# Whats happened to cursive



## altaciii (Aug 11, 2011)

Just last week I was in my bosses office going over business and I noticed that as he took notes he wrote in all caps.  I take all my notes in cursive and after the meeting was over I asked him why he always wrote in caps. His answer "Its the only way I was taught. I couldn't even pretend to write in cursive." I was floored, then today I see this.  Just thought I would share.

http://www.cnn.com/2011/LIVING/08/10/handwriting.horror/index.html?hpt=hp_t2


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## Ruby pen turning (Aug 11, 2011)

I used to write everything in cursive. Now the only thing I know how to write in cursive is my name. If I have to write cursive for anything else I get stuck and dont know how to make the letters. Very weird I know.


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## SnowLeopard_2001 (Aug 11, 2011)

It is sad to think of all the old family letters, documents, and etc. that will be unreadable in the not too distance future, because of the education system. I am sadden to think how much enrichment will be lost from their lives and for what?:frown::frown:


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## OKLAHOMAN (Aug 11, 2011)

Yep, thats not the only thing todays schools aren't teaching. When my granddaughter took her finals in high school she was REQUIRED to bring an adding machine to class. I asked the principle what the reason was and was told that they need to know how to use modern technology. When I pointed to my head and asked "have we decided the brain is totally outdated and now I know why her students can't give change at Mcdonalds without looking at the cash register. She then said with todays technology they don't need to know how. At that point I turned and just walked away shaking my head.


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## IPD_Mrs (Aug 11, 2011)

OKLAHOMAN said:


> She then said with today's technology they don't need to know how. At that point I turned and just walked away shaking my head.


 

I have been shaking my head ever since I heard this ludicrous story a month or two ago (can't recall exactly)  Indiana has just joined the list of "non-teaching" states.  On one hand I find it terribly pathetic and wonder when schools will stop "educating" completely and just teach our youth to become "working robots."  On the other, I do recognize the importance of technology and the lack of funding faced by many.

I have to believe and advocate that if you don't know the hows and whys of something just being able to push the buttons won't do you a crapload of good.  Sure, you can enter some numbers and get a mean, mode or median - but will you have a CLUE as to what any of those things mean?????  And ... if you are running a business, something critical ... like a medical clinic - what happens if the power goes out for a long period?  You - a doctor, nurse or some paraprofessional - need to transfer information to another professional involved in the case - working with only a back up generator you have to HAND WRITE a note to get  your orders followed because using the computers in every department would use too much of what precious energy is garnered by the generators - will you be able to form that thought - know the names of everything or by then will you only be able to find the information because you know how to operate an electronic medical record, search for the medication or what not you need, select and enter, but don't know how to use one of man's earliest technologies ... pen and paper.   What about all of the "free flow thinking" that happens when you put a pen to paper?  Will that be lost because we no longer are being taught to THINK???

I write fast and clear, I type faster.  I think I am lucky to be one of the later Boomers and be able to interact in both "worlds."  I hate to think of what my Grandchildren's children's children will have to face in the years to come if this is the path that education will be guided down. (Of course that can be said of many things in life....)

With all due respect to the teachers here on IAP - because I admire teachers a great deal, especially in today's world when frequently a teacher is putting their life on the line just by walking into their school building.  More than that though, I teach adults (well taught) in my last job for all the years I was in management.  I taught Mentally Ill adults some of the most basic concepts in life and staff some of the most complex concepts in mental health.  I taught both to use computers and some of the newest technological advances available in electronic medical recording. At times it was more difficult teaching staff than teaching clients . . . 

It is more difficult to chisel a blank stone slate than to punch buttons on a brilliant computerized gizmo!  This is true even if in the end you create a masterpiece either way.

_Linda, aka Mrs._


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## Rfturner (Aug 11, 2011)

As I type this it is not jut penmanship that is going by the wayside. It is also spelling because with the texting programs and auto correct functions you no longer have to know how to spell you just have to get it close. I actually do all three forms of notes... at work it is mostly handwritten in manuscript(basic), for my note taking outside of work is cursive (especially the ones I don't want everyone to see and read). The third is electronic. I love to write in cursive but fewer people are able to read and write in cursive.


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## AKPenTurner (Aug 11, 2011)

Yup. I don't usually use cursive, but being homeschooled, I was taught and can read and write cursive. 

Completely agree with you Linda!
I have a friend who was at McDonalds and went to pay $6.05. He handed the girl a $10 bill and a nickel and asked her to give him back $4. She said she couldn't do that. So he tried to explain to her that it works and she ended up in tears. The manager came over and tried to explain it to her and she just didn't see the math. We're only going to see more of this...


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## ctubbs (Aug 11, 2011)

The old addage about computers applies to all electrical and electronic devices.  It is not if the hard drive (electrical device) will crash, it is when.  As most electricians know, when the magic smoke gets out it won't work any more.  No, you can not grab the smoke and put it back to make it work.  Without massive rebuilding, our electrical grid will grind to a halt, then how will the girl at McDonalds, Wallyworld, Kroger, you name the place be able to even add up your bill much less give the correct change.  When will all this take place?  Your guess is as good as mine, but without Government help and intervention it is as sure as the Sun rising in the East tomorrow.
Charles


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## WIDirt (Aug 11, 2011)

I was taught cursive and if I concentrate, I can still write in it. However, I am a trained draftsman, and through high school I had 2 drafting classes a year, all with the same teacher, Mr. Petersen, a family friend. His favorite punishment for doing something wrong in class or on a drawing was lettering sheets.... I did many ...  Because of this, I can write in block letters faster than most can write in cursive. 

Now, I am an admin and need to write in a plain block font when writing up instructions, so my cursive is almost never used. 

I have turned one fountain pen. I have also discovered that fountain pens are NOT good for writing block letters! For proper ink flow, the nib has to stay in contact with the paper. I am starting to write more in cursive because of this. I have also forced my son to learn cursive. He didn't like it, but he did it. Now, if I can just keep him using it.....


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## tt1106 (Aug 11, 2011)

They don't require or grade cursive on standardized tests.  These tests are essential for schools for progress and impact funding so they are the focus.  In our experience (perspective)  with 3 daughters, one who graduated last year.  Schools gear their education to performing better on these tests.  My daughter this year, a sophomore, told me that her Algebra teacher told her that if she spent 15 minutes on her homework and didn't finish she could have her parents write a note.


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## leestoresund (Aug 11, 2011)

I learned to write in cursive about the second grade, maybe third.
Doesn't make any difference if I write in cursive or block letters. Can't read my own notes in either case.

The judge asked the indigent defendant" "Can you read and write?"
"I can write."
So he makes some marks on the paper.
"What's that say? asks the judge.
"I don't know. I can't read."

Lee


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## mredburn (Aug 11, 2011)

And yet my grandchildren Here in SW Florida are being taught cursive. The oldest is in 6Th grade now and her brother is in 4th grade. Both of them had to practice writing their spelling words in cursive.


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## tt1106 (Aug 11, 2011)

mredburn said:


> And yet my grandchildren Here in SW Florida are being taught cursive. The oldest is in 6Th grade now and her brother is in 4th grade. Both of them had to practice writing their spelling words in cursive.



I'd wager that will eventually change.  
The schools here forsake cursive to teach computer keyboarding. It's a trend I doubt will be turned around.


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## firewhatfire (Aug 11, 2011)

I may be one of the oddballs of the group.  I not only can read it, I can write it forwards and backwards(sorta a mirrror image).  My kids think its the wierdest thing ever, come to think of it so deoes everyone else that sees me do it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirror_writing


Phil


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## altaciii (Aug 11, 2011)

When I posted this I was shocked at the fact that kids ere not taught cursive to write. the thought never occurred to me that not learning to write also means not learning to read it. I now gotta test my boss and see if he CAN read it.


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## alphageek (Aug 11, 2011)

Being a pen turning site, I know we are a little biased toward writing vs typing (ok.. but obviously we type too - really hard to write with a pen on the web )....

Let me start by saying my daughter is still learning cursive in her school, but on the other hand, I'm not sure I fall into the camp of that going away is that bad.  Here is some of my alternative thoughts:

- Life is changing.  They don't teach Latin anymore (except college), but thats not a bad thing.  Progression of what is taught is going to happen.
- Kids these days are being pushed into ways we never were... At my daughters school they start them in 3 classes that weren't even offered until middle school or higher when I was in school (keyboarding, computer usage, and a foreign language).
- My daughter had 2 of those classes starting in 1st grade and all 3 by 3rd!

As for me, I have to say that I'm like Lee.. I was taught cursive, but don't plan on reading it.   On my grade school report cards, I got straight A's ... If you ignored the D in penmanship.    I still write ALOT today (even before creating my own pens), but if I have to write for others, I have to slow down and be much more careful about my writing as it still stinks.  Huh... maybe I should have been a doctor


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## RichB (Aug 11, 2011)

So many times you can't read cursive due to the sloppiness of it.  I can't wait till all writing is done on a electronic device, then all my pens will be antiques and worth a lot of money.  Just thinking ahead HE HE


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## TomW (Aug 11, 2011)

I agree with the comments above.  I routinely get resumes (from graduate Petroleum Engineers) with texting slang throughout....  What amazes me is, with the demise of slide rules, that people cannot even tell if an answer to a calculation is within an order of magnitude of correct.


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## tim self (Aug 11, 2011)

My daughter graduated in 2000. When she was in the 8th grade, '94, (military DOD school) she was "required" to have a calculator for math.  This is nothing new sadly.  As Roy stated, their reasoning was that when these kids graduated they needed to be tech savy.  She was taught cursive in the early grades however, my son (6 yrs younger) was not taught this.  

I try to write everything in cursive regardless of what it is but some folks cant read cursive, not just mine.


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## glycerine (Aug 11, 2011)

altaciii said:


> Just last week I was in my bosses office going over business and I noticed that as he took notes he wrote in all caps. I take all my notes in cursive and after the meeting was over I asked him why he always wrote in caps. His answer "Its the only way I was taught. I couldn't even pretend to write in cursive." I was floored, then today I see this. Just thought I would share.
> 
> http://www.cnn.com/2011/LIVING/08/10/handwriting.horror/index.html?hpt=hp_t2


 
My dad does the same.  I always thought it was a military thing...


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## Russianwolf (Aug 11, 2011)

I was taught cursive, but the ,military beat it out of me for English. now, I write cursive Russian and print English. Ask me to do the opposite, and I will stare at the page for several minutes before I can start, and it'll take forever as I think through it.


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## hanau (Aug 11, 2011)

I tried to write cursive last night at work and had to give it up and print what i needed to write in the log book.

I had to sit there and think to long and hard on how to form the words in cursive.


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## Steve Busey (Aug 11, 2011)

I remember when I first learned cursive (2nd or 3rd grade?) I showed my neighbor friend (a year younger than me), and he said, "Wow, you write just like my mom!"  

But since school, I do everything but my signature in non-cursive...


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## zapdafish (Aug 11, 2011)

If I have to do much writing my hand starts to hurt. 

Plus, when taking notes in meetings, I gotta write fast or I forget what I need to jot down or I dont catch the next thing being said so all my writing turns into scribbling, a mash of cursive and print that I hope I can decipher when I get back to my desk, hehe.

At least it's written with a gel upgrade


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## bitshird (Aug 11, 2011)

I like to dabbel in trying to write cursive, we were taught to write cursive in the second and third grade by the old time Palmer method, we were still required to do all of our paper work in cursive, book reports, and all. We were even graded on penmanship in High school. 
But writing so much CNC G code, and doing drafting all in block letters my cursive has gone to phooey. of course arthritis hasn't helped, but I love to sit down with a fountain pen and write in my Journal, I am probably the only living being, other than my wife that can decipher the strange marks I leave on paper. I hate to see handwriting become obsolete, 
Has any one noticed the new I-Pad commercials where a child is learning to write/spell using his finger on the device?? I think that pretty much says which way we are headed.


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## monophoto (Aug 11, 2011)

I went through ordinary taxpayer-supported public schools in Florida.  We were  taught cursive writing in elementary school, but after that initial exposure, I don't recall any real emphasis on practicing or polishing cursive writing.  My handwriting is OK - especially if I take time and try to be neat.  But after the frantic note-taking experience of college, and years in the business world, its could be better.

I had some work colleagues who had excelleng cursive handwriting skills.  The one thing that differentiated them from me - instead of public schools, they were the product of old-fashioned parochial schools, and all in the Northeast.


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## PR_Princess (Aug 11, 2011)

Like Ken when I was in school, everything was written, and  graded, in cursive. All exams were timed and, except maths, essay based. And your  handwriting had better be legible too. There was no  multiple guessing, no computer grading.

 And today we still communicate with the written word. Perhaps more now than  ever before. I recently read that we are sending out an astonishing 295  billion emails and 5 billion text messages per day. All the while most  of our  day to day personal handwriting has become consigned to nothing more than post it notes  and credit card signatures. It seems that hardly anyone sits down and  actually pens a letter anymore.:frown:

 So now, something like 44 states have adopted the Common Core State  Standards Initiative. This is a non Federal program  is designed to set shared standards in education across the States. (It  is mainly responsible for all those news headlines about cursive not  being  taught in schools. You can read about it here - www.corestandards.org )

 What happened to cursive? Will it eventually fade? I believe  that in a large degree it already has. Even in the very generation that  was taught the art. 

 And if we don't bother to employ it, how can you reasonably expect our children to?


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## NewLondon88 (Aug 11, 2011)

like several others, we learned cursive starting in the second grade, and
were required to use it in all other classes until graduation, with the exception
of math. After 3rd grade or so it wasn't taught per se .. but if your papers
couldn't be read, you failed. You weren't 'marked down' for poor penmanship,
the paper was simply rejected as being illegible. By 12th grade you might
get a few teachers to let you print, but only a few. Now it's just another
one of those 'unnecessary skills' that is being dropped.

The McDonald's example of counting change happened to me recently.
I'm waiting for my coffee and the power goes out on the registers. The
cashier can't take my money because the computer is out, so she can't
tell how much change to give me. Seriously. I didn't want the free coffee..
I wanted the damned change so I could throw it at her for being so cavalier
about not having such a basic skill. She actually said to me "I'm not good
at math" ..   Math doesn't even enter into it!  Can you count to ten? Can
you count by fives? by tens? Then you can give change. 
And before you get on me about picking on some 16yr old kid, this was
the manager. 

Someone mentioned Latin not being taught anymore .. and that we've
lost nothing by dropping it. I don't agree, though. Most of our sciences
have their roots in Latin.. much of our own language has it's roots in
Latin, or comes from other languages that can trace their roots back
to it. I think it helps us understand our vocabulary better, even if it is
only because we have a better hint at the word's root, and start seeing
the same types of patterns in words whose roots are based on other
languages.


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## PenMan1 (Aug 11, 2011)

*DEFINITION PLEASE!!!*

_What is cursive?:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:_


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## TellicoTurning (Aug 11, 2011)

I still can write cursive.. at least that's what I call it... I learned in 3rd grade and spent many hours practicing all the OOOOOO's and the up and down strokes, etc... as I said I can still write in cursive and can read it, but if I write, it's usually notes for myself and most of the time if the ink drys I have trouble deciphering what the marks mean.  

I remember that my kids were allowed to take calculators to math class... which I though was ridiculous ... how are they going to learn math if they use a calculator.... we had to learn how to use the instrument, but we had better not bring it to class... at least not until I got into college.  

We weren't even allowed to use a ball point pen in my high school... a fountain pen was required for all written papers and we were only allowed to type our senior year theme paper... until my senior year, it was all hand written and with a fountain pen. 

I think kids need the new technology, but they still need the old... what's going to happen in a couple of generations when no one can think in terms of math, electronics, etc... and all the technology breaks and needs repair... it's not going to help that you can punch a keyboard if you don't know what the inside of the keyboard is supposed to be doing. 

Part of this thread made me think about a NCIS episode... the bad guys blew out the power grid and all the young agents were scrambling trying to figure out how to investigate the crime... they needed to put out a BOLO for a bad guy.... only method they had was a mimeograph machine... only Gibbs knew how to use it.... 

Another episode, Tony opened an envelope with a white powder and the building went into lock down... as Gibbs and McGee were in autopsy, McGee need to take note of something and said he needed his PDA... Gibbs told him to use Ducky's .... McGee looked all around the room and told Gibbs he couldn't find Ducky's PDA... Gibbs said - "It's a pad and pencil".... :biggrin:


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## wouldentu2? (Aug 11, 2011)

100 years ago if people had computers there would have been no more cursive writing and no old letters to go through just email with funny characters


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## PenMan1 (Aug 11, 2011)

OKLAHOMAN said:


> Yep, thats not the only thing todays schools aren't teaching.


 
Given the United States' current economic delima, perhaps we  should bring back Home Economics to high school studies. A sucsessful grade in Home Economics required each student to submit a complete budget and demostrate the ability to live within that budget.


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## NewLondon88 (Aug 11, 2011)

PenMan1 said:


> Given the United States' current economic delima, perhaps we  should bring back Home Economics to high school studies. A sucsessful grade in Home Economics required each student to submit a complete budget and demostrate the ability to live within that budget.



Sounds like a good entrance exam for Congress.

not that I'm being political or anything.


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## NewLondon88 (Aug 11, 2011)

I also don't see the trade-off of teaching computers but not teaching handwriting..
in fact, until very recently, there was a good chance that students entering first grade
would have better computer skills than many of the teachers if the student's family
was computer savvy. Of course, now they're even taking the computer skills out of
using a computer. 20 years ago if someone had a computer, chances are they knew
a fair bit about them. Now, the computer just amuses you enough to stay on it 
so that the advertisers can pick your pockets.


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## G1Pens (Aug 11, 2011)

I guess the "Three Rs" are pretty much a thing of the past. Readin' will soon be done by text to speech technology. Wrtin' is obviously on its way out, and 'Rithmetic is not necessary with calculators.

I think we are headed downhill !!!


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## sbwertz (Aug 11, 2011)

NewLondon88 said:


> Someone mentioned Latin not being taught anymore .. and that we've
> lost nothing by dropping it. I don't agree, though. Most of our sciences
> have their roots in Latin.. much of our own language has it's roots in
> Latin, or comes from other languages that can trace their roots back
> ...


 
I was an English Major in college and taught English at the college level.  I had 4 years of Latin in high school.  I didn't really understand some of the unusual English usage, until after I studied Latin.  For example, "If I were you" is subjunctive...contrary to fact condition...I'm NOT you.  Therefore we use "were" not "was" in this construction.  There are only a few such constructions left in English.  "If that be so" is another.  (conditional).  

I still use cursive almost every day.  Almost everything I hand write is in cursive.  In fact, this whole thread was an education for me.  I had no idea cursive was no longer taught.  The idea of a person not being able to read and write cursive never occured to me.   Being able to write a clear and pleasing "hand" was not one of my strong suits, I will admit.  My hand could never keep up with my head, and my handwriting suffered for it. But all the way through school I was expected to take hand notes in class..in cursive because you can't print as fast as you can write cursive. (That is why cursive exists...it is faster than printing.)  I never learned shorthand, so I took all my notes in cursive.  

I was a terrible typist...fast but innacurate.  I'd never have made it through college without "corrasible bond" paper that allowed you to easlily erase errors and retype.  I took to the word processor in its infancy...on CP/M.  

I have some old letters written in my grandparents time in a beautiful "copperplate" hand. Graceful and elegant, and perfectly readable a hundred years later. What a shame this skill is dying away.


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## Jgrden (Aug 11, 2011)

This is shocking news and makes one think of WHY? At first I asked, how do they write checks? The answer is that most money is transferred and if resorted to writing checks, they would be printed. So then my attention turns to the McDonalds person and I ask, that happens in case of a global war? In other wars the opposition wanted to knock out communications and what if the enemy decided to knock out our satellites and electrocute our computer chips? No more math. And Latin was always the language that explained the mysteries that needed to be solved by scientists, doctors and educators. 
Someone is leading us down a blind alley. Maybe we over the boomers age might be called upon to figure things out after all.


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## OKLAHOMAN (Aug 11, 2011)

Well after all the ranting (me included) today I received this. Its from my 13 year old granddaughter who is dyslectic and has a hard time writing and spelling. While she and her 6 year old sister were up to vist us last month I gave her a fountain pen and sat with her teaching her to write with it. I showed her how to install the cartridge and clean it. We've been working with her on cursive but I had no idea she had come this far. Excuse the spelling but at this point I'm the happiest Granpa in the world. Now if you excuse me while I dry my eyes, I'll post the note she sent me.
Now next trip I'll work on math with her...Damn I'm proud


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## PenMan1 (Aug 12, 2011)

Next thing you know, pen sellers will only be allowed the Renanissance Fairs, right between the turkey drumstick and the Tinker. 

ROTFLMAO! spell check just said "tinker" is misspelled and should be corrected to "thinker".


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## Grizz (Aug 12, 2011)

I'm 48 years old. the near end of 7th grade all the teachers got together and decided I needed to write my 'stuff' in print or learn to type.  They just couldn't read my writing.  Sometimes it has to do with dexterity and not 'learning.'

Besides, with being dyslexic, print and the computer has permitted me to write over 1500 sermon manuscripts (that are usually 8-10 pages long) to this point. I think before we get on our high horse(s), we should remember we are all not made and function in the same way. 

We are all gifted differently and as much as I wish I could have the hand writing of the Victorian age.... I do not.


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## altaciii (Aug 12, 2011)

Well put, Dawn. I guess its up to the mid and early boomers to try and inform and teach the gen-xers, millinials and now the new silent generation (wow, is there really that many *generations* past me?)the dying art of hand writing. If we don't use it it will go the way of latin and other forgotten cultures.


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## TellicoTurning (Aug 12, 2011)

Grizz said:


> I'm 48 years old. the near end of 7th grade all the teachers got together and decided I needed to write my 'stuff' in print or learn to type.  They just couldn't read my writing.  Sometimes it has to do with dexterity and not 'learning.'
> 
> Besides, with being dyslexic, print and the computer has permitted me to write over 1500 sermon manuscripts (that are usually 8-10 pages long) to this point. I think before we get on our high horse(s), we should remember we are all not made and function in the same way.
> 
> We are all gifted differently and as much as I wish I could have the hand writing of the Victorian age.... I do not.



Grizz,
I learned to write cursive in the third grade... because it was required... over the years my handwriting has deteriorate to the point of almost total illegibility... mostly because as I learned to type and use the new technology, I became more proficient in that than in the cursive hand writing.   When I was in the navy, I often sat voice radio circuits and could copy them on a typewriter faster than by hand.... I've also come to rely on the spell checker to the point that my spelling has begun to deteriorate as well... I graduated from high school with a very high skill in spelling, and still spell well, but my view of the spelling skills of the younger generations is that they can't ... nothing to do with dyslexia or any other handicap other than they were not taught.   We weren't allowed to use calculators in my school years...we learned to do math in our heads... today I've so come to rely on a calculator it's difficult for me to add a column of figures... I still can, but it so much faster with a calculator... but I can still look at a column and know how to add the numbers.... so many young today can't. 

I don't think anyone here intends to sound as if they are riding the high horse... I think they as do I think that basic cursive is a basic skill that needs to be retained... much like reading.  One of the problems with schools today tends to be not teaching the basic skills and not holding onto the students until they do learn them... as a manager in business for nearly 40 years, you would be surprised at the number of applicants I would get that could not read and fill out a basic job application.  I think this is a terrible thing to happen to our nation and especially to our young people.  What's going to happen when our technology fails and we don't know how to communicate?


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## sbwertz (Aug 12, 2011)

I'm reminded of when I was learning German. Many of the old texts are printed in the old german typeface "frakur" and I had to learn to read it. It was no longer being used in Germany at that time, but so much of the historical literature was printed in fraktur that German students had to learn to read it. It was a beautiful font.

It is a calligraphic font, and all the old manuscripts in German are lettered in it.

 (for some reason it is dropping the final paren on the link, so you will have to click on the link in the error page)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fraktur_(script)


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## NewLondon88 (Aug 12, 2011)

Grizz said:


> Besides, with being dyslexic, print and the computer has permitted me to write over 1500 sermon manuscripts (that are usually 8-10 pages long) to this point. I think before we get on our high horse(s), we should remember we are all not made and function in the same way.



Grizz, I don't think it's a 'high horse' matter, and I doubt anyone is
ragging on people who can't write legibly. How many of us really can?
But what seems to be upsetting people is that some of these skills are
no longer being taught. It's not about mastering the skills, it's about not
being taught the skills in the first place.


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## leehljp (Aug 12, 2011)

NewLondon88 said:


> Grizz said:
> 
> 
> > Besides, with being dyslexic, print and the computer has permitted me to write over 1500 sermon manuscripts (that are usually 8-10 pages long) to this point. I think before we get on our high horse(s), we should remember we are all not made and function in the same way.
> ...



Charlie, 
I agree with what you wrote 100%. When education and skills are dropped down to the lowest common denominator to accommodate everyone, the whole system loses. The weakest link becomes the downfall. Goals should be set high, not low.

NOW, having said that, common sense in a teacher and instructor will allow for those that have dyslexia or Aspergers and even Downs syndrome and other situations. My daughter has a double Masters, specializing in "gifted" and "challenged". I hear from her about those with problems on many fronts, but how talented they are in specific situations when challenged properly. I have worked with a few people that some teams did not want because of their quirkiness. IF you know how to get them to focus in the right direction and with the right tools as Grizz wrote, they can exceed beyond what ordinary people accomplish. But the key is that you can't lower the standards for everyone because some can't. 

Limitations of a few are not a drawback if they are challenged to develop the strengths that they DO have. And when this is done, I often see "challenged" people exceed those who are not challenged - in specialized areas . . . to the degree that they become more well known and an inspiration to those who are not challenged.


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## Smitty37 (Aug 12, 2011)

*The three R's*

It is attidude...The fact is (in my mind anyway) that children today are not being educated.  They leave school, sometimes even college, without being able to read, write, spell or do basic arithmetic.  When the teachers told me that children had to keep up with technology and learn the "new" ways I told them this ---- what you teach them about technology will be obsolete by the time you get done teaching it to them.  Technology changes and today it changes faster than ever before, you can not keep up with all the changes, nor do you have to.  Keyboarding is going by the wayside...in a few years it will be voice activated.

I worked in the computer industry and by the time I retired we would start a project using the latest technology we might be on that for two years and when we finished we'd need to learn the technology all over again for the next project because of all the change that took place while we were locked to one.

When I started in computers, you had to know how the computer worked, then later on, you didn't need to know how the computer worked but you needed to know how the software worked.  Still later you didn't need to know how the software worked but you needed to understand the operating system.  Now you really don't have to understand anything but the icons.

Our children are not being taught technology - they are being taught current methods of using technology.  Do most people use their computer for anything other than a method of communicating and some record keeping?  Not really. Will they ever? Probably not.


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## Texatdurango (Aug 12, 2011)

I think so many of you are getting caught up with the "romance" of hand writing that you forget that it is becoming less and less useful or practical every day.
 
And the numerous examples given above comparing math skills and making change at a cash register to legible handwriting is like comparing apples to oranges!  Besides, when is the last time you were doing something on a computer and needed to do some figuring, did you have a handy paper tablet sitting next to your mouse to do your math on, NO… you used the calculator on the desktop of your computer!
 
Remember back in the day when you would see folks in stores doing inventory…….carrying a clipboard, using a pencil and counting items with their fingers?  Now, think back to the last time you saw someone doing inventory…….. They had a scanner walking up and down the aisles scanning bar codes!  Times are changing and skill sets change with the times.
 
I think back to 2004 when I was helping mentor a young college intern at work.  She worked with me off and on for several months before heading back to school for the fall semester.
 
Thinking back, her handwriting was horrible, almost illegible.  Instead of spelling "you" she would write "U",  and she had a list of substitutes for words such as the word "for" was replaced by the number "4" and so on.  BUT…….. it didn’t matter one iota since 99.99% of our communications were either verbal or keyed on a keyboard, either attached to a computer or cell phone.  
 
Now before we give up on her as a lost cause and toss her into the heap of illiterate employees stumped at making change for a dollar at McDonalds, when she came to my retirement party in 2006 I learned that she was working on her third masters, was now working full time in the IT department of our large aerospace company where she was just promoted to manager over their new technologies group.
 
Not bad for a young lady who signed my retirement poster………”To a great guy, luv U, enjoy retirement!”...... ALL in block letters!


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## Haynie (Aug 12, 2011)

For many of us, mainly males, it is not a matter of writing cursive.  It is a matter of drawing cursive.  Griz is right.  Not having to write cursive has allowed me to focus on the word not the letter.  Kind of like reading the words in a book as opposed to reading the story.


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## NewLondon88 (Aug 12, 2011)

TellicoTurning said:


> One of the problems with schools today tends to be not teaching the basic skills and not holding onto the students until they do learn them... as a manager in business for nearly 40 years, you would be surprised at the number of applicants I would get that could not read and fill out a basic job application.  I think this is a terrible thing to happen to our nation and especially to our young people.  What's going to happen when our technology fails and we don't know how to communicate?



When I had my store, I learned pretty quick not to give out applications to
anyone who wanted to take them home. It was a two page app, and most
of that wouldn't be filled in anyway. So there was no need to take it home.
At first, I was surprised at how many of the applications had been filled in
with two obviously different hands.. usually just the name being filled out
by the applicant. Too many of them couldn't read the application.


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## Smitty37 (Aug 12, 2011)

Texatdurango said:


> I think so many of you are getting caught up with the "romance" of hand writing that you forget that it is becoming less and less useful or practical every day.
> 
> And the numerous examples given above comparing math skills and making change at a cash register to legible handwriting is like comparing apples to oranges! Besides, when is the last time you were doing something on a computer and needed to do some figuring, did you have a handy paper tablet sitting next to your mouse to do your math on, NO… you used the calculator on the desktop of your computer!
> 
> ...


Yes- I'm faster on paper than with the calculator (and more accurate because there are no typos).  Often I can do it in my head.

It is the lack of rigor that hurts.  We didn't drop to about 25th in the industrialized world in math and 17th in science because we are doing it right.  Of course some people are smart enough to overcome the deficiencies but that does not remove the deficencies.


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## Smitty37 (Aug 12, 2011)

Haynie said:


> For many of us, mainly males, it is not a matter of writing cursive. It is a matter of drawing cursive. Griz is right. Not having to write cursive has allowed me to focus on the word not the letter. Kind of like reading the words in a book as opposed to reading the story.


 If you were taught to read words, you were taught wrong. we need to read at least phrases to make sense out of the written word.  When you look at a page in a book you see the whole page and if you were taught properly you'd be able to process that page in a few seconds just like you do a picture.


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## Jgrden (Aug 12, 2011)

Testdarano. when why the heck are we making pens?? I have no regard for the three Masters when they don't know the basics. I have a well educated brother who cannot drive from Arizona to California to visit his mom because he cannot read a frigging map, yet he is a Masters Degree in school administration, plus a few other degrees as well. I love him but he is a social, oh never mind.........


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## jasontg99 (Aug 12, 2011)

Cue up The Buggles "*Video Killed the Radio Star*" and here is your answer....computers.


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## crabcreekind (Aug 12, 2011)

OK so to defend the young people, 
1. writing in cursive is hard to read and it also takes longer. Also everyone elses style is different. It is hard for me to read my mom's handwriting.
2. Writing in all caps is professional and looks very neat . Very easy to read. Also engineers use it. I took ENG Drawing and we were forced to write in all caps.


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## Texatdurango (Aug 12, 2011)

Jgrden said:


> Testdarano.





Jgrden said:


> when why the heck are we making pens??
> 
> Don't know about you but I make them for the enjoyment! If people quit buying them I'll have a nice collection sitting on my bookshelf along with my other turnings.
> 
> ...


Actually in your last paragraph you too point out how times are changing...... Ten years ago the term "frigging" or other expletives spelled similarly weren’t only not necessary, they were considered to be in bad taste (probably still are in some circles).


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## Jgrden (Aug 13, 2011)

Texatdurango said:


> Jgrden said:
> 
> 
> > Testdarano.
> ...


I cleaned up my venacular just to not offend YOU. When Microchips fail, I and other seniors will be there with the chalk boards saving the world. Or is the chalk board considered a new invention too. ???:smile-big:


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## Texatdurango (Aug 13, 2011)

Jgrden said:


> I cleaned up my venacular just to not offend YOU. When Microchips fail, I and other seniors will be there with the chalk boards saving the world. Or is the chalk board considered a new invention too. ???:smile-big:


Now let's not start making something out of nothing here, did I anywhere in my post say you offended ME?  No, but since this thread is all about change and how people view those changes and what is considered right and wrong about all the changes I was simply pointing out another change in people's everyday communication skills. :wink:


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## Smitty37 (Aug 13, 2011)

*Time......*

When my father went to school circa 1900 most students did not go to more than 8 grades and there was no kindergarden.  My parents both finished 11th grade in school districts where that was the highest grade.
11 years of schooling a lot more than average. 

When I went to school 1943 - 1955  about 60 or 70 percent of students finished high school kindergarden in some places but certainly not all over.  I finished 12 grades and the equivalent of about another year of tech training in the Navy.  13 years of schooling a bit more than average (I got my degree many years later)

When my children went to school 1968 - 1994 over 50 percent of students graduated from college.  All went to kindergarden.  5 of the 6 completed college and 1 got her masters degree.  17 to 19 years of schooling a bit more than average (three others later got masters degrees)

My grand children are now in school....they all had pre-kindergarden, and kindergarden so when they finish high school they will have had 14 years of schooling.  I'm certain that at least the majority of them will get a bachlor's degree of one sort another and probably a masters.  20 years of schooling most likely about average. 

In another generation the my great grand kids won't be in the workforce until they're around 30 and they won't be able to spell, add, subtract, multiply or divide without a machine to help them out....I think that's a sad state of affairs.

And contributions --- look around your house and shop and ask yourself what there is now that wasn't invented by around 1950 or 1960 (by my father's generation) Computers? - nope (Illiac 1946), telephones?  - nope, cell phones? - nope (same principal as walkie-talkies invented in WW II) electric stoves? - nope, refrigerators? - nope, washers? - nope, airplanes? - nope, jet airplanes? - nope, microwave ovens? - nope (raytheon invented these in 1947), clothes dryers? - nope, automobiles? - nope. transistors? - nope, solid state electronic devices? - nope.  
Even pens - people still want to get a Parker 51 from the 40s.

So the least educated of our most recent generations actually developed the basics on which practically our whole world sits.  What will the legacy of the rest of us be?  That we managed to make some improvements on what our grandfathers came up with?


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## InvisibleMan (Aug 13, 2011)

Like most here, I learned cursive and was required to use it.  When I discovered it wasn't being focused on much any longer, I had the attitude that it's another failure of the education system - until I thought about it.  In reality, it is faster than printing once you get used to it.  Beyond that, it is pretty much a romantic connection to the past.  It has largely lost its usefulness in my opinion, and is the least of education's problems, if it really even is a problem.  Cursive practice time is much better used learning that "alot" is not a word, apostrophes don't belong in every word that ends in "s" and "algebra" is not a dirty word.  

Just my opinion.  I understand and appreciate the other side.


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## Jgrden (Aug 13, 2011)

Texatdurango said:


> Jgrden said:
> 
> 
> > I cleaned up my venacular just to not offend YOU. When Microchips fail, I and other seniors will be there with the chalk boards saving the world. Or is the chalk board considered a new invention too. ???:smile-big:
> ...


Sorry, you are right. :wink:


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## Jgrden (Aug 13, 2011)

As I am opposed to leaving the art of writing it needs to be said that a self reflection revealed using a computer to type is far more fast than writing cursor style to communicate. I took typing in school because of a broken arm that prevented me from drivers education (yes I learned how and passed the class with a cast on my arm). That typing class catapulted me past people in the banking industry that could not use a typewriter.  I use a HP12C to calculate real estate loan payments and for me to do this by the old math process would take tremendous amounts of time which costs money and can put us back in the third world status. So this progress is necessary and I don't know what to think about abandoning the old school.


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## Smitty37 (Aug 13, 2011)

Jgrden said:


> As I am opposed to leaving the art of writing it needs to be said that a self reflection revealed using a computer to type is far more fast than writing cursor style to communicate. I took typing in school because of a broken arm that prevented me from drivers education (yes I learned how and passed the class with a cast on my arm). That typing class catapulted me past people in the banking industry that could not use a typewriter. I use a HP12C to calculate real estate loan payments and for me to do this by the old math process would take tremendous amounts of time which costs money and can put us back in the third world status. So this progress is necessary and I don't know what to think about abandoning the old school.


 
There are those who think that is exactly where we are headed if we stay on the present course, while I don't necessarily agree with that analysis I have to acknowledge they have a some points.  The question is how long can we go on consuming more than we produce before we break the bank?  I don't know, but I will take bets that it isn't forever.


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## Haynie (Aug 15, 2011)

Smitty37 said:


> Haynie said:
> 
> 
> > For many of us, mainly males, it is not a matter of writing cursive. It is a matter of drawing cursive. Griz is right. Not having to write cursive has allowed me to focus on the word not the letter. Kind of like reading the words in a book as opposed to reading the story.
> ...




Thanks for agreeing with me

M Haynie MS. Ed in Reading Education


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## Smitty37 (Aug 15, 2011)

Haynie said:


> Smitty37 said:
> 
> 
> > Haynie said:
> ...


 
The value of cursive, in my mind, is that since one is writing it on paper
and must erase, crossout or start over to correct mistakes, the writer will (if about half smart) think out what is being written  better than if using a computer word processor where correction is done for you. After all it is quite possible, and many fonts exist for it, to type cursive....that doesn't help though.

In my opinion our nation needs to restore rigor to education. We've added years to the typical child's education, we've added subject matter, we've reduced class sizes to add attention from teachers, we've added computers to the classroom, and we've added calculators and other things. I think we have done this at the expense of rigor and depth.


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## Jgrden (Aug 15, 2011)

And since we are now headed toward advancement, why did China beat us in the production of the largest memory and fastest memory chip?? My point bring, I let my guard down to allow electronics to take over and prevent us from becoming a third world economy and we got beat !!!!! 
Oh heck, I spent all afternoon in a DMV office in San Bernardino, CA. trying to get new drivers licenses and a car registered. I am not in the best of moods. Perhaps I should have started a RANT and not infested a nice diatribe over cursory writing. My apologies.


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## Holz Mechaniker (Aug 15, 2011)

The bottom line of it is, why aren't public schools (I can only speak of public, I am not familar with the standard curriculum of private institutions) providing pupils with a life skill of being able to write Long hand/cursive.  Without going into a Political charged rant.  A lot of areas have lost the tax base that what gave schools the money to provide for students.  

In art stores you can find books and starter kits to learn Calligraphy.  Lets break down that word.  Calligraphy Calli or Kalli which means Beauty, Beautiful (ancient Greek) and Graphy for Writing.  So Calligraphy simply means Beautiful writing. 
Along with the books and kits, you will find some fountain pens, mostly dip pens, and even felt tip pens cut to simulate different nibs.  

Even though the first ball point pen was invented in the late 1888. It was designed by a leather tanner because a fountain pen didn't mark his leather in way he wanted.  The first Ballpoint pen for commercial retail sale wasn't until after WWII.  It took 20 years until the Ballpoint pen overtook the Fountain pen.  
Now in Europe, the fountain pen is used in schools, public and private.  If you find a student with a fountain pen today, in the United States, most likely they are an art student. 

So why isn't Cursive being taught.  It may be that we are not longer a collective of rural farms where the kids are needed for planting and other farm based needs throughout the months of June - September.  
We can give one hope that no matter how children are educated, It is really up to the parents and/or grandparents to at least show how things were done in their day.


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## Haynie (Aug 15, 2011)

Smitty37 said:


> Haynie said:
> 
> 
> > Smitty37 said:
> ...



What classrooms are you in?  The majority of classrooms do not have but one or two computers and those are dinosaurs.  Schools can't afford otherwise.  Those that can are proof of the unbalanced funding process.  Reduced class sizes? Since when are 30-35 students reduced?  will stop this now before it gets into the political realm.

Cursive, in no way promotes rigor, as rigor is a one street without engagement tagging along.  I would rather the student focus on the thought process they used to form an opinion, or solution to a problem.  This means they are engaged and open to a more in depth rigorous lesson.


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## Bart Leetch (Aug 16, 2011)

Well I learned cursive & still know how after a fashion.


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## Smitty37 (Aug 16, 2011)

Haynie said:


> Smitty37 said:
> 
> 
> > Haynie said:
> ...


 
I didn't say anything even remotely political.  Nor did I even suggest who or what was at fault.
.  
Since you pointed brought up your credentials - my own degrees are in Electronics Technology and Political Science.  

With respect to class size, you are just wrong, it is no where near 30 to 35 students.  Nationwide it is about 24 students per class and in no state is it as high as 30 as of the 2007-2008 school year according to SASS.   Iin fact 21 states have laws restricting class size and all but 15 states have or/had programs to reducee class size.  In addition, while I don't say none exists, I have not found any data showing that reduction in class size has any corresponding impact on student performance.  If it did, over the last 30 years we, as a nation, should have shown great improvement in student performance rather than the actual deterioration we have shown.


As I said using cursive, in my opinion, does force the very thinking that you want...that's what rigor does. It forces thinking....pushing buttons or keyboard keys does not.


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## sbell111 (Aug 16, 2011)

Didn't we just do this thread?

Schools have lots of info to teach.  The amount of information that children need to learn increases all the time.  Given that there are only so many days in the school year, there is only so much info to be taught.  Therefore, hard decisions must be made as to what not to teach.  (You'll note that we no longer teach shorthand, either.)

Since I went to primary school a hundred years ago, I learned cursive.  It is a skill that I could still utilize, if I chose to.  I do not.  It seems that I am always taking notes or scribbling out the draft of a document, but never in cursive.  I scribble it out in semi-all caps longhand.

My point is this:  Schools teach as much as they can.  If you want your children to learn something additional, teach it to them yourself.


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## sbell111 (Aug 16, 2011)

Smitty37 said:


> As I said using cursive, in my opinion, does force the very thinking that you want...that's what rigor does. It forces thinking....pushing buttons or keyboard keys does not.


While it may be true that learning cursive forces rigor in the formation of the letters or words themselves, I do not believe that the mere act of writing in script v. printing results in the writer better thinking through the material itself.


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## Smitty37 (Aug 16, 2011)

sbell111 said:


> Didn't we just do this thread?
> 
> Schools have lots of info to teach. The amount of information that children need to learn increases all the time. Given that there are only so many days in the school year, there is only so much info to be taught. Therefore, hard decisions must be made as to what not to teach. (You'll note that we no longer teach shorthand, either.)
> 
> ...


 
The biggest question regarding education of our time, is there any good reason why we should rank 1st among OECD nations in expenditures per student (about 45% above average), second behind Iceland in percentage of GDP spent on education and about 17th or 18th in student performance? Are we, in fact, getting what we're paying for?


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## sbell111 (Aug 16, 2011)

Smitty37 said:


> The biggest question regarding education of out time,  is there any good reason why we should rank 1st among OECD nations in expenditures per student (about 45% above average), second behind Iceland in percentage of GDP spent on education and about 17th or 18th in student performance?  Are we, in fact, getting what we're paying for?


It's a mistake to compare the educational expenses in two countries based on GDP.  It's sort of like comparing the driving prowess of two individuals based on their annual income.  At best, it's an apples to oranges comparison.

I do get that your point is that we spend lots of money on education, yet we fall in the middle of the pack regarding performance.  I'm sure that people much more highly qualified than you or I have very good ideas as to why that is the case.  I seriously doubt it's because some schools elect not to teach cursive writing.


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## Smitty37 (Aug 16, 2011)

sbell111 said:


> Smitty37 said:
> 
> 
> > The biggest question regarding education of out time, is there any good reason why we should rank 1st among OECD nations in expenditures per student (about 45% above average), second behind Iceland in percentage of GDP spent on education and about 17th or 18th in student performance? Are we, in fact, getting what we're paying for?
> ...


 
*I don't think I quite agree with that -- it is a measure of how much of their wealth a country is willing to commit to education.  We have a fairly large proportion by comparison to other nations*.

If there were people much more highly qualified than you and I who had very good ideas on why, I think they would have fixed it by now. In the least I would think they would at least know how to fix it,  That doesn't seem to be the case.  It might be instructive that as near as I can learn most European countries still teach cursive.


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## sbell111 (Aug 16, 2011)

Smitty37 said:


> sbell111 said:
> 
> 
> > Smitty37 said:
> ...



I don't know why I bother as it appears that you just want to argue and absolutely must have the last word, but here goes:

Regarding the bolded bit:  Imagine that I make $200k per year and you make 100k.  We both have daughters starting elementary school.  We end up sending them both to the same private school which costs $18,100 annually.  The fact that I am spending nine percent of my income on my daughter's education and you are spending 18% does not factor into whether or not the quality of our daughter's eduction differs.

Regarding the blue bit:  I can only imagine that you are trying to overlay some kind of political argument over the issue of whether cursive is being taught in schools.  I fail to see how you are making that connection and I have no interest in entering into a political argument with you.


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## Smitty37 (Aug 16, 2011)

sbell111 said:


> Smitty37 said:
> 
> 
> > sbell111 said:
> ...


 
As usual, you try to make the discussion personal and question my motives and as usual you are wrong. 

An ad hoc illustration of your daughter and mine is no argument at all in the context of nations education millions of children.. 

I do not argue that, we as a nation, are not committed. We spend more money in actual dollars per student and as a percentage of GDP than most. I am saying we're not very successful. Nothing political about that.

I happen to believe that we are not holding our own in education, because we are swiping with a broad brush without much paint on it and getting no depth. 

I also believe that learning and using cursive writing adds some depth. 

There is nothing political in pointing out facts that are provided by the governments involved (OECD is a government sponsored organization).


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## DurocShark (Aug 16, 2011)

Schools around here have dropped cursive from the curriculum. "Not enough time in the day to teach an obsolete communication method..." 

Unbelievable.

Happily my daughter's new 3rd grade teacher is teaching it anyway. He believes, like me, that different writing styles are important to developing communication and letter recognition skills. 

I've been teaching her some cursive myself, but it's nice to have a teacher backing me up. 

That said, I started all caps like Alex's boss. I got into that habit in high school when I took drafting.


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## sbell111 (Aug 16, 2011)

Smitty37 said:


> ... There is nothing political in pointing out facts that are provided by the governments involved (OECD is a government sponsored organization).


Your issue has nothing to do either with teaching cursive writing in the classroom or the price of tea in China.  The only reason to discuss the issue is to drag the thread further into the political realm when it need not go there.

The decision by some districts to not to teach cursive writing has nothing to do with the vast political conspiracy.  It's simply a matter of ensuring that there is enough time to teach crucial materials.

(Go ahead and reply again.  I know you can't resist getting that last word in.)



DurocShark said:


> Schools around here have dropped cursive from the curriculum. *"Not enough time in the day to teach an obsolete communication method..."*
> 
> Unbelievable.
> 
> ...


If I were a parent in your district and my child's teacher was teaching things off-curriculum, I'd want that teacher canned.  There is not enough days to teach those subjects that are important.  Wasting time on other things is unacceptable.


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## DurocShark (Aug 16, 2011)

sbell111 said:


> Smitty37 said:
> 
> 
> > If I were a parent in your district and my child's teacher was teaching things off-curriculum, I'd want that teacher canned.  There is not enough days to teach those subjects that are important.  Wasting time on other things is unacceptable.
> ...


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## OLDMAN5050 (Aug 16, 2011)

Well let me tell you of an experience I had at McDonalds a while back. I ordered  a breakfast and  pint of milk. Just what I said 1 pint of milk. Now the girl responded that they did not have a pint only 1/2 pint. I had to explain to her that 2 halves make a whole............


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## Smitty37 (Aug 16, 2011)

sbell111 said:


> Smitty37 said:
> 
> 
> > ... There is nothing political in pointing out facts that are provided by the governments involved (OECD is a government sponsored organization).
> ...


*Nonsense - I have said nothing that is political.  *
** 
*Who said anything about a vast political conspiracy?  Or for that matter even a little political conspiracy?*


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## NewLondon88 (Aug 16, 2011)

I wonder what happens when I push THIS button? :biggrin:


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## DurocShark (Aug 16, 2011)

NewLondon88 said:


> I wonder what happens when I push THIS button? :biggrin:



I went looking to see if the thread got locked... :wink:


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## Rfturner (Aug 17, 2011)

This all reminds me of a letter that was sent to my house by accident. I don't even know how it made it to my house. The only thing that we could "legibly" make out was the last name legrand. The rest was WORSE than a doctors signature. We knew that it belonged to a neighbor behind us as we get their mail every once in a while. I do not even know how it got through the mail the way it was.


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## Jgrden (Aug 17, 2011)

altaciii,  see what you started. This thread has people inflamed. Passions are high. It was and is a good discussion.


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## Haynie (Jan 5, 2012)

[FONT=&quot]www.hw21summit.com


[/FONT]


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## NewLondon88 (Jan 5, 2012)

Haynie said:


> [FONT=&quot]www.hw21summit.com
> [/FONT]



"collaboration on proposed best practices"  

You know .. I'm pretty sure the people that make up some of
these "saying something while saying nothing" phrases are just
yucking it up on the golf course and betting each other on how
many nitwits in the office start using their made-up buzz words..

"I'll betcha 2 large that suckup Anderson in accounting will
be using it in an email to me by the end of the month"

"You're on! Just don't socialize the issue, that would only move
the goal post. (not that we're blame-storming here)  Ping me if
anything happens."


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## DurocShark (Jan 5, 2012)

NewLondon88 said:


> Haynie said:
> 
> 
> > [FONT=&quot]www.hw21summit.com
> ...



Ok, I lol'd.  :biggrin:


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## TellicoTurning (Jan 6, 2012)

I still write in cursive.... if you can actually call what I scribble as writing.


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## NewLondon88 (Jan 6, 2012)

TellicoTurning said:


> I still write in cursive.... if you can actually call what I scribble as writing.



same here ... I'm the only one who can read it .. and even then, only if
I read it shortly after I write it. If I think anyone else will need to read
it, I use block printing.


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## 76winger (Jan 6, 2012)

I've recently started journaling (occasionally, but I'm working on it) and I write everything in cursive. Mine isn't the best or clearest, but after haphazardly working on it for the past year, it's getting a tiny-bit better. At least the signature is...


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