# Why 7mm?



## tharp (Oct 25, 2007)

Does anyone else feel the same as I do? Why 7mm?
I mean, why can't I just go down to the hardware store and buy a drill bit if I lose or break mine?
I didn't question this until my wife asked what I was ordering on line. I said "a drill bit". She said " don't you have a ton already?.
I said yes, but this one is a "special" one. When she asked what was so special about it, I commented that it was the size of it. She said "Holy Cow, it must be huge".. uh, no dear, it's only 7mm. Then back to the original question "Don't you already have a ton"?
I know... rant, rant, rant. but WHY 7MM?
I mean, I've heard others talk about size "J", but the hardware here just looks at me funny.
WHY 7MM? I want to use my normal set of drill bits. UGGGGGGHH. I want a NORMAL pen kit.
Sorry for the rant but I only had one bit and I can't find it..  WAHHHHHHHHH. 
Tom


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## Nolan (Oct 25, 2007)

Just use a J (7.036mm) or 9/32 (7.142mm) bit


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## les-smith (Oct 25, 2007)

7mm is what the pen/drill bit companies call job security.


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## alparent (Oct 25, 2007)

I use 9/32. I got a bit set of a gabazilion bits for 50$ Got all numbers, all letter and bits up to 1/2". I can do all the pens kits (almost) with them. Only need to get bits for kits bigger then 1/2", and these are hard to lose and hard to break.


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## redfishsc (Oct 25, 2007)

Actually, if I had to bet on it (which us baptists don't do) I would have to say that 7mm is NOT the number they shot for. I would say it is a by-product of using a 1/4" mandrel.

The tube for a 7mm pen fits just right onto a 1/4" mandrel, a cheap steel rod threaded in various ways for various configurations. Then add the thickness of the brass tube walls, and you get a 7mm drill bit (or the J or 9/32).


Now, when it comes to the fact that nearly every pen needs a different size drill bit than every other pen, you got some fightin' grounds for sure. 

And aside from that is the way every company pushes friction polish as "the stuff" when in reality it is a waste of money, shellac, wax, time, and friction.


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## alparent (Oct 25, 2007)

I know! When I first started I got a bunch of finishing stuff (that I used only once because the results where.......you know!)Got them just because the catalogue was pushing it as THE "easy, fast, even you can do it" pen finish.

Now they are resting in the bottom of a box never to be used again (waste of $$$)

Maybe this would make a good poll?


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## workinforwood (Oct 25, 2007)

If you ask me, it's those canadian's with their dang metric system that does this to us! []


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## mikemac (Oct 25, 2007)

HEY.. don't blame us.. I'm unable to find a 12.5 MM for the Gent Jrs, (I know, its close to 1/2, but not close enough).

I'm gonnna have to order from the States


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## Rmartin (Oct 25, 2007)

I hate the metric system almost as much as I hate the Celsius temperature scale.

Rmartin


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## louisbry (Oct 25, 2007)

When you first start making pens you always need the bit you don't have.


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## gerryr (Oct 25, 2007)

The metric system for measurement is the only truly consistent and easy to understand system there is, everything is either a multiple of or divisible by 10.  What could be easier?  The problem is that we inherited part of the English system, and just to prove our arrogance we stick with it while most of the world is metric.  At least we didn't get stuck with stones for weight.

And, BTW, 1/2" works just fine for Junior caps.  I've made plenty of them using a 1/2" bit.


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## wood-of-1kind (Oct 25, 2007)

> _Originally posted by mikemac_
> <br />HEY.. don't blame us.. I'm unable to find a 12.5 MM for the Gent Jrs, (I know, its close to 1/2, but not close enough).
> 
> I'm gonnna have to order from the States



Not so fast Mike. There is ONE (1) Canadian drill manufacturer left and I'm ordering METRIC drill bits direct. I plan to offer these (select sizes to start) very shortly. And yes, 12.5 mm is one size along with 10.5 mm to do the Jr's.

-Peter-[]


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## workinforwood (Oct 25, 2007)

yes, since that was brought up, what is a stone?  I see it one some of the mixed martial arts fights, but I have no idea how many pounds is a stone?


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## kirkfranks (Oct 25, 2007)

Just remember that where they make these pen kits they MOST LIKELY CAN go to the local hardware store an pick up a 7mm drill bit any day of the week.
They would probably not be able to find the 9/32.

It's all a matter of perspective.


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## hrigg (Oct 25, 2007)

A stone equals 14 pounds, with the probable exception of kidney stones.


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## maxwell_smart007 (Oct 25, 2007)

I like the fact that ONE thing, finally, is done the way the majority of the world does it...metric's the language of the world - only we NAmericaners speak in imperial...

(which is odd - there's no Emperor, after all!)

Apparently, I need coffee - post dinner weirdness!


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## Grizzlyss (Oct 25, 2007)

Like Mikemac said, don't blame us. Canadians were dead set against metric but trudeau had other ideas, and he rammed it up our %$#. But what Gerryr said is true, I must admit. But when it comes to trying to visualize the size of something I still think in Imperial, I still can't think in cm and mm, or even metres. Must be that age thing, I didn't get forced into it until 15 or 16 if I remember correctly, but unfortunately, these days I rarely do. LOL.

Sheldon


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## tharp (Oct 25, 2007)

Okay, I TRIED a 9/32, it slipped right out and the glue never adhered. I'm not sure, but I THOUGHT I heard laughing. As far as "lettered like J", The local hardware store thought I was nuts when I went down there. And it's an ACE store. Go figure.
Maybe just 3 more days before my metric bit comes. I think MM stands for "Money Moochers"
Ã¶Â¿Ã¶
 ~
Tom


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## workinforwood (Oct 26, 2007)

Could take more than 3 days, it may never show.  I have a $400 CSUSA order for 2 day delivery UPS, well it's been 3 days.  @#%$@ UPS driver can't find my house!  I have sold all my inventory and only have a couple tubes to work on and no kits, but I do have drill bits []  I can only guess the regular driver is on vacation because my house is not hard to find...Just look for the guy standing out front with a megaphone saying ...well you can fill that part in []


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## maxwell_smart007 (Oct 26, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Grizzlyss_
> <br />Like Mikemac said, don't blame us. Canadians were dead set against metric but trudeau had other ideas, and he rammed it up our %$#. But what Gerryr said is true, I must admit. But when it comes to trying to visualize the size of something I still think in Imperial, I still can't think in cm and mm, or even metres. Must be that age thing, I didn't get forced into it until 15 or 16 if I remember correctly, but unfortunately, these days I rarely do. LOL.
> 
> Sheldon



I guess that's the difference - I grew up with Metric, so it's a lot easier to think in Metric than imperial - base ten makes more sense to me than base...?  What's the base of imperial?  

As for having it rammed down 'our' throats, I think most of what Trudeau did was against the political currents of some, but he tended to get people on his side in the end...

As far as metric goes, I wish more things were Metric up here - the hybrid Metric sometimes and Imperial other times is just too inefficient...and it's weird thinking in Kilometres and litres, and then having people talk about miles per gallon...one or the other!


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## leehljp (Oct 26, 2007)

The only one I hate to calculate is the kilometers per liter range. Otherwise I can go with either one. Temps, weight, sizes, OK.


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## tharp (Oct 26, 2007)

Yes, but Canadians decided to get rid of their dollar bill and implemented the Loonies. We just send our loonies to Washington :-(
.... Before anyone flames me, I didn't say which ones. 
Just kidding guys.
I like traveling to Canada. With the exchange rate, I'm only 35 years old.
BTW, Victoria is GORGEOUS!
Okay, now that we sorted that out, Does ANYONE make pen kits in the US?
Tom


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## jrc (Oct 26, 2007)

I drill alot of highly figured woods that the bit wants to drift and sometimes the grain wants to close back in and the tube is very tight in the blank.  I've been using a 9/32 bullet tip bit from Woodturningz for the last 2 years and they work great.


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## gerryr (Oct 26, 2007)

> _Originally posted by tharp_
> <br />Okay, I TRIED a 9/32, it slipped right out and the glue never adhered. I'm not sure, but I THOUGHT I heard laughing. As far as "lettered like J", The local hardware store thought I was nuts when I went down there. And it's an ACE store. Go figure.



If you used thin CA, it may well not work.  I've used "J", 7mm, 9/32, and even used an "I" bit a couple of times.  They all work, but I always put a LOT of glue on the tube before I slide it in.

As far as being able to find a letter bit at someplace like Ace Hardware, forget it.  Same thing with Lowe's or HD.  If you live in a decent sized town, look in the yellow pages under tools and find an industrial supplier.  They will have letter and number sized bits.


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## cdcarter (Oct 26, 2007)

I just keep my Harbor Freight super bit set and digital caliper handy and choose the bit out of the big red box that is closest to the measurement of the tube. That's usually tighter than the holes I drill with the bits from the houses.


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## redfishsc (Oct 27, 2007)

> _Originally posted by cdcarter_
> <br />I just keep my Harbor Freight super bit set and digital caliper handy and choose the bit out of the big red box that is closest to the measurement of the tube. That's usually tighter than the holes I drill with the bits from the houses.



For $40, there is your "almost always the perfect size" answer. I do the exact same thing.


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## tharp (Oct 27, 2007)

What are the long-term effects? Has anyone had problems with the tube walking away over time? I mean, if you can use a 9/32 for instance, why do so many people promote the 7mm? I'm still baffled.
So again, does anyone in the US make pen kits?
Tom


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## W3DRM (Nov 17, 2007)

As a very new pen turner, I have read that if you use the 9/32 drill for 7mm tubes you have to use a glue that expands and fills the voids around the tube as it cures. Gorilla glue is such a glue while I don't think CA glue expands much during their curing process. The downside of using Gorilla type glue is that you have to wait overnight or 24 hours to begin your turning.


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## DCBluesman (Nov 17, 2007)

Whenever I make a kit that calls for a 7mm tube, I drill 9/32 and use either Gorilla Glue or Thick CA.  And NO, there are no U.S. manufacturers of pen kits at this time.


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## R2 (Nov 17, 2007)

Open Minds anyone? I'm old enough to have learnt the British Imperial system at school and then had to teach the metric system. We in Oz have also been copping American cars and TV for so long it's not funny, so we had to accustomize ourselves to US pints and gallons. We also cope with both spelling systems, not to mention some quirky American grammar
I've been surprised when I've been in the States at the things I couln't buy considering the size of the market and the obvious economic clout that the Us has throughout the Americas.
 Without wishing to be offensive, I've never really been able to understand why there is such a closed mind in America to so many "foreign" goods and ideas.
Perhaps there is an opening here for a US based IAP member to look at importing 7mm drill bits as specialist line.[][]


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## Larry Gottlieb (Nov 17, 2007)

The combination of a 9/32" bullet bit and polyurethane glue works well.
No rush to glue tube.
Need patience to wait overnight to turn.

Larry
http://webpages.charter.net/lgottlieb2/


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