# Kitless Pen



## BKelley (Oct 25, 2010)

I think I would like to go kitless.  I looked at members pics and see a lot of fine craftsmanship.  I have a question, WHAT IS KITLESS?  To be considered kitless what may be used and what cannot.  Can I use a transmission from a kit or nib?  At the present I am making an aluminum pen using the nib, transmission and clip from a slim line kit.  If it comes out to my expectations I will post pic.


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## BRobbins629 (Oct 25, 2010)

There is no real good definition and sometimes the line is blurred between kit and kitless.  If a kit pen is one that you buy all the components as a set, turn a blank glued to one or two brass tubes and assemble according to directions, then a kitless is one where you don't do this.


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## jskeen (Oct 25, 2010)

Good question.  There is really "kitless" where nothing from any kit is used at all, and there is "Less-Kit" where the look and function of the pen is changed, but some parts are used.  Both are a legitimate expression of ones ingenuity and artistic vision, and one may or may not bring more than the other, depending on workmanship, quality and function.  At comparable levels, "kitless" will probably be worth more than "less kit" but not always.  Both will probably bring more than a comparable "stock kit" pen however.  YMMV of course.


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## DCBluesman (Oct 25, 2010)

I'm not at all certain we need a definition, but if we do then we need only look to the construct of the idea. In "kit pen", the word kit is used as an adjective, modifying the word pen. By using the adjective modifier "less", we are using a comparative form of the adjective meaning opposite. If you agree with my premise, then there is only one logical conclusion. Kit pens are those constructed from a given set of components. Kitless would be a pen constructed with anything other than the complete set of components.

As for less kit or kitless pens commanding a premium over kit pens, with only one or two exceptions I find this to be untrue. The exceptions I can think of are certain of Bruce Boone's and certain of Brian Gisi's pens.


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## ldb2000 (Oct 25, 2010)

I had tried to get a consensus on what defines a kitless pen but the definition couldn't be agreed upon so I gave up . As far as I'm concerned things like transmissions and FP nibs and feeds are beyond the average home shop to create so these parts are not included in my definition . All other parts are very machinable so they are where I draw the line . I buy transmissions in bulk as well as FP nibs/feeds and click mechanisms and the pens I make using those parts I consider "Kitless" . Hybrid pens I make using nose cones and tubes and clips , still bought in bulk , I consider modified kit or customized kit pens .


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## jskeen (Oct 25, 2010)

DCBluesman said:


> As for less kit or kitless pens commanding a premium over kit pens, with only one or two exceptions I find this to be untrue. The exceptions I can think of are certain of Bruce Boone's and certain of Brian Gisi's pens.



While I don't even vaguely claim that my kit pens are at the same level as yours, Lou, I do find that a closed end pen, or one with a custom finial and or trim ring in the centerband will move faster and bring more than a stock kit.  I can't make true kitless, one off pens like one of Chris's here: http://www.penturners.org/forum/showthread.php?t=63855 
or one of skippy's like this  http://www.penturners.org/forum/showthread.php?t=63335
but I suspect they might sell at a premium over a jr gent or statesman.  One of these days I might get good enough to find out 

James


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