# Shop Lighting and other shop idea advice



## southernclay (May 25, 2015)

My wife and I have bought a house and are about 1 month into a 3 month rehab on it. It's going to be a great house when done but best of all (for me) there's a great shop area in the basement that's all mine.

Right now it's bare bones. A couple outlets and 3 keyless lights. The main area is about 900 sf with a little area off to the side that will most likely be dedicated to dust collection/storage area. Have to squeeze in lawn care and general hand tools/non turning-woodworking stuff but plenty of room to do what I do and add some fun toys over the coming future.

My father in law will be helping me with wiring/lighting. I'm more or less decided on 48" T8 fixtures to light it up. Any advice on which ones or reasons I should go with something else? Not on a huge budget so not going for top of the line, just bang for the buck.

Will be adding insulation for sound and comfort. Adding a sub panel for multi circuits most likely. There are no windows but a single garage door (insulated) and all poured walls with two interior stud walls. Anything else you have done with your shop you're glad you did or wish you did? Just looking for ideas to roll around. Any other hints or tips? 

Thanks for the help!


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## Warren White (May 25, 2015)

*Lighting suggestion*

I don't know if you have one around you, but at our Costco, I bought 7 Feit Utility LED shop lights.  They have two LED bulbs per fixture, they are 4 feet long and come with a plug and mounting hardware.

They are REALLY bright, and have a very white light.  Supposed to last 45 years, and they use less energy than fluorescent bulbs.

I have been very happy with them.


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## Edgar (May 25, 2015)

I just installed 3 of the $10 dual 48" T8 shop lights from WalMart in my shop a couple of weeks ago. No complaints.


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## cal91666 (May 25, 2015)

Warren, my suggestion would be to add as much lighting as your budget will allow.  I am using 96" T8 fixtures and would love to upgrade to T5's.  My other suggestion would be, if you can, to wait as long as possible to finish the walls so your can add/change outlets, switch locations, and lights as you get setup.  I have an unfinished garage as my workshop and find myself adding/changing stuff all the time.  I added 5 outlets on a new circuit this weekend to accommodate additional needs.  Thank goodness I haven't finished the interior yet or it wouldn't have been something I would have wanted to do but was able to relatively easily.


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## beck3906 (May 25, 2015)

Not sure about your ceiling height, but I would suggest fixtures you can attach a safety grid to to prevent you from bumping the bulb when moving longer pieces through the air.  

Something like this.

https://www.1000bulbs.com/product/7549/CAGE-WG.html


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## southernclay (May 25, 2015)

Warren,
Thanks, we Warren's gotta help each other out :biggrin: That would be great right over the lathe especially. I like the 4100 color too, I forgot to add that but think that's what I'll be going for as well. I'm not crazy on the plug in, prefer hard wired but no real reason. A two pack for concentrated areas may be smart.

Edgar, Wal Mart, haven't checked there but that's cheap! Thanks!

Chris,
Thanks. I was looking at a 2 bulb 48" or 96" 4 bulb at Home Depot ($20 and $40). I was thinking a couple of rows of 96" to provide the main shop lights and then specific task lights from there. I don't think I will finish the walls. I like peg board for right at the lathe and to hang kits but otherwise I like unfinished. Great advice. The T5 I can't justify the price right now, I just don't get to spend much time in the shop. 

Rick,
That's a great point too. Ceiling height is right at 8-8 1/2'.

Great advice guys, thanks! Keep it coming.


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## plantman (May 25, 2015)

Warren: Being a retired sparky, these are several suggestions I would pass on. You will never have enough outlets !! Place an outlet every 6' along your walls and and on both sides of your  stud walls if the space can be used. Run a sub panel if you can (60-100 amps). Run two lighting circuits. It sucks being in the dark with machines running and no windows. If you are not going to run any 220 machines, use 20 amp breakers and the correct size wires. Lighting is a matter of personal preference, and brighter is better !! When I built my present house and main shop, I installed 8 4' fixtures (1000 square feet). Once I settled in however, I removed them and installed 8 screw in bulb fixtures with built in outlets, pull cords, and  fitted with 300 watt bulbs. Why!! I found that a florescent bulb acts much the same as a strobe light, and it becomes hard to see rotating cutters and saw blades when in motion at certain RPM's. Now, 2400 watts is a lot of light and power being used, but being on two switches, I can turn on one half of the shop or both depending on what tools I will be using. I can also turn on or off any or all lights if I so choose. With the outlets built in I can plug in hand tools, drop cords, clamp on lights, or a radio. I can also move my tools directly under the lights and have no shadows. I also ran drop cords down to two of my work benches and one work station housing several bench tools with plug in strips and breakers so I can keep a number of tools plugged in and stored under my bench without having to plug and unplug every time I changed tools. Your only going to use one tool at a time, so it does't matter how many you have plugged in. If you are going to have your dust collector in another area, look into a remote control to turn it off and on. Another thing you might check out is replacing one of the panels in your garage door with one that has windows in it as opposed to replacing the whole door. Put your work bench and any of your larger tools on locking wheels so you can move them around or out of the way if not being used. In  the summer I will move my large shaper table, planer, dust collector,  or table saw outside if I have a large project to do and will need one or more of these tools to do it. If you have a garage door I would think you have some type of slab outside, and this will add to your usable shop space. Just a few suggestions !!!   Jim  S


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## Scollins (May 25, 2015)

I know you said you like the unfinished walls, but something to consider is if you finish the walls and paint them bright white, that in itself will enhance whatever lighting you decide to go with. Sure made a surprising difference in my shop.


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## lorbay (May 25, 2015)

Put T5 Hibay in my shop. They are Super bright.
Lin


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## Ross (May 25, 2015)

When I put my basement shop in, I installed 48" T8s and have been pleased with them.  Am thinking about replacing a few of the bulbs with 48" LEDs.  I covered the interior walls with OSB rather than sheetrock so I can hang tools where ever I want.  I also hung all the wall cabinets using French cleats so they can be easily moved if necessary.


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## Cmiles1985 (May 26, 2015)

I hear from a couple of the guys in my local club that the LED T8's are wonderful! I just priced them for the four fixtures in my shop from Amazon, and I'm looking at around $300 (8' bulbs). I have LED lamps over my lathe and bandsaw currently, and I love it.


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## Simsonicole (May 26, 2015)

Warren White said:


> I don't know if you have one around you, but at our Costco, I bought 7 Feit Utility LED shop lights.  They have two LED bulbs per fixture, they are 4 feet long and come with a plug and mounting hardware.
> 
> They are REALLY bright, and have a very white light.  Supposed to last 45 years, and they use less energy than fluorescent bulbs.
> 
> I have been very happy with them.



I have something very similar...works great!


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## dogcatcher (May 26, 2015)

What ever you decide add more than you decided on.  I thought 4 gang plugs every 6 feet would be enough, I wish I had went to 4 gang plugs every 4 feet.  

As to the lighting I chose the T8s, I started thinking of a single 4 foot one in a 8x12 shed, just one, but I tripled it to 3 of them.  I can flip the switches and have enough light that you would believe the sun came through the roof.   

This is not really a shop. it is our storage shed that I keep excess equipment in along with yard tools and various pieces of "junk" that we don't use.  But I still needed more plu ins.


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## wyone (May 26, 2015)

whatever you do... make sure you OVERDO what you think you want.. and have flexibility in locating tools.  You may think you know right now where things will sit, but after you use them for a bit you may change your mind.  And yes, painting everything white will definitely help with light reflection.

Have fun, and since funds are tight right now, it might be worth using cords temporarily until you decide on locations for sure and have saved some funds for all the lighting and receptacles you might want.


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## Ted iin Michigan (May 26, 2015)

Hmm - do you think lighting is important? It is! 

You mention dust collection. That will be important in keeping your relationship with your significant other on the up and up. Do what you need to do to keep the shop air separate from the rest of the house. That means sealing off EVERYTHING (tight doors are a must). Maybe even providing separate HVAC. My old shop was also in the basement. Didn't need counseling anymore after I moved to an outbuilding.


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## southernclay (May 26, 2015)

You folks are great, thanks so much for all of the replies! 

I have a small dust collector now and it does a little but not enough to keep the wife happy. The good news is all the seasonal decorations and storage will not be in this area but for safety reasons a larger dust collection and most likely an air cleaner will be added.

I have a remote on my dust collector now and love it! I forgot to add it already has a shop sink so that's pretty sweet, will keep a dehumidifier going as well.

Jim,
The garage door does lead to an outside driveway away from everything so I can roll stuff out and make a big mess without making anyone mad, another great suggestion.  

I like the idea of using OSB painted white for down the road as well. 

So right now I'm thinking a row or 2 of 96" T8's down the middle of the room with a couple 48" LED or T8s with LED bulbs in the lathe and saw areas. 

Ted you mentioned HVAC. Currently there is no HVAC there. There's no mechanicals in the space which is nice to not have to work around. I'm usually in the shop at night so not as concerned about AC but in the winter I may have to add a little heat source. 

Thanks again!


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## keithbyrd (May 26, 2015)

Costco had 4' led lamps on sale for $35.00


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## monophoto (May 26, 2015)

I noticed the comment about the stroboscopic effect of fluorescent lights.  This is a concern if you are using ordinary lamps (eg, t8 or t12), but not if you are using CFLs.  Ordinary tubular fluorescent lamps operate at grid frequency (60Hz in North America, 50 Hz in some other places), and the flickering effect can cause tools that are rotating at that frequency to appear stationary.  But CFL lamps (the spirals) have a power supply in the base that cause them to flicker at a much higher frequency that avoids the stroboscopic effect.  Tubular fluorescents are OK for general area lighting, but I prefer CFLs for close-up lighting at the lathe itself.  Of course, LEDs are even better because they don't flicker at all.

Also, with modern CFL and LED sources, you also get to choose the color temperature.  Color temperature affects the perception of color, and is a factor when you are finishing wood.  But my experience is that lamps with a higher color temperature give a greater perception of brightness, even though the actual lumen output is the same, compared with so-called 'warm white' lamps.  So I use 'daylight' (or 3500 degK) bulbs for task lighting.

I have a small lathe, and have it plugged into an outlet strip mounted on the wall.  My task lights plug into the same strip, along with a fan overhead that blows air down past my head and over the lathe, blowing dust away from me.  Having the switch on the outlet strip provides a convenient way to turn off everything at the lathe from one master switch.  Probably not necessary, but I find it convenient.

Final comment - your basement floor is probably concrete, and after a few hours, your knees will start to scream.  You can get interlocking rubber pads that make it far more comfortable to work in your shop for longer periods.  Lowes carry them in both black and mixed colors; Harbor Freight carry black only but at a lower price.


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## TonyL (May 26, 2015)

I bought the Costco light (lots of them). May not be the best solution.


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## DSurette (May 27, 2015)

Woot.com has a sale now on several types of 48" LED fixtures.  And $5.00 shipping no matter how large the order. I haven't been shopping for them so I don't know if their prices are good or not.  Just passing the info along.


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## Smitty37 (May 27, 2015)

I think that whatever you choose you might want to imitate "daylight" I have both t8 and t12 in my shop and I like the T8 a little better.  With respect to outlets....install lots and install a lot of different circuits and make them at least 20 amp and install a bunch of them in the ceiling and it will be helpful at times if they are switchable.  Some of mine have temporary light fixtures plugged into them which I work off a switch.

If like me, you are typically working alone with only one tool operating at a time (I have my dust collector on a separate circuit) you can have multiple tools plugged into the same outlet.

I wish I had studded the outside walls of my basement but not finished them It would have made electrical wiring so much easier.  

If your main panel (like mine) can accomadate enough circuits there is no need for a subpanel except making the wiring job itself easier and letting you cut off the entire shop.  If I used a subpanel I would put the tools and outlets on it and leave the lighting on the main panel so if you need to work on electric for your tools you'll have lights there with the subpanel shut down


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## Smitty37 (May 27, 2015)

I frequently find myself plugging a strip into a wall outlet and the tool(s) into the strip - I usually end up hanging the strip so keep the cord on the tool out of the way so I don't trip over it.


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## keithbyrd (May 27, 2015)

TonyL said:


> I bought the Costco light (lots of them). May not be the best solution.



Tony,
What was your experience?


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## southernclay (May 27, 2015)

Leroy that's a great idea to have the lights on the main panel. 

Thanks again all, let me know what weekend everyone is coming into town to get all this done. :wink::wink:


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## turncrazy43 (May 27, 2015)

Warren, when I did my shop I installed shop lights above the work area and lathe, 4' kind and installed "daylight bulbs". They are great and I have no shadows on the pieces on the lathe. Left the area over the lathe open to the ceiling joists and sub floor above and painted that area a bright white. Worked well for me. The rest of the garage (shop) is insulated . Hope yours turns out great for you.
__________________________________________________
Everyday I'm vertical is a great day


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## southernclay (Aug 25, 2015)

Well, finally getting pretty close to diving into the shop and will be wiring in the next couple of weeks. I've got a good idea on my layout just have to start organizing. For lighting I think I have settled on a mixture of LED and T8.

Something like:

Commercial Electric Rugged 2-Lamp Hanging Fluorescent Gray ShopLight-CESL402-27 - The Home Depot

4=#

I will get about 10 fixtures total. Are you folks that have the Costco LED lights still pleased, any issues? Would I be better off to just go ahead and get 5 of the LED 2 packs? 

Thanks!


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## TonyL (Aug 25, 2015)

I have both, but prefer the Costco LEDs. I like the way they are made but have no idea which produce more light, the color of the light, the cost to run, or anything else I should probably consider. It's hard to beat the price of the florescents though.


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## southernclay (Aug 25, 2015)

TonyL said:


> I have both, but prefer the Costco LEDs. I like the way they are made but have no idea which produce more light, the color of the light, the cost to run, or anything else I should probably consider. It's hard to beat the price of the florescents though.



Thanks Tony,

Good to know you like them. Like most things my guess is that I'm overthinking it. 

At this point I just want to get in front of the large and turn something!


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## csr67 (Aug 25, 2015)

I have an extended 3.5 car garage that houses my shop, and I just finished a full LED light retrofit.  I went from having 4 4' twin tube fluorescent fixtures to having 5 twin tube LED shop lights.  

The quality of my lighting improved 100% going to the LED fixtures.  My shop is now "daylight" bright, and I'm finding things I didn't even know I had!

I looked at both the Costco and Sam's Club LED shop lights, and I chose the Sam's product since it seemed better built and had a nice reflector.  I used 1/4" toggle bolts through my dry walled ceiling and screwed 1/4" eye hooks into the toggles to support the new fixtures.  The Sam's fixtures come with short hanging tabs.  I also put one LED right over my bench/lathe.

At $36 per fixture they are a bargain and very easy to install:

4-foot LED Shoplight - Sam's Club







The picture on the site is the old model with hanging chains.  The newer fixtures have plastic reinforced strips for hanging.  I simply ran the supplied 6' cords to outlets I installed in ceiling mounted boxes.  My ceiling boxes are all switch controlled, but the LED fixtures also have on/off pull chains to control them.

While I was rewiring the lighting set up, I also installed two "ceiling drop" cord.  These cords hang from a ceiling box with strain relief, and provide a nice grounded outlet at a height of 6.5' off the floor.  This makes it very easy to reach up and and plug in my band saw or shop vac, etc...


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## TonyL (Aug 25, 2015)

southernclay said:


> TonyL said:
> 
> 
> > I have both, but prefer the Costco LEDs. I like the way they are made but have no idea which produce more light, the color of the light, the cost to run, or anything else I should probably consider. It's hard to beat the price of the florescents though.
> ...



As I tell my family and friends, I overthink everything to the points where I completely deprive myself of the "joy" of buying it. I haven't gottem better. but it has teaken me 51 years to learn.

You want to turn? Come on over; I have my 1221, and an unboxed 1015.


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## southernclay (Aug 25, 2015)

csr67 said:


> While I was rewiring the lighting set up, I also installed two "ceiling drop" cord.  These cords hang from a ceiling box with strain relief, and provide a nice grounded outlet at a height of 6.5' off the floor.  This makes it very easy to reach up and and plug in my band saw or shop vac, etc...


 
That's a good price and plenty of reviews, the lack of reviews concerned me with the Costco one. I think the color of the light seems to be a little better for shop lighting too.

Great idea on the drop cord from ceiling too, my dad has one of those in his barn over a worktable and loves it. If you happen to have the link of the one you have that would be great.

Thanks!




TonyL said:


> southernclay said:
> 
> 
> > TonyL said:
> ...


 
Thanks Tony! I've still got to trudge through the rest of the remodel. Almost done but living in the house for 3 weeks, wife's in her third trimester and kids have been sick. If I want to keep turning I've got to stay close to home right now lol. You've been making some great pens though, I hated to miss your recent demo. I'm 90% sure I'll be at the September meeting though. Thanks again for the offer though.


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## Charlie_W (Aug 25, 2015)

I just added three of the Costco LED fixtures over my wife's long arm quilting machine and they light it up very nicely.
There is no reflector On the Costco unit and also, no on/off switch or pull chain. Just plug it in and it is on. I do have everything on a main switch but can't switch on or off individual units with out unplugging. 
I added a pair of the LED tubes to one of my regular fluorescent fixtures and it was brighter and are supposed to last longer than fluorescent tubes and use less power. These do work with your existing ballast.

Good luck with your lighting.


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## csr67 (Aug 25, 2015)

southernclay said:


> csr67 said:
> 
> 
> > Great idea on the drop cord from ceiling too, my dad has one of those in his barn over a worktable and loves it. If you happen to have the link of the one you have that would be great.
> ...


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## Leatherman1998 (Aug 25, 2015)

All I have are tool lights, a light on specific tools I am planning on adding one of these to the lathe. (http://www.menards.com/main/work-li...p-2238716-c-7914.htm?tid=-4726684805928477570) 

and a couple of these for general use from the ceiling.(http://www.menards.com/main/work-li.../p-2404411-c-7546.htm?tid=6254950432157422705) I don't like to be tied to any specific lighting layout.


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## southernclay (Aug 25, 2015)

Chris thanks for the detailed reply, if a pic is convenient that would be great but not a have to. I think I got  it. I'll put a couple of those up for sure.


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## csr67 (Aug 25, 2015)

southernclay said:


> Chris thanks for the detailed reply, if a pic is convenient that would be great but not a have to. I think I got  it. I'll put a couple of those up for sure.



Okay,excuse the messy shop, but here are a few pics. It's hard to capture how much light these LED fixtures put out. A plus too is no heat or attraction of giant June bugs we have here in CA. 

View of shop area in tandem garage:





Fixture directly over lathe:





Here is one of the two drops:





And here is how the drop is wired into a two gang box. My prior builder installed fluorescent lights were hard wired into pan boxes in the drywall ceiling. For this upgrade, I surface mounted a two gang box over the in ceiling box. One side has a duplex switched outlet for 2 LED lights, and the other half mounts the strain relief for the cord drop:






Besides pen turning, my other passion is restoring vintage Honda trail bikes (hence the messy shop!). The drops are really coming in handy for powering battery tenders I use to keep these old bikes ready to ride.


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## Charlie_W (Aug 26, 2015)

I am in Costco and now the 4' LED fixtures have pull chain switches on them!


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## southernclay (Aug 26, 2015)

Thanks Charlie! I can see the pull cords being a nice option for sure.

Chris, man thanks for the details, I really like that setup. The pics were a huge help. 

I'll post up photos once I can get it all completed.


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## southernclay (Sep 8, 2015)

Mostly done! The main shop area is mostly done, went with the Sams Club LEDs and they are great, plenty of ceiling outlets to add more lights if they are ever needed but don't think they will be. Even added a 220 outlet while I had an electrician here, leaves an opening for a new addition one day down the road. 

Thanks for all of the advice! Really happy with how it's turning out. Now just need to get the other to dos done so I can find some shop time.


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## wyone (Sep 8, 2015)

Tony... well since the 1015vs is still boxed..  you can send it out to me..  I will even pay shipping..


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## csr67 (Sep 9, 2015)

southernclay said:


> Mostly done! The main shop area is mostly done, went with the Sams Club LEDs and they are great, plenty of ceiling outlets to add more lights if they are ever needed but don't think they will be. Even added a 220 outlet while I had an electrician here, leaves an opening for a new addition one day down the road.
> 
> Thanks for all of the advice! Really happy with how it's turning out. Now just need to get the other to dos done so I can find some shop time.



Excellent job!  You're going to love the LED lights and cord drops. My shop lighting is so improved it forced me to then install a dust collection system since I can now see the mess!


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## southernclay (Sep 9, 2015)

Excellent job!  You're going to love the LED lights and cord drops. My shop lighting is so improved it forced me to then install a dust collection system since I can now see the mess![/quote]

I'm sure that's coming, I have a small DC now but looking to go larger. I should do the whole shop at some point.....whenever I get to my list :biggrin:

Thanks again on the suggestions!


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## raar25 (Sep 9, 2015)

I agree you will never have enough light.  I used some T5 54 watt High Output light fixtues and the the T8 lights near by just dont compare when it comes to brightness and light output.


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