# i have a computer RAM question



## Haynie (Sep 22, 2013)

I need a place with reasonable RAM prices.  I need 3 1 gig cards and I have seen prices that range from 39 dollars to over 200 dollars per gig.

Any suggestions.


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## Charlie_W (Sep 22, 2013)

Check to see if Newegg has what you need.


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## Smitty37 (Sep 22, 2013)

Havn't bought anything lately so I can't speak to price, but Tiger Direct will probably have what you need.


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## Leatherman1998 (Sep 22, 2013)

+1 on tiger direct. I got most of the parts for my custom gaming computer from there.

Levi Woodard 
Sent from my DROID RAZR using Forum Runner


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## sbwertz (Sep 22, 2013)

Tiger Direct is good.  So is Fry's Electronics

Fry's Home Electronics | Computer Parts & Accessories, Software, Games, TVs, Cameras - Frys.com

Do you know exactly what your computer takes?  If not, log on to www.crucial.com and run their diagnostic program.  It will look at your system and tell you what is currently in it, what kind if memory it takes, how many slots are open, and what the maximum memory the motherboard can take.  Their memory is excellent, but pricey, but you can take the info and buy the memory wherever you want.

Sharon


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## Haynie (Sep 22, 2013)

Got the blue screen of death so need to replace the HD as well.  This is an old computer I am getting it back together for my son who wants to run KODU.

It can take a max of 3 gigs
PC133/SDRAM.

The things we do for our kids.  It will still be cheaper than buying new.

Is refurbished RAM a good idea?


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## sbwertz (Sep 22, 2013)

Blue screen of death is usually not the hard drive. First and most likely, is a corrupted operating system. Could also be the be the CPU or memory.  

Does the computer POST?  (will it go through it's preliminary screens and start to load Windows).  When do you get the BSOD?  

There are some things you can try.

Try taking out all the RAM chips but one.  Turn it on. If it POSTs and loads Windows, you know that chip is good.  If not, take it out and put one of the other chips in.  If it works, you know the first chip was bad and it is probably a memory problem.  If it won't load with any one of the memory chips, it is probably not a memory problem, because usually all the chips won't go bad at the same time.

Does the computer run a checkdisk clean?  Usually when it won't boot properly, when you turn it on it comes up with a screen that tells you it is checking the hard drive.  Let that program run and see if it gives you errors.  If it doesn't, you can take the hard drive out and put it on a cable in another computer as a "d" drive and look at it to see if it is good. See if you can open the directories and look at the files. If checkdisk didn't find any errors, and you can open the directories and look at the files, it probably means that Windows has become corrupted.  Try reformatting the drive and reloading the operating system.

If the drive is OK and the memory tests OK, and it still won't work with a fresh OS, it is the CPU that has gone south.


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## Haynie (Sep 22, 2013)

BSOD said it did not recognize the new hard drive.  I never put a new hard drive in it.  Ran perfect one day.  Dead the next.  I did a set up on it to get the particulars.  Ran a drive test and it did not say it was bad.  I am thinking it is the OS.  

This is an old as dirt Compaq Evo running windows 2000.  My plan was to up the RAM, replace the HD with one that was bigger, and install windows 7.  The only thing this computer will be doing is running KODU and maybe minecraft.

Am I wasting my time?


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## Dan Hintz (Sep 23, 2013)

Haynie said:


> This is an old as dirt Compaq Evo running windows 2000.  My plan was to up the RAM, replace the HD with one that was bigger, and install windows 7.  The only thing this computer will be doing is running KODU and maybe minecraft.
> 
> Am I wasting my time?


I'd say 'yes'.  Win7 isn't exactly a simple OS under the hood, even with some of the fun stuff turned off (like aero glass).  For the aount of money you will spend on a new HD, RAM, and Win7, you're pretty much right at the point of a new computer.  When a new Dell with 4 Gigs of RAM and a 500GB HD come in at <$300, it seems silly to try and "upgrade" a Compaq running a 12-13 year old Pentium 4.


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## Haynie (Sep 23, 2013)

Where are you seeing dells for less than 300?  I decided to upgrade this one because everything I was finding was over that amount.

I will go hunt some more.  Thanks.


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## alphageek (Sep 23, 2013)

Haynie said:


> Where are you seeing dells for less than 300?  I decided to upgrade this one because everything I was finding was over that amount.
> 
> I will go hunt some more.  Thanks.



Inspiron 660s Desktop | Dell

Definately a better idea IMO than upgrading something with PC133 ram!


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## LagniappeRob (Sep 23, 2013)

Watch TechBargains: Cheap Desktop Computer Deals and Discount Desktop Computer Sales - September 2013
(Refurb HP Pavillion w/AMD A8 Quad core, 6GB of RAM, 1TB HDD for $299)

Or Brad's Deals: Computers Deals: Find Cheap Computer Systems Deals &amp; Sales

(Today has a Dell i3 15.6" laptop for $380 - while not something I would generally recommend, it's LOADS better than what you've got.)


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## tjseagrove (Sep 23, 2013)

Haynie said:


> I need a place with reasonable RAM prices.  I need 3 1 gig cards and I have seen prices that range from 39 dollars to over 200 dollars per gig.
> 
> Any suggestions.



crucial.com  Best memory on the market and it can also be purchased through newegg.com

Tom


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## LagniappeRob (Sep 23, 2013)

Another option is Dell has an "outlet" section that you can actually break down by new vs. refurb vs. scratch&dent:  Dell Factory Outlet

Be warned:  Inventory on the best deals does not last long but additional items get added repeatedly throughout the day.


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## Sub Vet 10 (Sep 23, 2013)

Great advice from all above. I've used the all the places named at one point or another. 
One point I might add is that you can get a good deal on a refurb- my laptop is one. It's a toshiba, so it has gone through an even more rigorous inspection than the first time it was issued. 

Also, I know of one guy who bought several cheap new-ish laptops from a pawn store. Just f-disk and start over from scratch...


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## sbwertz (Sep 23, 2013)

You ABSOLUTELY can't put Win 7 on that system.  There are no Win 7 drivers for systems that old.  It couldn't even talk to the motherboard

I just bought and installed one of the Dell 660 series systems for a neighbor and it is a great little machine, running Win7.

Sharon


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## Haynie (Sep 23, 2013)

Thanks folks.

This is a great forum.  No money spent.


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## Dan Hintz (Sep 23, 2013)

sbwertz said:


> You ABSOLUTELY can't put Win 7 on that system.  There are no Win 7 drivers for systems that old.  It couldn't even talk to the motherboard


Neglecting the fact that Win7 would probably complain about being installed on such a weak system, the generic drivers would be more than adequate for talking to everything on the system.


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## ttpenman (Sep 23, 2013)

Think RAM is expensive?  I remember when I had to add RAM 1 MEG at a time and pay $40 per MEG (1 MEG stick).  Computer only held 4 MEG.  Also remember that 1 GIG = 1000 MEG, do the math!!

Jeff in northern Wisconsin


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## Leatherman1998 (Sep 23, 2013)

If you want a new computer look here (Barebone, Barebones, Barebone Computer System Kit, PC at TigerDirect.com) if you get one and have trouble getting it to work PM me I have built a good many computers from scratch.


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## Haynie (Sep 23, 2013)

Ok more confused than I was.

Here is the situation

My oldest son (11) has become enamoured with KODU.  He played with it for a little bit, talked me into buying a KODU manual and the little booger won't put it down.  I figure if he is willing to dedicate that much effort to it I should support it.  KODU only runs on a PC.

We have plenty of MAC computing power but I do not want to run boot camp.  Just my personal preference.

This computer will be for KODU, and maybe some games.


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## Rob73 (Sep 23, 2013)

I buy all my hardware from newegg.com  have since they opened.  You can find deals on amazon.com as well.  Tiger direct is good, the only reason I have not purchased from them is I have to pay tax on it.  As someone else said though not really worth putting any new hardware on a system that old.


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## LagniappeRob (Sep 23, 2013)

@Haynie: Good for him! As a programmer of 30+ years professionally (damn, when did I get so old?!), I love to hear about young folks getting into anything like Kosu that teaches programming basics such as logic constructs. There's a similar project that's big with the RaspberryPi called Scratch ( if anyone's interested you can play @ Scratch - Imagine, Program, Share ) though if he's hooked on Kodu he probably wouldn't be happy with Scratch. It does run on a lot less hardware.

Wish I had an extra old PC to send him...


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## LagniappeRob (Sep 23, 2013)

(Oops - internet hiccup @ Level3 caused a double post. Sorry)


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## alphageek (Sep 23, 2013)

Haynie said:


> Thanks folks.
> 
> This is a great forum.  No money spent.



Gee... I'm guessing someone had either some old ram or other old hardware laying around!  

Good for you...

And I agree - good for another young person to be interesting in programming.


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## Haynie (Sep 23, 2013)

Hmmm. Building a computer might be fun for the kids.


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## Leatherman1998 (Sep 23, 2013)

It is for teenagers too.

Levi Woodard 
Sent from my DROID RAZR using Forum Runner


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## Haynie (Sep 23, 2013)

alphageek said:


> Haynie said:
> 
> 
> > Thanks folks.
> ...



No old RAM sitting around, just got enough people telling me I was wasting my time with an old as dirt computer.  It did not cost me anything since I asked before I bought.

I thought about asking the same question on a computer board.  After attempting to read some of their responses to similar questions I realized they were speaking a different language.  I got what I needed here in plain old, non abbreviated, no acronym, English.


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## NewLondon88 (Sep 23, 2013)

ttpenman said:


> Think RAM is expensive?  I remember when I had to add RAM 1 MEG at a time and pay $40 per MEG (1 MEG stick).



I bought 4 1M SIMMS for $50 ea. two days before the earthquake in Kobe, Japan. (where most of the RAM was coming from) 
Overnight, Egghead Software (they used to have stores) doubled the price to $100/M where it stayed for a long time. They wouldn't exchange the two bad SIMMS they had sold me, but they would buy them back at $50 and sell me new ones at $100. I had a 486DX50, so I had to get 4 SIMMS together. That was the last time I dealt with Egghead.
Found another dealer who not only was cheaper, ($82/M) he even bought it back when I was ready to upgrade to (gasp!) 4M SIMMS for $365 ea,! Almost $1500 for 16M of memory.

And.. he bought those back a year later for $350 ea. when I upgraded my system again.

Now, you couldn't give those things away


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## sbwertz (Sep 23, 2013)

Dan Hintz said:


> sbwertz said:
> 
> 
> > You ABSOLUTELY can't put Win 7 on that system.  There are no Win 7 drivers for systems that old.  It couldn't even talk to the motherboard
> ...



UMMMM....Good luck with that.  I spent almost a week trying to get Win7 up and running on a system that was only 8 years old.  I finally got it to run, but not well.  I had to use a usb  wireless card off a router because I could never get the onboard ethernet card to work without Win 7 drivers.  Same with the drivers for the onboard card reader.  (I've had my own computer consulting business for 35 years, so I'm not exactly a beginner at this.)  Admittedly, this was an eMachine, which is now defunct, so no real support available, but even so, I was only able to find about half the necessary drivers.  I wound up restoring it back to UGH!!! Vista! (I couldn't find XP drivers for it either.) All in all a wasted, frustrating week.


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## sbwertz (Sep 23, 2013)

In 1986 I bought my first "power system".  It was a 80386 based CAD system with 3 megabytes of static RAM, an 8 millisecond caching disk controller and two 40 mb ESDI drives. I paid $7800 (That would be $16,644.53 in today's dollars.)for it and half that cost was the static RAM.  But it was the fastest thing available (just marginally faster than the much touted new Compaq Deskpro 386 that had just come out.  I will admit, that it was still running and still fast when the 486's were in their heyday. I eventually put a SCSI controller in it and a SCSI CDROM.  I finally retired it in 2000 after 14 years of faithful service.


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## Rob73 (Sep 23, 2013)

sbwertz said:


> UMMMM....Good luck with that.  I spent almost a week trying to get Win7 up and running on a system that was only 8 years old.




8 years is a hell of a long time when it comes to advancement rate of hardware.


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## Smitty37 (Sep 23, 2013)

sbwertz said:


> Dan Hintz said:
> 
> 
> > sbwertz said:
> ...


Yea....I tried to get a Vista computer to play with an XP and it wouldn't work Fortunately I had specified XP when I ordered the computer so the took Vista off and put XP on --- had a little problem when I updated the other computer with Windows 7 installed but just a minor one because all we had to do was get the wireless to connect to the internet.


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## Dan Hintz (Sep 24, 2013)

sbwertz said:


> In 1986 I bought my first "power system".  It was a 80386 based CAD system with 3 megabytes of static RAM, an 8 millisecond caching disk controller and two 40 mb ESDI drives.


Sounds a lot like my first system... a 386SX with a 40meg drive.  started with 2 Megs of RAM, upgraded to 4 and a '387 coprocessor a few months later so I could run AutoCAD.


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## Smitty37 (Sep 24, 2013)

Dan Hintz said:


> sbwertz said:
> 
> 
> > In 1986 I bought my first "power system".  It was a 80386 based CAD system with 3 megabytes of static RAM, an 8 millisecond caching disk controller and two 40 mb ESDI drives.
> ...


In February 1981 I took delivery of my first -- IBM PC with 8088 processor, 64k memory, 2 160 KB Floppy discs, 13 inch mono monitor,  PSDOS, amd BASICA.  We eventually upgraded to 384KB memory and converted a 19 inch TV into a color monitor. We also had a printer....Wound up being a $3500 toy but my 2nd son learned to program on it and that skill got him to an executive position with Red Roof Inns and set the stage for him being the Chief Operating Officer of a 30 motel chain by the time he was 28 -- and he never finished college.


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## sbwertz (Sep 24, 2013)

Dan Hintz said:


> sbwertz said:
> 
> 
> > In 1986 I bought my first "power system".  It was a 80386 based CAD system with 3 megabytes of static RAM, an 8 millisecond caching disk controller and two 40 mb ESDI drives.
> ...



Yes, this system was designed to run AuotCad.  The static memory was much faster than standard memory, and the caching controller made hard disk access almost as fast as an SSD drive today.  The ESDI drives were also fast.  I was the envy of all my co-workers LOL.  I wasn't doing CAD on it though.  I was doing graphics programming back when computer graphics was in its infancy.  It took a lot of horsepower.


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## sbwertz (Sep 24, 2013)

I learned to program on a timeshared GE mainframe with a teletype terminal out in the laundry room (too noisy to have in the house.)  Then we got an Atari 600 and later an 800.  Then our first REAL computer was a total of four Kaypro CP/M portable systems running on Z80 chips.  My first DOS system was a Kaypro 8088 passive backplane system (motherboard on a card that plugged into the backplane and could be upgraded by just plugging in a new card.)  In 1985 I built my first system based on AMD's first 286 chip.  It had an EGA color video card and monitor! (The 8088 had CGA 16 colors.)  I lose track after that.  Too many systems in too many years.


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## 76winger (Sep 24, 2013)

My favorite place to get computer memory was always RAM Memory Upgrade: Dell, Mac, Apple, HP, Compaq. USB drives, SSD at Crucial.com 

Their site allows you to look up what you need by make and model of the computer or make/model of the motherboard if you build them yourself. Usually they give you multiple speeds and price ranges to choose from and the price was always reasonable. 

I said "was" a couple times there because it's been a few years since I've built my own or had need to upgrade what I had. So I'm assuming they're still as good as what I experienced in the past. The website still exists and seems to have the same look-up functionality, but I just haven't purchased any lately to have a feel for price comparison.


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## JD Combs Sr (Sep 24, 2013)

Usually build my own systems as well although the last couple I have purchased from one of those sites that use a configuration thereby allowing me to specify most of the components.  In using them I typically will max out or nearly so memory for my specified MB and therefore have not had occasion to add additional memory.  I would have to go back to PC133 ram(early last decade) to find anything I have bought extra so can't really help but if I were to buy I would most likely go to Tiger D. first.

My first PC was a TI(Texas Instruments)99-4A, Anyone remember the Bill Cosby ads?  Did a little basic programing on it and like it(as a pastime) so well that I upgraded to a TI-Pro.  It was an MS-Dos machine running at 5mhz(vs IBM's 4.5) and had near VGA graphics out of the gate.  It came with two 160meg floppies, 64megs of memory upgradable to 764(vs IBM's 640).  I later upgraded it to 128megs, a math coprocessor and a 10meg HD(really flying high with that, lol).  I also purchased Lotus 123, Ashton Tates Dbase, the Multimate word-processor.  The whole package was well over $3600 if memory serves me right.  It served me very well up to about 1991 or so(didn't really keep records) when I upgraded to a 486 machine.  However, I keep the TI around and it still ran fine in the late 90's when I finally sold it in a yard-sale in 99.  Incidental the store that sold me the Ti-Pro was giving away a TI-99-4A with the purchase so I ended up with 3 PCs that year.  I gave the 99's to family members as gifts.


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## sbwertz (Sep 24, 2013)

JD Combs Sr said:


> My first PC was a TI(Texas Instruments)99-4A, Anyone remember the Bill Cosby ads?  Did a little basic programing on it and like it(as a pastime) so well that I upgraded to a TI-Pro.  It was an MS-Dos machine running at 5mhz(vs IBM's 4.5) and had near VGA graphics out of the gate.  It came with two 160meg floppies, 64megs of memory upgradable to 764



Uh, don't you mean 64 kb memory, not 64 mb?  The first GE mainframe my husband worked on had 4k memory!


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## Smitty37 (Sep 24, 2013)

sbwertz said:


> Dan Hintz said:
> 
> 
> > sbwertz said:
> ...


 That is the kind of thing my son taught himself...I think he eventually went ot C (?) for his programing system - but getting graphics to work was tough especially with the TV as a monitor.  We also used a casset tape player as an I/O divice for awhile.  My first harddrive was 40MB.  I remember when I got my 386 system - what a hummer that was at the time.


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## Dan Hintz (Sep 24, 2013)

sbwertz said:


> Yes, this system was designed to run AuotCad.  The static memory was much faster than standard memory, and the caching controller made hard disk access almost as fast as an SSD drive today.  The ESDI drives were also fast.  I was the envy of all my co-workers LOL.  I wasn't doing CAD on it though.  I was doing graphics programming back when computer graphics was in its infancy.  It took a lot of horsepower.





sbwertz said:


> I learned to program on a timeshared GE mainframe with a teletype terminal out in the laundry room (too noisy to have in the house.)  Then we got an Atari 600 and later an 800.  Then our first REAL computer was a total of four Kaypro CP/M portable systems running on Z80 chips.  My first DOS system was a Kaypro 8088 passive backplane system (motherboard on a card that plugged into the backplane and could be upgraded by just plugging in a new card.)  In 1985 I built my first system based on AMD's first 286 chip.  It had an EGA color video card and monitor! (The 8088 had CGA 16 colors.)  I lose track after that.  Too many systems in too many years.



Well, if we're traveling down memory lane... :biggrin:

I started with punch cards, but the first "power" system I had access to (through my father) was a DEC Pro.  In between I owned a lot of small systems, like the Timex Sinclair 1000 (with 16kB ram upgrade pack and thermal printer!) and the ZX Spectrum, but the '386 was the first "power" system I purchased with my own money.  Then came the DEC Alphas, and Intel started stepping up their game and I've been in their camp ever since.

The first computer I ever built was an 8088... etched my own PCBs, and programming was done with a panel of switches for setting bits.  Toggle the programming switch, and it auto-incremented the address.  Nothing drove you insane like "typing" in a 0.5k program and messing up a bit... no way to back up, you just had to start from zero again :-/

My dad wrote a 3D vector display program when he first got into computers in the late-60's / early-70's, so I followed suit... of course, I tended towards embedded systems rather than PCs whenever possible, but it was audio, video, or any other DSP-based work I could get my mitts on.  I'm still doing embedded work, but I haven't done graphics work for a paycheck in too many years (and I miss it).


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## Smitty37 (Sep 24, 2013)

Dan Hintz said:


> sbwertz said:
> 
> 
> > Yes, this system was designed to run AuotCad. The static memory was much faster than standard memory, and the caching controller made hard disk access almost as fast as an SSD drive today. The ESDI drives were also fast. I was the envy of all my co-workers LOL. I wasn't doing CAD on it though. I was doing graphics programming back when computer graphics was in its infancy. It took a lot of horsepower.
> ...


Oh we weren't getting into 'memory' lane Dan.  Just the PC part.  

The first computer I worked on was and IBM 707 Vacuum Tube System.  You would not believe how big that computer was and how many cables it took to connect it all together.  No one smaller that a pretty big organization could afford the Electric bill, much less the computer rent.  That was in 1960 - transistor systems were out but we were still refurbishing tube systems coming off rent.

I also worked on IBM 7090s, 7094s 1401s, 1410s, 1710s  and a couple of other systems not as well known.  

Then I went to work on System 360s and in fact worked on testing the very first system 360 delivered to an outside customer (we had installed two or three at IBM locations before the first non-IBM customer shipment) it was a S360 Mod 40 that went to Gulf and Western in 1965 which was before the company got into entertainment companies.  I also worked on S360 Mod 50, S360 Mod 44 before going to work for Federal Systems Division in 1968.  

After that I worked on government contracts and I was a user of time on Main Frames via terminals until the late 80s when our site installed PC's for the main frame terminals.  Prior to that my PC experience was all with my own unit.


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## Dan Hintz (Sep 25, 2013)

Smitty37 said:


> Oh we weren't getting into 'memory' lane Dan.  Just the PC part.


Where's the rim shot? :tongue:

A bit more modern than your first ones, but I still remember using dial-ins for school computer work... 300 baud modems to the mainframe, you could watch the characters print on the screen.  Those were the days.  Now, students expect everything local... if you can't play Call of Duty or Crysis in 16.7 million color and 30fps, it's a crap system.

Oh, dear God, I'm starting to sound like an old fart again! :mad-tongue:


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## walshjp17 (Sep 25, 2013)

300 baud modems?  Speed demons compared with the 75 baud units we had to deal with in the '60's & '70's in the Navy aboard ships.  And the input/output devices were paper tape!!


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## Sub Vet 10 (Sep 25, 2013)

walshjp17 said:


> 300 baud modems?  Speed demons compared with the 75 baud units we had to deal with in the '60's & '70's in the Navy aboard ships.  And the input/output devices were paper tape!!


Still have 300bauds, and burned paper printers/ I\Os, behemoth units & power supplies that were made in the 70's but the tech is closer to 50's on some...

Hard drives are going back to solid state devices. 

If it ain't broke, and won't break, dont fix it.


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## sbwertz (Sep 25, 2013)

walshjp17 said:


> 300 baud modems?  Speed demons compared with the 75 baud units we had to deal with in the '60's & '70's in the Navy aboard ships.  And the input/output devices were paper tape!!



Remember how we used to figure-8 the paper tape around your thumb and pinky finger to store it?  Hadn't thought of that in years!  

I remember one time when I was working at GE and was going down a stairwell with a box of punch cards on my hip and a guy coming up the stairs caught the bottom of the box with his briefcase and dumped the whole box down the stairwell.  There went a whole day's work!  By the time I got them all right side up and frontwards and back through the sorter, I was a day behind schedule.


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## jsolie (Sep 25, 2013)

I should show my kids this thread, but they'll just roll their eyes and go back to their iOS devices (which outperform many of those old power systems)...

Since this thread has touched on acoustic modems, paper tape, punch cards, etc, if you know what "BOOT 14114" means, we can probably have a discussion about a long gone computer company.

First computer was in 1978.  I was in Jr. High when my dad brought home a TRS-80 Model I with 48K of memory.  Since we had the Expansion Interface as well, it wasn't too long until it was sporting a Percom Doubler and a couple of full height 90K single sided 40 track floppy drives.  These sure were a lot more convenient than that old cassette deck...  The rather uninspiring line printer was also soon replaced with C.Itoh 8510.  The sad thing is my dad still has that computer somewhere in one of his huge piles-o-junk.


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## Dan Hintz (Sep 25, 2013)

Prime Computer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## ChrisN (Sep 25, 2013)

Oh, man, I love this thread! I'm not old enough to remember any of it, but I really like reading about the history of computers. It's kind of awe inspiring to see just how for computers have come!


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## LagniappeRob (Sep 25, 2013)

Dan Hintz said:


> Prime Computer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



You worked on a Pr1me?  I'm getting ready to sunset a UniVerse box that replaced ours. (Well.  Pr1me -> PI/Open  via vmark, ardent then ibm then rocket) -> UV.  Be in the MV world since '95.  Sad... 18+ years for me. 25+ for the system.


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## jsolie (Sep 25, 2013)

LagniappeRob said:


> Dan Hintz said:
> 
> 
> > Prime Computer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> ...



Every day I'm in the office at my day job I work on an AIX box running UniData.  I think we still have a few green screen terminals around here somewhere.  Actually, I think the UV progression was VMark, Ardent, Informix, IBM and currently Rocket Software.  Been working with this type of database since the late 1980's.  I started on a Prime 750 running PI.  I still enjoy the looks on the faces of relational database programmers and admins when they try to wrap their brains around what you can do (or get away with) in UV/UD  :biggrin:

To keep the thread from wandering too much, the machine has quite a bit of RAM in it, but nowhere near what the hardware supports.  More like what the company wanted to spend on it. :wink:


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## jsolie (Sep 25, 2013)

Dan Hintz said:


> Prime Computer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Spot on!  Did you know, or did Google help?


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## LagniappeRob (Sep 25, 2013)

Yeah, forgot entirely about Informix. I updated for Rocket.  New app is Oracle based on AIX. Still getting used to it. Wish they had gone with something Cache' based. This Oracle system needs lots more hardware than my old HP-UX/UV needed... LOTS. 512X the memory, and 32x the processors across 2 systems and it isn't anywhere nearly as fast.


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## Dan Hintz (Sep 25, 2013)

jsolie said:


> Dan Hintz said:
> 
> 
> > Prime Computer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> ...


I am my own Google when it comes to technology ;-)  Difficult to work with varied systems like DECs, Timex Sinclairs, Commodores, Apples, and IBMs without seeing all kinds of weird crap.


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## LagniappeRob (Sep 25, 2013)

Dan Hintz said:


> ...
> Difficult to work with varied systems like DECs, Timex Sinclairs, Commodores, Apples, and IBMs without seeing all kinds of weird crap.
> ...



Are you channeling me or something?  Or stalking? 

I can add to that many 'nix boxes (going back to SVR2 days), plus Sinclair QL, and several OS-9 (Microware not Mac) from CoCo2 & 3, to specialty 6809 through 68040 boxes.


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## Smitty37 (Sep 25, 2013)

walshjp17 said:


> 300 baud modems? Speed demons compared with the 75 baud units we had to deal with in the '60's & '70's in the Navy aboard ships. And the input/output devices were paper tape!!


Been there done that....in the 50's some of our ships communications came in via teletype and went to paper tape sometimes printed sometimes punched.  We also sent some things that way using punched paper tape (usually created on the crypto machine).  Most communications were either voice or morse code received by a Radioman who typed it as he received it.

None of that was very fast but it worked at the time.

Crypto was the biggest pain...we had no enlisted guys on the ship with clearance to work on it, and usually no officers with enough know how to fix it.  In an emergency they would get an ET (me a couple of times) stand us in front of the Captain of the ship and he would tell us that anything and everything that we saw, heard or did inside the crypto machine room
stayed there.  We'd then go in lock the door and be under the eye of an officer cleared for crypto until we found the problem, fixed it and left.  We then went back to the Captain who reminded us that any disclosure of anything we did to anyone would result in punishment just short of being shot at sunrise.


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## sbwertz (Sep 25, 2013)

ChrisN said:


> Oh, man, I love this thread! I'm not old enough to remember any of it, but I really like reading about the history of computers. It's kind of awe inspiring to see just how for computers have come!



Your coffeemaker has more RAM  than the computer we started on.  A GE 225 had 4K.


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## ChrisN (Sep 25, 2013)

sbwertz said:


> Your coffeemaker has more RAM  than the computer we started on.  A GE 225 had 4K.



And it's amazing what was done with that 4K! I do CAD/CAM work, and one of the first computer aided design programs, Sketchpad -- which ran on a TX-80 (IIRC) -- had features that are just now becoming mainstream in today's CAD programs.


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## Haynie (Sep 25, 2013)

I have never liked computers.  In fact, the more computer oriented my kids get, the more I want them out of the house.  I just don't enjoy them.  

Dad brought home a computer when I was little.  He was enamored with it.  I might have used it once or twice.  As my friends become more computer oriented I gravitated to hanging out with different friends.  The great outdoors was much more interesting to me.  That computer had a 64 in the name.


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## Smitty37 (Sep 25, 2013)

walshjp17 said:


> 300 baud modems? Speed demons compared with the 75 baud units we had to deal with in the '60's & '70's in the Navy aboard ships. And the input/output devices were paper tape!!


Hey John, I just learned they were even slower than we thought.  Teletype was called 60 speed (most common) or 75 speed but the baud rate which were 45.5 and 56.9 baud respectively.


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## Dan Hintz (Sep 26, 2013)

LagniappeRob said:


> Are you channeling me or something?  Or stalking?
> 
> I can add to that many 'nix boxes (going back to SVR2 days), plus Sinclair QL, and several OS-9 (Microware not Mac) from CoCo2 & 3, to specialty 6809 through 68040 boxes.



I was always the oddball out when it came to game systems, too.  While most had Intellivision, I had a Colecovision.  Most had a Sega, but I purchased the TurboGrafx-16 because the specs were superior.  To be fair, I went with the crowd when it came to the Atari 2600, but there weren't too many other choices outside of standalone pong machines (had one of those, too).



sbwertz said:


> Your coffeemaker has more RAM  than the computer we started on.  A GE 225 had 4K.


Yeah, but it's goooooood coffee :biggrin:


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## vanngo5d (Sep 26, 2013)

Well Haynie I went online searching Kodu and introduced it to my 9 year old that has been on some type of computer since he could reach a keyboard. He plays mine craft as a regular and set up his own server including setting up the network for his server so his friends could play on it. 
Now he is ready to start Kudo. My question is you mentioned purchasing a book. I can't find it but i did find the online getting started one.


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## LagniappeRob (Sep 26, 2013)

This one maybe?
Kodu for Kids: The Official Guide to Creating Your Own Video Games: James Floyd Kelly: 9780789750761: Amazon.com: Books


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## vanngo5d (Sep 26, 2013)

Thank You Rob that looks like a good start.


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## walshjp17 (Sep 26, 2013)

Smitty37 said:


> walshjp17 said:
> 
> 
> > 300 baud modems? Speed demons compared with the 75 baud units we had to deal with in the '60's & '70's in the Navy aboard ships. And the input/output devices were paper tape!!
> ...



Hmmm ... add to that pitching decks, 30 foot seas, completely overcast skies.  Go ahead just try to explain to the Admiral that comms are running a bit slow and we can't get that targeting approval


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## NewLondon88 (Sep 27, 2013)

Dan Hintz said:


> I was always the oddball out when it came to game systems, too.  While most had Intellivision, I had a Colecovision.  Most had a Sega, but I purchased the TurboGrafx-16 because the specs were superior.  To be fair, I went with the crowd when it came to the Atari 2600, but there weren't too many other choices outside of standalone pong machines (had one of those, too).



I remember getting our bright orange Odyssey game for Xmas..


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## Haynie (Sep 27, 2013)

LagniappeRob said:


> This one maybe?
> Kodu for Kids: The Official Guide to Creating Your Own Video Games: James Floyd Kelly: 9780789750761: Amazon.com: Books




That's it


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## JD Combs Sr (Sep 27, 2013)

sbwertz said:


> JD Combs Sr said:
> 
> 
> > ... It came with two 160meg floppies, 64megs of memory upgradable to 764
> ...



Thanks Sharon, you are absolutely correct.  It's hard to think in "kb" today when we are dealing with Gigs.:redface:  I also misquoted the floppy, it should have stated "160kb",:wink: I had it larger then the hard-drive I upgraded to.  I am going to lay the errors off to my age and my poor memory.


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## LagniappeRob (Nov 6, 2013)

I know I'm reviving this thread... but I got an email from O'Reilly I thought some that had kids interested in programming might want to see.  50% off intro programming e-books, and 40% off print.



> Teach a Kid to Code
> Or, a friend, a relative, yourself. Coding is for everyone.
> Ebooks in Deal
> Learning to code is one of the best career choices you can make today. But it's more than just a valuable job skill. Coding, and the computational thinking skills developed through coding, provide important insights into our software-enabled world.
> ...



Learn to Code - 50% off ebooks, 40% off print books - O'Reilly Media


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## healeydays (Nov 6, 2013)

I know I'm showing up late to this dance, but here's my 2 cents on the original question.  Don't upgrade a dinosaur, replace it.  When you get around to replacing the memory, operating system and the hard drive  (cause they were tiny compared the the needs of today) you have put out the money a new system will cost you.

  As for the other direction this forum has gone, I am one of those computer dinosaurs.  I remember being one of 3 kids in high school allowed to play on a computer.  

  I remember playing war games in the Army lugging an old IBM 360 to a mountaintop trying to get it operational only to have to get the IBM techs out basically in their white labcoats to get the machine running

  I remember after getting out being a COBOL programmer doing code sheets our admin would type onto punch cards.  I also remember the 1st time I dropped a box of punch cards and hadn't numbered the cards...

Oh, the good old days...
Mike B


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## Dan Hintz (Nov 6, 2013)

LagniappeRob said:


> Ebooks from shop.oreilly.com are DRM-free. You get free lifetime access, multiple file formats, and free updates. Sync with Dropbox — your files, anywhere.Learn to Code - 50% off ebooks, 40% off print books*-*O'Reilly Media


Be careful with what you order.  For example, the book Linux Device Drivers, 3rd ed. is $40 in hardcopy... but on Amazon it's $25.

EDIT: My bad... forgot to take the 40% off, so prices are comparable with Amazon in a lot of cases (but the Amazon price has been that low for a while now, so...)


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## dbledsoe (Nov 6, 2013)

Okay, I'l jump in:
I started programming in Fortran 4 on punch tape at Lockheed, and that's after I got a Mechanical Engineering degree without ever seeing a computer. I learned to type - sorta- on a punch card machine at LTV Aerospace.
My first PCs (wish I had kept them) were no-name sets running CPM, with 8" floppies. If you could write a program with 4k memory, you could use it. Now the name of the program uses more memory than that. I wrote estimating programs in Basic, and had to find a local wizard to MAKE a cable so it would print.
My first real PC was a 1984 IBM that cost $6000. Later I paid $1200 for a 20 mg hard drive to go with it.
Remember Visicalc?
Remember the first "portable" computer - the Compac Portable? Weighed something like 30 pounds and would barely fit in a overhead bin. People actually carried those things around.


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## Tom D (Nov 6, 2013)

go to pricewatch.com they list all computer parts by price.


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## jsolie (Nov 6, 2013)

dbledsoe said:


> Remember Visicalc?



As well as dBase II and WordStar?  :biggrin:


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## LagniappeRob (Nov 6, 2013)

Dan Hintz said:


> LagniappeRob said:
> 
> 
> > Ebooks from shop.oreilly.com are DRM-free. You get free lifetime access, multiple file formats, and free updates. Sync with Dropbox — your files, anywhere.Learn to Code - 50% off ebooks, 40% off print books*-*O'Reilly Media
> ...



This is true on ebooks too. Sometimes the Amazon price meets or beats the ORA direct price even with a 40% or 50% off code. 

One nice thing about the ORA direct ebook is that it is usually device independent (some books may not be in some formats sometimes - is that enough of a conditional? ), and can be loaned to others. Plus if you own the print version, you can get the ebook version for $4 or 5 (something like that).


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