# IAP nib interest



## glycerine (Mar 30, 2010)

For you fountain pen people... Would there be any interest in a "group buy" for steel nibs with the IAP logo stamped on them?  Maybe not necessarily the IAP logo, but a logo that we, as the IAP, come up with.
  I've been looking into getting some nibs made with my own logo.  I've gotten some info from Bock in Germany and It looks like it may be a bit more than I am willing to spend.
  But in talking to another IAP member, he mentioned that it might be worth looking into to get other members to help foot the bill and come up with our own logo and do a group buy type deal.  I was even thinking of just getting some nibs with the Bock logo, since alot of fountain pen "afficionados" probably recognize Bock as the top nib manufacturer...
*If you are currently using Lou's or someone elses nibs, I am not trying to take business away from anyone else.*  I just want to know if this is even worth pursuing any further.  Please give me your feedback.  I know alot would depend on cost and I don't even have all of that info yet, but I can tell you that having a custom stamp made would cost around $1,000.  That would be a one-time fee.  Once the stamp is made, it would be kept at Bock and could be used again and again...


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## titan2 (Mar 30, 2010)

Keep us posted.....I might be interested once some more details are worked out!


Barney


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## Silverscout (Mar 30, 2010)

It sounds like it would be a relatively affordable cost, once it's split up among a large number of people. I'd definitely be more interested, since I sell a lot of fountain pens, mostly to collectors.


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## wolftat (Mar 30, 2010)

You might want to clear this with Jeff first.


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## Russianwolf (Mar 30, 2010)

I am one of the ones that has no mention of IAP anywhere. Not on my website, not on my blogs, nothing. The reason being that I don't want my customers to be able to easily find my vendors and costs. So the IAP logo would be a no go for me.

Maybe someday I'll be making enough and more importantly selling enough that I can have a custom logo nib, but for now....... nope.


I've heard about fitting issues with the Bock nibs in the kit pens, have you been able to determine if this is going to be an issue? 

I might be interested once a design is picked, but it will need to be a nice, non-specific design.


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## Texatdurango (Mar 30, 2010)

*I would be interested in going in on a buy of some* nice nibs but I would not be interested in an IAP logo on them since I don't see the IAP logo adding any value to the pen. This is not IAP bashing, it's just how I see the reality of it. 

I would be more interested in a plain nib with some nice scroll work and possibly just saying "Bock" (something most fountain pen users will recognize) with perhaps a small "EF", "F", "M", or "B" stamped beneath the name.

I'm assuming your plans will include the feeds and feed housings as well and you are considering an assortment of small and large nibs of various nib widths.

Sounds interesting, If I could suggest one thing, when corresponding with them, ask what their specs are on their nib widths and see if they are spread apart enough as to tell which are which. It has been my experience so far that when customers want a fine nib, they want something noticeably narrower than a medium nib. That's the biggest problem I have with my current supply of nibs and it's frustrating to deal with.


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## pensbydesign (Mar 30, 2010)

i would be interested in a non-specific design also
__________________


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## glycerine (Mar 30, 2010)

I have been told by other members that the nibs might not fit the common "kits" that alot of us use.  They are supposed to be sending me some samples, so I will find out for sure then.  Otherwise, I can get the nib, feed and sections from them and start doing kitless!
Here is Bock's website:  http://www.peter-bock.com/ueber_uns_eng.html
If you click on "Our Products" and then "Our Models", you can see the various sizes that they have to offer...


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## RAdams (Mar 30, 2010)

I would not be interested. I agree with George and Mike, and i have my own reasons as well. 

I like Lou's nibs. Let me rephrase that.. I REALLY Like Lou's nibs. I have recieved several of them for free from the man himself, and have bought a couple from a local distributor. I think it would be in bad taste to undercut someone who has already spent the time and money to offer nibs to us at a really reasonable price. 

Doing this would no doubt take business away from the people that offer nibs now. 

I am sure my opinion means little because i won't be joining any group buys for nibs, but that is just how i feel about it. There are lots of things that we as penturners could benefit from a group buy, but nibs is not one of them imo.


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## ed4copies (Mar 30, 2010)

glycerine said:


> I have been told by other members that the nibs might not fit the common "kits" that alot of us use.  They are supposed to be sending me some samples, so I will find out for sure then.  Otherwise, I can get the nib, feed and sections from them and start doing kitless!
> Here is Bock's website:  http://www.peter-bock.com/ueber_uns_eng.html
> If you click on "Our Products" and then "Our Models", you can see the various sizes that they have to offer...




Great, except the threading won't fit and the section is too long for the most common pens shown on the IAP.

Your IDEA is good, if you can work out LOTS of details.


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## glycerine (Mar 30, 2010)

RAdams said:


> I would not be interested. I agree with George and Mike, and i have my own reasons as well.
> 
> I like Lou's nibs. Let me rephrase that.. I REALLY Like Lou's nibs. I have recieved several of them for free from the man himself, and have bought a couple from a local distributor. I think it would be in bad taste to undercut someone who has already spent the time and money to offer nibs to us at a really reasonable price.
> 
> ...


 
Ron, your opinion means just as much to ME as anyone else's.  I didn't just ask for POSITIVE feedback.  I asked for feedback in general and that's what you provided, so thank you.  I appreciate and respect your opinion.  
I am not trying to undercut anyone.  Besides Lou, I only know of one or two other people to get nibs from.  I'd like to have more of a variety.  I personally have been making fountain pens exclusively lately and was hoping to be able to have some nibs made with my own logo.  But it will be very expensive.  Then I thought maybe others would be interested in getting some other nibs as well (besides the ones that come in kits).  If we can get some plain steel nibs, then we could have them engraved with our own logos or possibly with the initials of our customers, etc.  Or just purchasing nibs with the Bock logo would be better than the "Dayacom" or "IPG" nibs that come with the kits.
If you think that this would take business away from other members, then that may be a good reason NOT to pursue and that's exactly the type of info that I need to hear from you and other IAP members...


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## DCBluesman (Mar 30, 2010)

I might well be interested.  The investment in gold and steel nibs is significant.  At some point later in the year I will have to decide on re-stocking.  I generally have stocked two sizes (5mm and 6mm), in gold and steel and in medium and fine (0.8mm and 0.6mm) tips.  The 8 different combinations accounts for a many thousand dollar investment. If someone else comes up with an equally attractive design for a line of nibs and will stock them, I'm sure I would try them.


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## witz1976 (Mar 30, 2010)

I am interested, however like others that have mentioned I would avoid the IAP name or logo usage on these.  

What is interesting is Ron mentioned how he loves Lou's nibs, I just purchased one and must say it is a HUGE improvement and will be investing in some gold ones soon for a special project. However, Lou purchases his nibs directly from Bock (and *PLEASE* corerect me if I am wrong) So if those who uses and likes Lou's nibs should have the confidence to like these as well?

This is very interesting and I am curious to see how this goes.


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## glycerine (Mar 30, 2010)

witz1976 said:


> I am interested, however like others that have mentioned I would avoid the IAP name or logo usage on these.
> 
> What is interesting is Ron mentioned how he loves Lou's nibs, I just purchased one and must say it is a HUGE improvement and will be investing in some gold ones soon for a special project. However, Lou purchases his nibs directly from Bock (and *PLEASE* corerect me if I am wrong) So if those who uses and likes Lou's nibs should have the confidence to like these as well?
> 
> This is very interesting and I am curious to see how this goes.


 
I have yet to even try the gold, the steel ones have been so good.

I think that Ron was just saying that he would continue to support Lou by buying from him instead of going to another source.  Not that he thought the Bock nibs would not be as good as Lou's.  And again, this is not to "take business" from anyone else.  I just wanted to see what interest (or dis-interest) there would be in a "group buy" type scenario through Bock...


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## wdcav1952 (Mar 30, 2010)

Count me as one who doesn't see the need for this, so I would be not interested.

I can buy a proven nib for a low price from Exoticblanks.com or at Heritgagepens.com as both carry the same nib. I don't see a need from my standpoint to invest in having another nib made.

A question that needs to be answered is who would own the $1000 apiece stamp(s) that Bock would hold? I say stamp(s) since there would likely be a need for medium and fine nibs. I see a potential for future problems as to re-ordering after the initial run of nibs. It would seem to me that someone would have to order a large number of nibs before their investment in the stamps would begin to pay off.


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## glycerine (Mar 30, 2010)

wdcav1952 said:


> Count me as one who doesn't see the need for this, so I would be not interested.
> 
> I can buy a proven nib for a low price from Exoticblanks.com or at Heritgagepens.com as both carry the same nib. I don't see a need from my standpoint to invest in having another nib made.
> 
> A question that needs to be answered is who would own the $1000 apiece stamp(s) that Bock would hold? I say stamp(s) since there would likely be a need for medium and fine nibs. I see a potential for future problems as to re-ordering after the initial run of nibs. It would seem to me that someone would have to order a large number of nibs before their investment in the stamps would begin to pay off.


 
Yes, this is exactly why I am asking if there is any interest from other IAP members.  A large group could order a large number of nibs and make it worth the investment.
As for the stamps.  I assume it's a "one stamp fits all" and the same stamp is used for whichever nibs you have made.
As for who owns it, good question.  Not something I have thought about.  If we were to have a logo and stamp made, I would say one person would be in charge of the initial purchase and would "own" the stamp.

I think more than anything though, I would be interested in having some "blank" nibs made or ones with the Bock logo, so we wouldn't need to worry with the initial investment of the stamps.


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## glycerine (Mar 30, 2010)

Would the interest be any different in a blank nib so that it could be engraved with your own logo?  Or just the Bock logo that I mentioned?  This would do away with the need for having the stamp(s) made and the issue of who owns them...


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## DurocShark (Mar 30, 2010)

I would like an IAP nib... For my personal use. That means just one or two for me to use myself.


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## ed4copies (Mar 30, 2010)

DurocShark said:


> I would like an IAP nib... For my personal use. That means just one or two for me to use myself.




If you like them about $5000 each worth, this will work out!!:biggrin::biggrin:


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## DurocShark (Mar 30, 2010)

Hmm... Let me think about it. 

Will you take a check?


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## BRobbins629 (Mar 30, 2010)

I may be interested in some if the price is right.  My preference would be a standard product if they have such a thing - nothing custom.  My opinion is that if someone is selling enough pens to warrant a custom logo, they don't need to be in on a group buy.  For me, if I can tell someone that it is a Bock nib, that is good enough and by reputation, they should write well.  I think for custom designs, it could take months before agreement is reached with Bock and the order is delivered.  this is above and beyond the time to get consensus here. This may create some anxiety for those who commit funds.  An off the shelf item still may take considerable time dealing with a foreign entity, customs, etc.  Even with standard designs, there will be plenty of choices including size, width, color, metal (gold, steel, titanium), and what feeds and sections if any to include.  Some will just want to replace kit nibs so someone will have to figure out which size fits which kits, kitless makers will have different needs.

Its a great idea, but a very complicated process and would need a strong and committed leader.


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## OKLAHOMAN (Mar 30, 2010)

I agree with Bruce, a off the shelf nib by Brock would in most cases be more than sufficient. Most here would want just a kit replacement nib to replace the Dayacom logo and of course give a better non scratchy writing experience. Brock being a well known and accepted nib supplier would take any fountain pen users apprehension away .


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## Texatdurango (Mar 31, 2010)

I disagree with those who see no need for these nibs.  If we can get some nibs in different nib widths, including nice fines and extra fines that would be good news for many here who use more than one or two nibs a month!

The more I think about this, the more excited I am about the idea of having a nib similar to the one shown below, attached to one of my pens.

I visited their website and from what I can see, all of their nibs, whether gold or steel, all have their logo and names stamped and of course the gold has the karat stamped.

I would be interested in seeing some quantity/pricing numbers, who knows, we might make a go of a decent "group buy" of sorts.  If we use their "standard" nibs there would be no need for any special dies to worry about.  Sorry to go astray from the idea of the IAP logo but from the consensus above, most would rather see a "generic" nib.


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## PenMan1 (Mar 31, 2010)

I'm with George. I would be interested in a Bock group buy (if the price is right), but I don't see the added value of the IAP logo.

I have only a few customers that would justify the additional $100 for a gold nib.... But I might be salesman enough to sell many $40-$50 upgrades.


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## dow (Mar 31, 2010)

I would not be interested in an IAP branded nib.

However, I might be interested in a group buy of the standard Bock nibs, depending on price and compatibility with the commonly available feeds, housings, and sections. 

I think that being of a compatible size is important because there are many more folks making pens based on the component sets from CSUSA, Berea, etc., than there are making pens from scratch.  While my goal is to make the change over from kit-made to kit-less pens, I'm far from there right now, and it'll probably be some time before I'm ready to take that step.  

So I guess in answer to your question... my answer is no and yes. :biggrin:


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## glycerine (Mar 31, 2010)

Ok, then this is what I gather from the responses so far.
Of those that ARE interested, it seems that more people would rather use a BOCK branded nib than some type of IAP logo.
I will pursue further and the focus will be on a Bock branded nib.  I have been focusing also on steel nibs just because of cost reasons.  Those of you that sell alot of fountain pens and would be interested in Bock branded nibs, would you use steel nibs or should I be looking into gold nibs as well?
Once I can confirm/deny that the Bock nibs will fit common "kit" feeds and/or that the Bock feeds will fit the common "kit" housings/sections, I will get more info on pricing, order quantities, etc...


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## Jerryconn (Mar 31, 2010)

I am interested depending on pricing.  Would prefer ones with "Bock" markings.  
Small and large in fine, medium, and broad (I Think .6, .8, 1.0). Italics as well if there is enough interest.  Would like ones to fit our current "kits".


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## BRobbins629 (Mar 31, 2010)

If on a group buy we can get large gold nibs for $50 or less each delivered, I would be interested. Any higher than that, I would use existing sources.  For steel, the price would have to be approximately 60% or less of existing sources as well for it to be worthwhile.  I would also be interested in some titanium as well if others can help with the minimum.


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## maxwell_smart007 (Mar 31, 2010)

The only way for the IAP logo to be worthwhile on a nib is if it were run as an IAP fundraiser, with part of the profit of each nib going to running the IAP site...

The logistics and initial investment of this seems daunting, however...And I don't know if there's even room or desire in the market for these...


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## wdcav1952 (Mar 31, 2010)

Jeremy,

I agree that using a "standard" Bock nib should be more easily done as it would avoid the stamp cost.

The question seems to be if the minimum quantity can be spread around the different size nibs and different writing sizes.  If you have to have a minimum of each particular nib, I think you will have problems.


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## glycerine (Mar 31, 2010)

True.  I'll see what they say about the minimum order quantity.


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## chriselle (Apr 1, 2010)

I'd certainly be in for a generic nib especially in 14k and/or 18K gold.   I don't know how popular it would be with the group but I'd love to get some EF nibs...in fact that is all I would buy if given a choice.


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## glycerine (Apr 1, 2010)

I've gotten more info from Boch.  The minimum order quantity IS for a single nib type and size, no mixing.  So to get medium and extra fine (if they make extra fine) in two different sizes, we'd need to purchase 4,000 pieces total.  But I can tell you that for that quanitity, the price per unit will be very low.
I have also asked them about extra fine nibs and am waiting to hear back...


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## glycerine (Apr 6, 2010)

Ok, I received some samples in the mail yesterday.  The small nibs are the same size as the "Dayacom" branded nib that was in a jr. gent kit of mine as well as Lou's small nibs.  So they will work well as replacement nibs for alot of the kits.  I put one in my "daily use" pen and have been testing it out.  So far, I'm impressed.
I only got samples of the type 180, I believe George asked for the 250 and will check those out for us.
I have some Bock feeds and a Bock section as well.  Although the section is threaded the same as the jr. gent that I was toying with last night, the feed and section are longer than the kit.  So the way I see it, we can either use the Bock nibs alone to replace the kit nibs, or purchase the triple or quad systems for kitless work.
More to come...


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## jeff (Apr 6, 2010)

I don't think the IAP logo on a nib is a good idea. Plenty of reasons above. One further consideration is that we'd need to change the logo usage philosophy. Use of the IAP logo in any way on an item which is sold at a profit is a violation of the logo usage guidelines. I do appreciate the spirit of this idea, however. :biggrin:


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## glycerine (Apr 6, 2010)

jeff said:


> I don't think the IAP logo on a nib is a good idea. Plenty of reasons above. One further consideration is that we'd need to change the logo usage philosophy. Use of the IAP logo in any way on an item which is sold at a profit is a violation of the logo usage guidelines. I do appreciate the spirit of this idea, however. :biggrin:


 
Yes, we've abandoned that idea and have mainly been focused on "Bock" branded nibs now.  I should probably move this discussion to a new post.


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## dow (Apr 6, 2010)

glycerine said:


> Ok, I received some samples in the mail yesterday.  The small nibs are the same size as the "Dayacom" branded nib that was in a jr. gent kit of mine as well as Lou's small nibs.  So they will work well as replacement nibs for alot of the kits.  I put one in my "daily use" pen and have been testing it out.  So far, I'm impressed.
> I only got samples of the type 180, I believe George asked for the 250 and will check those out for us.
> I have some Bock feeds and a Bock section as well.  Although the section is threaded the same as the jr. gent that I was toying with last night, the feed and section are longer than the kit.  So the way I see it, we can either use the Bock nibs alone to replace the kit nibs, or purchase the triple or quad systems for kitless work.
> More to come...



Good news.  Thanks for the update.


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