# Finishing with Dr. Woodshop Q's



## phsv (Dec 2, 2014)

I read in entirely the process that Mike recommended using this product. But I have a few questions between two of their products. 

Would you recommend buying both the Walnut Oil/Carnauba Wax /Shellac Woodturning Finish and Pens Plus or would it be overkill? Would one replace the other? I am having hard time understanding the difference between the two based on the write-up on their website.

I am planning on using the Walnut Finish Oil too. 

Thank you,

Pedro


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## Wildman (Dec 2, 2014)

Depends upon amount of sheen you want.  Walnut oil will give you a matt finish.  Walnut oil/ Carnauba wax/ & Shellac or Pens Plus will give more sheen initially but also have sheen fade back over time with use.  

Depending upon sheen looking for and wood using will affect finial appearance.  Also who and how pen is used.  All three finishes will give the look and feel of natural wood, when talk about sheen fade back talking about going from gloss to semi-gloss, to matt eventually.  

Have a Cherry (closed grain) wood click pen finished over ten years ago with a Shellac friction product and sheen is light semi-gloss.  If had use Oak (open grain) wood sheen might appear matt. 

I might buy both but not at the same time, would buy one with intention of trying the other later if not satisfied or still curious.  Will be interested in what others have to say.


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## phsv (Dec 2, 2014)

Thank you for your feedback. I was considering buying all three at the same time but I think it would be best to test one at a time and start to understand how they work with the wood.


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## Dan Masshardt (Dec 2, 2014)

Just use the pens plus.  Don't worry about the other mixes.


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## Janster (Dec 2, 2014)

Dan Masshardt said:


> Just use the pens plus.  Don't worry about the other mixes.



...explanation of the application PLEASE and THANKS...Jan


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## mark james (Dec 2, 2014)

I have bought/used both:  Dr's Pens Plus, and Dr's Woodshop.

My opinion only...  Both will fade over time.  Both will give a nice Matte finish.

I suspect the Pens Plus will give a slightly longer sheen.  When I have used it (15+ light coats) I have been happy with the finish.

I have started using the Dr's Woodshop finish for some of my bird houses, and have ben happy with the result.  A nice matte finish, not very shiny, but a nice overall finish.

I would easily buy both again (and eventually will!).

Have FUN!


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## Dan Masshardt (Dec 2, 2014)

I'd be interested to hear the feedback on the shine over time from someone who's carried one for awhile.  

I've not carried one long enough myself to say from first hand experience. 

I hear lots of people make comments based on other brands of friction finish.  

For me, it's a good finish.  There is no doubt that it's not ca.  It just has a different look then the deep ca.  Looks more skin to ca with blo though. 

I'm experimenting with letting the finish sit a day or more before handing.  I'll continue to do this for awhile because I think it might help.  

I'm wondering whether the walnut oil having some time to set is beneficial.


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## BSea (Dec 2, 2014)

I bought both the walnut oil, and the Pens Plus.  I've used just walnut oil, and that gives a mat finish once it dries.  Pen plus will give more sheen, and gets somewhat close to CA initially.  I use Mikes method of sanding with the walnut oil.  That works better than just using Pen's Plus. 

But I don't like using Pens Plus on softer wood.  It goes to a mat finish very fast.  But on harder woods it retains it's sheen much longer.


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## phsv (Dec 2, 2014)

Thank you all for sharing your experience about using Dr's products. 

Bob, what do you usually use on softer wood if you don't use the Pens Plus?

So pretty much from what I have read around the forum and hear is that friction polish will eventually turn to matte, but we there is still no definite timeframe.

Dan, you mentioned ca with blo, what is blo? (noob quesion)


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## Dan Masshardt (Dec 3, 2014)

Boiled linseed oil


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## Dan Masshardt (Dec 3, 2014)

And I'm not convinced dr pens plus will turn to matte.


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## Wildman (Dec 3, 2014)

There is nothing proprietary about Dr. Woodshop products, have a look at Ron Brown’s best.  

Ron Brown's Best Walnut Oil Finishes

I cannot name all the friction finishes/polishes available to pen/woodturners.  basically what they all have in common is Lacquer/Shellac, Wax, & Oil.  Yes some will give you more sheen than others only because amount of ketone resin in the product.  See MSDS in documents at Dr.’s Woodshop which is more of a history lesson.

http://www.doctorswoodshop.com/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=WlgpEgvssy4=&tabid=74&mid=428

 Will find same resins in these products which wood carvers, furniture refinishers, and pen/woodturners have been using forever on top of bare wood or other finishing products.    Several years back member here told us to save some money and just use Kiwi neutral shoe polish verus the expensive waxes over top any finish we put on a pen. 

Museum wax 
Crystalline Clear Museum Wax - BLICK art materials

Renaissance  Wax  or (REN wax)
Renaissance Micro-Crystalline Wax Polish 65ml - VintageJewelrySupplies.com

Durability of friction polishes/finishes have always been discussed, debated with nothing really definitive outcome.  There is no question will get some fade back (loss of sheen) over time due to product contents, or handling by users.  I say if done correctly still an outstanding choice for pens regardless of the fade back issue. 

Russ Fairfield’s article might give you better incite and make you more comfortable with friction polishes/finishes regardless of the product you use.

Friction Polishes
Russ's Corner: A WoodCentral Archive

If Pen Plus is your favorite finish stay with it!


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## walshjp17 (Dec 3, 2014)

I use the Walnut oil to sand with and the Pens Plus as a friction finish.  Sanding with the oil keeps the dust down and imparts a bit of the oil to help the finish along.  Check out Mike Meredith's video ==> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwCRDNi_ank

BTW, Ron Brown licenses Mike Meredith's Doctor's Woodshop products.


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## phsv (Dec 3, 2014)

Wildman, thank  you for that amount of crazy awesome information. That sure will keep me busy for a while. I have no preference for Pens Plus; haven't even used the product. 

I am currently using the wax sticks and I am sure that there is something better. Haven't done CA but looking to keep some of the wood feel on the pen.


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## Wildman (Dec 3, 2014)

John just wanted to see who was paying attention!

“BTW, Ron Brown licenses Mike Meredith's Doctor's Woodshop products.”

Woodturners use different products to wet sand bare wood to keep dust down, or raise the grain on piece of wood prior to final sanding. If hang around woodworking message boards will see where different people recommending alcohol, mineral spirits, turpentine, water, and oils. 

JMHO, my last choice would be oil of any kind but people do use and love using BLO, mineral, and Nut oils. If you like using Walnut oil go for it!

Normally only dampen bare wood with water to raise the grain before final sanding if using waterborne finish product.  I will wet sand a film finish with water/soap mix to remove dust nibs or finish the finish. I do this with micromesh these days so dust not a problem.

Having said all this do think should keep an open mind and think about wood you are about to sand with walnut oil. Yes all wood dust is harmful if breathe or ingest enough of the stuff over short or long period of time. Wearing proper PPE will solve that problem. You can always check one of the many wood toxicity charts in the library or online.  If want added protection when sanding toxic domestic or exotic woods might be a great idea even if dealing with an oily wood.


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## BSea (Dec 3, 2014)

phsv said:


> Bob, what do you usually use on softer wood if you don't use the Pens Plus?


Normally I use CA for soft woods.  They'll soak up the CA and make for a harder finish.  Plus, with CA you have the option of a shiny finish using whAtever method you like.  Or, you can knock down the shine with 0000 steel wool.

I have a pretty strong reaction to CA, so I rarely use it anymore.


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## phsv (Dec 3, 2014)

Thanks Bob for the information.


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## Jdeuel (Dec 3, 2014)

I just finished a police baton (nightstick) in Goncalo Alves using walnut oil to wet sand through 600, then Pens Plus, and topped with the walnut oil micro crystal paste wax. Beautiful, deep shine, but it feels like wood, and (importantly) isn't slippery feeling.  Really like the products, and the videos are super helpful.


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