# A note on Pen Mill group buy



## Daniel (Apr 13, 2009)

For a long list of reasons that I will not go into. there are about 10 orders from the last group buy that have still not been mailed.
the primary reason is that payments where not maid to my pay pal account with addresses included. and I have had no way to pay for the postage. lots of reasons for that but that is the way it is now.

I am still working on getting money moved around but can no longer afford to have group buy money passing through my personal checking account. it drastically inflates what my income looks like when $10,000 in group buy money passes through my checking account in a couple of months. this situation nearly cost my daughter medical care now that she is pregnant.

Traditional suppliers still acept payments of every kind. 
thanks


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## keithkarl2007 (Apr 25, 2009)

so what happens now?


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## workinforwood (May 5, 2009)

Right, I was just thinking about what was up with the mills?  I must be one of the ten people.  PM me if you are trying to find my address.  I don't care about the wrench, but sure could use those mill heads.  I don't mind if you put them in a cheap envelope and send them ground..that only takes an extra day or two.

Not sure what this means either...Traditional suppliers still acept payments of every kind.?


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## keithkarl2007 (May 5, 2009)

beats me, hope they arrive soon as i need them also


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## workinforwood (May 5, 2009)

I don't know Keith.  I see Daniel has another Buy on the go, so that should take care of finding money to ship with I'd think.


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## Daniel (May 6, 2009)

well since people are starting to guess at just what the problems are.

Jeff, you are not even on my list as having an order. not sure why I will contact you.

if payment is made through pay pal I can print and label packages without leaving my living room. I can drop them on my front porch and my job is done. it takes about two minutes per order. with 75 packages to process this is still 3 hours if everything runs smoothly and that does not include packaging the mills in the first place.
when payment is not made through pay pal I have to hand write postage, take it to the post office and stand in line sometimes for as much as an hour. Usually my wife woudl do this. I have made posts in the past that the size of group buys was creating problems. one of those is that my wife will no longer haul packages to the post office. so now they have to wait until I am going which is almost never.
at this time I have two packages from the pen mill buy that have not been mailed. both are to foreign countries. Both payed by pay pal but for some reason I cannot print the postage through pay pal. I am working on just what the problem is. The alternative is to transfer the money to my personal bank account and take the packages to the post office.
two problems with this. one money from group buys can no longer pass through my personal bank account, no exceptions. two the time it takes to take packages to the post office.
the other solution is to simply refund the payments and be done with the problem.

In short pay pal recently made changes that make it so that either payments to me, for products or for postage either happen through my pay pal account or they do not happen.
this means I cannot pay for mill heads through Western Union anymore. I cannot pay for postage unless int is printed from my pay pal account. i cannot order parts for 50cal pens or pen stands. I cannot even buy pen kits for pens that are ordered on my web site.
In short the changes with pay pal have very likely shut down group buys. and by the way I started the leather pen case buy before I started the pen mill buy. I am just still trying to get it done. Also notice that I started and dropped a group buy for taps and dies in the same time span.
multiple buys do not necessarily all progress at the same pace. each have their own problems and I am working to resolve those. they also will not be resolved at the same pace.


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## Daniel (May 6, 2009)

Jeff, I found your order. it was not on the group buy list because it was not part of the group buy. I sent you a PM.


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## alphageek (May 6, 2009)

I would like to put in my 2 cents here.... Daniel did good things for these buys and is a stand up guy IMO.   The post office ripped open my package and lost some of my mills and Daniel sent replacements on his own dime.

Daniel - I understand keeping your paypal separate from your checking.   In case you havn't looked into it - check out the paypal debit card.   It would be a way to pull money out of paypal for paying for shipping w/o having to go through your account.   You could even use it at the post office w/o causing any additional fees.


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## Woodlvr (May 6, 2009)

Daniel, I do not know how you do it, keeping these things going. I need a vacation bad, would you like me to drive over ( I am just over in SLC, Utah) and give you a hand.:biggrin:  I hope that this all works out for you with the least amount of stress possible. I used to want to do a CSUSA group buy, but if I did it I would have to pay state sales tax:frown: and there would go our discount. Take care buddy, I am sure that we all can somewhat understand how hard that it is to do all of this and keep the details straight.


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## Daniel (May 6, 2009)

Pay Pal's debit card policy is one of the changes they made that shut down my ability to make payments for almost everything. They now require that you have a credit card on file with them. I do not own a credit card, and won't. they have my bank account info, not sure why that is not good enough. Anyway the Debit card was nice, I don't have one anymore.


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## workinforwood (May 6, 2009)

I appologize for interpreting the initial post as being an issue with shipping funds.  It takes a lot of Cahonie's to do a group buy.  The issue here is communication on both ends.  One person perhaps communicates, but his issue is different than all the rest and is easily forgotten.  The controller of the buy maybe doesn't have a good note kept on that extra issue.  The customer doesn't keep in touch..it's  a two sided fault.  Sorry bout that Daniel.  Somehow we need a more uniform system.  I think paypal should be kept out of the loop too.  I'd be in for mailing a cheque.


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## Daniel (May 6, 2009)

Jeff regardless of what it took to get it there, you package is on the way.
Keith I am working on yours but is it is being very stubborn.
I had one other package going to England, hope you know who you are. you had everything right with your pay pal payment but pay pal is messing up and refuses to print your shipping label. in short the two foreign orders that I cannot get shipped through pay pal I will take to the post office and pay postage out of my pocket. basically enough is enough and this is beyond enough even for me.
the England bound package is labeled and ready to go. Keith you have been updated per our private conversation. one way or another your package will get mailed.
as far as I know that will settle any issues concerning the last group buy.


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## keithkarl2007 (May 6, 2009)

sweet, ya know i would've paid the extra mailing if you asked nicely :biggrin::biggrin: ah no thanks a lot really appreciate it


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## wolftat (May 12, 2009)

Daniel, after having just started my first group buy, I take my hat off to you. It has taken many hours of work and hundreds of PMs and emails, and I haven't even ordered the products yet from the distributer. I am looking at another couple days worth of work to get the orders all sorted and shipped, and I am doing a small buy. I don't know how people like you and Chris and the others do the large buys, but I have gained a whole new level of respect for you.


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## Daniel (May 12, 2009)

Thanks Neil, Yes it is work. Just like moderating or coming up with new ways to do things. But it is done because when it all gets sorted out I like doing it. Sure there are times when things get a little sideways but in all it is something I like doing. I would not suggest anyone takes on a group buy thinking hey I can save on shipping by doing a group buy. go get an extra job for a couple of days. you will be money ahead and it will take far less work lol.


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