, however, the subject is a glossy box, we more often save the polarizer as a next-to-last resort" (_Light - Science & Magic, fourth edition, p. 114_).

I hope that helps,
Eric


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## farmer

*Study of Light*



Sylvanite said:


> farmer said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't why you guys are hell bent to use lighting that has electromagnetic polarized light in it without filtering out the polarized light.
> So when the polarized light strikes ANY non metallic SMOOTH surface IT is not TURNNED INTO POLARIZED REFLECTION  AKA GLARE.
> 
> 
> 
> Let's discuss what "polarization" is, and how it occurs.  Light emitted by most sources (including Incandescent bulbs, fluorescent bulbs, LEDs, and the Sun) is not polarized.  It can become polarized either by passing through a polarizing filter, or by reflecting off certain surfaces.  Unpolarized light can be thought of as consisting of two equal amounts of light polarized perpendicularly to each other.  When light polarized in one direction is removed (by the filter or reflection), then the remaining light is polarized in the other direction.  Non-conductive surfaces, such as water, glass, or glossy plastic finishes, tend to produce polarized reflections.  Conductive surfaces, like metal, generally do not.
> 
> Now, about glare.  Glare itself is not necessarily bad.  It provides the specular highlights that give shape and depth to curved surfaces.  It also reveals the quality of a high-gloss finish.  The trick is to show the right amount of glare.  Glare can be either polarized or unpolarized.  A polarizing filter can remove polarized glare, but not unpolarized glare.
> 
> Either way, a light tent's purpose is not to control glare.  Rather, it is to provide illumination from a very wide "family of angles" (to use a phrase from the book "Light - Science & Magic".  Surrounding the item to be photographed with light from all directions helps show off curved reflective surfaces - such as the metal components of a pen.  If you don't illuminate the entire "family of angles" of those parts, you'll wind up with dark (potentially black) spots.  I encourage you to read the next chapter of Light - Science & Magic, titled "Metal".  It discusses ways to manage unpolarized glare and includes a section on using a light tent.  My copy is the fourth edition, and "Using a Tent" begins on page 151.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You cannot control angle of reflection in a tent.......................
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yes, I can.  Careful placement of small black or white objects, such as bits of paper, within the tent (but outside the field of view) can provide extra highlights or edge definition.  Black tape on the light tent wall can reduce or eliminate hot spots.  An object between the lights and the light tent wall (a.k.a. "gobo") can control the size, shape, and position of a reflective highlight (i.e. glare).
> 
> Don't get too hung up on polarization.  Although the polarizing filter is one tool for cutting glare, it is not the only one.  It also does not work in all circumstances.  Remember, "if the direct reflection is polarized, a lens polarizing filter will get rid of it.... If, however, the subject is a glossy box, we more often save the polarizer as a next-to-last resort" (_Light - Science & Magic, fourth edition, p. 114_).
> 
> I hope that helps,
> Eric
Click to expand...

 
You should start a thread on the study of light.

Most sources of light are classified as incoherent and unpolarized (or only "partially polarized") because they consist of a random mixture of waves having different spatial characteristics, frequencies (wavelengths), phases, and polarization states. However for understanding electromagnetic waves and polarization in particular, it is easiest to just consider coherent plane waves; these are sinusoidal waves of one particular direction (or wavevector), frequency, phase, and polarization state. Characterizing an optical system in relation to a plane wave with those given parameters can then be used to predict its response to a more general case, since a wave with any specified spatial structure can be decomposed into a combination of plane waves (its so-called angular spectrum). And incoherent states can be modeled stochastically as a weighted combination of such uncorrelated waves with some distribution of frequencies (its _spectrum_), phases, and polarizations.

partially polarized light still has polarized light in it...........................
Enough to white out some of the surface on All smooth surfaces.
By time the suns light reaches us, the light has been defused enough to have Polarized light in it.
Go out side on a sunny clear day and take photograph of a something chrome. With out a CPL on your lens.
Or just like the metal pieces in your pens,if the reflection from the metal piece is blue then the light is polarized..................

Go to the lake on a sunny clear day and look at the water without polarized sunglasses and notice the water is blinding you with glare.
That glare is polarized reflection and uv reflection.
But most of the blinding reflection is polarized light striking a smooth surface.

All defused light is polarized......................
The dust in the air is enough to add polarized light to your light striking the subject.

Starting at the bottom of page 61 ( Doing the Impossible and surface appearances ) it  show just exactly how polarized light and polarized reflection is nothing less then blinding.
Read from 61 to page 66.

I hope this helps you understand.

Farmer.

Ps I will do tests on bare bulb tungsten lighting.
Up to this point all of my lighting has been defused and has polarized light.
Just like the suns rays that have traveled millions of miles of space dust that has been defused too and contains polarized light.


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## Sylvanite

Don't confuse diffuse light with polarized light.  Diffuse light may or may not be polarized.  Polarized light may or may not be diffuse.  Diffusers do not necessarily polarize light, just as polarizers do not necessarily diffuse light.  Light tents are intended to produce diffuse light, not polarized light.

I hope that helps,
Eric


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## SteveG

Light, in most cases, is better than dark. That is my story and I am sticking with it.


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## Sylvanite

BruceA said:


> I'm trying to visualize your 3' distance from pen-to-camera. ...
> 
> I would like to see a picture of your setup, too, so I can fully understand the size of your light tent and distances.


I set things up again and took a couple of snapshots of my "studio".  I removed  one wall of the light tent to show how things are laid out inside.  I also propped a yardstick up on the camera so you can see that it is just about 3ft away from the pen.











*About that 3 feet*

I don't want to give the impression that this camera doesn't focus closer than 3ft.  It does.  In fact, it can focus as close as 1.5 inches at the widest zoom (5mm focal length).  To illustrate, here is a picture taken from just 1 foot away (and a focal length of 12mm).






Minimum focus distance, however, changes with focal length.  As you zoom in, the minimum focus distance increases (to a point - then it drops back down some again).  At 20mm focal length, the closest you can focus is about 2 feet, as shown by this picture.






You'll notice that at this combination of zoom (focal length) and distance, the pen does not fill the frame.  That is, the field-of-view is wider than I'd like.  I'd have to crop the image, losing a fair amount of photo resolution in the process.

Practically speaking, that wouldn't really have been a problem.  16 mega-pixels is enough that I could easily tolerate the necessary cropping.  But, instead of doing that with my previously shown photos, I chose to back off another foot so I could zoom in and fill the frame.  It was a trade-off between desired perspective and desired megapixels.  I chose one way, but you can easily choose differently.

If you're playing around with this camera, note that as you zoom in and out, a scale appears at the top of the display screen, showing exactly what the minimum focus distance is.  That will help you pick the amount of zoom (focal length) necessary to focus on the pen.  If a green box appears when you press the shutter release button halfway, then the camera was able to focus successfully.  If a yellow box and exclamation mark appear, however, the camera did not achieve focus.  The camera will still take the picture - it will simply be out of focus (blurry).

Some of the photos I've seen posted make me suspect that they were taken at a focal length and distance combination that prevented proper focus.

I hope that helps,
Eric


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## thewishman

Eric,
Thanks for your continuing guidance. Learning photography is not coming easily - your instructions and advice are helping me improve.


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## SDB777

Surprised this topic has gone from a Canon for sale to a Wiki page reprint....neat.




Scott (but why?) B


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## thewishman

Set up your Kool-aid stand where the people are.:wink:


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## triw51

I received mine yesterday now.. Where is the best place to get a memory card?


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## Dan Masshardt

triw51 said:


> I received mine yesterday now.. Where is the best place to get a memory card?


amazon seems much cheaper than local places.  I need one too.


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## traderdon55

triw51 said:


> I received mine yesterday now.. Where is the best place to get a memory card?



I ordered mine from adorama.com. I bought the Sandisc 8gb for $5.95 with free shipping.


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## BruceA

*Liking this Canon SX160!*

Thanks to the help given here on using this great little camera.  Using the 32-36" distance, with zoom, and f8.0.  Two second timer.  ISO 100.  Finding that using the +1 exposure gives the brightness needed for dark pens on a white background.  This is a key piece of the puzzle - increase the exposure!

The depth of field works out well, even on the angled pen.  


View in Gallery

This is the 24kt Executive kit (Woodturningz.com and PSI) with an "Autumn" blank from Richard Greenwald's site.  This pen is a great size to carry.  The blank on this uses a 3/8" drill, and is the same length as the Carbara/Polaris pens.  Nice length to show off the blank.


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## woodyoureally

I got my new Canon set up. New light tent set up and have been playing around with lighting and layout. Picture one was taken in October with my DIY light box and cell phone. Photo two was with the new set up. All the colors are much more true to life with the new set up. Still tweaking but much happier with the results.


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## Sylvanite

Sylvanite said:


> BruceA said:
> 
> 
> 
> ... having to mount and then unscrew the Canon SX160 to "any" tripod - the door for removing the SD card necessitates removing the camera.  There's no angle it can be turned while mounted that gives enough clearance to open the battery/SD card door.
> 
> Can anyone make a recommendation on some kind of mount that would work as a quick-release plate but doesn't cover the SD card door?
> 
> 
> 
> It wouldn't be that difficult to fabricate a 2" standoff for the tripod screw.  It's a standard 1/4"x20 thread.
Click to expand...

I decided to "put my money where my mouth is" and made myself a tripod standoff:






I took a piece of 1/2" aluminum rod and cut/tapped 1/4" x 20 tpi threads on the ends.  For grins, I went ahead and knurled it too (a mediocre knurling job, but not too bad for a first try).  I originally planned to make it out of opaque alumilite scrap, but was afraid the threads might break off in the camera.

Here's a snapshot of the standoff installed, with the battery / sd card door open.  






The post is longer than necessary for the door, but a good length for me to get my fingers in.

I hope that was interesting,
Eric


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