# El Toro kits



## DaveM (Oct 31, 2007)

I am adding to my arsenal of kits with another A.S. order.  This time I am getting the El Toro (And El Presidente rollerball kits)  Is there anything I need to know about these kits?  I can make a Churchill or El Grande with the new Woodcraft blanks, but it is nervewracking to drill them that closely.  I know I will have to use CSUSA and oversized blanks for these kits.

How are the threads and hardware on them?  I noticed that the Churchill/El Grande kits are much cheaper feeling than the Baron/Sedona kits.  Are the Toros a bit better?  There aren't many other options for full sized pens left.  I will make a couple of short ones, but mostly, I will use Presidente tubes to make full length fountain pens from these kits.  Any hitches I need to be aware of?  Is the really expensive drill bit I am ordering actually the best size to use with this kit?  Will it tolerate a coat of paint on the inside of an acrylic blank?

Thanks,
Dave


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## Randy_ (Oct 31, 2007)

> _Originally posted by DaveM_
> 
> .....I noticed that the Churchill/El Grande kits are much cheaper feeling than the Baron/Sedona kits......



Sort of curious as to what "cheap" feels like?


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## Firefyter-emt (Oct 31, 2007)

The El-Toro is a nice pen really. I am not fond of the way they can not be used with a standard ink pump, but DCBluesman has those vacuum fill ones that are supposed to work.

The cap threads are nice, the cap has a plastic insert that really needs CA to keep it in place. The nib holder, IMHO is the best one out there. The press in part is all metal and the trim ring is pushed down and pressed more like a washer than the "slip ring" like the Jr. Gent. On the Jr. Gent, the ring can become loose where this one is pressed between the blank and the coupler and if pressed tight the grain alingment is kept. On the Jr. Gent you can push the nib holder in more than when it was first put togather and lose your grain alingment. The one complaint about the thread coupler is that the cap takes a full 3.25 turns to put the cap on!!!

It's a great kit to custom fit parts on. I love the nice plain centerband and the nib holder, but hate the post end and the cap final/clip is so so.

Oh... and if you buy extra "Presidente" tubes, you can use the longer tube in the body of the El-Toro so you can run the ink pump, but in this kit, I think the vacuum one is a better fix. I find it way to "big" with the cap posted with the long body for a fountian pen.


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## vick (Nov 1, 2007)

I like the kit alot since the threaded insert for the cap and the trim ring our seperate piece you can leave off the center band without any modifications.  Personally I only make them as closed end pens and drill them out so they will accept a pump.  I actually have never made one as the standard kit.  The threads work nicely but they are single lead threads so it takes more twisting to get the cap on and off then on some other kits.


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## DaveM (Nov 1, 2007)

Thanks,

I guess I should have been a bit more careful with my choice of words.  I always felt that the plastic thread couplers in the Grande kits had a cheap feel, not so much in the final pen, but when putting them together.  I use the press blocks, but I always have the creepy feeling that they could get broken by a klutzy application of force, or a Gorilla trying to put the cap back on.  I haven't had a broken one come back to me, so they're probably stronger than they look.  I have had customers at my displays have problems putting the cap back on, as it is tricky to align the threads properly.  Oddly enough, the one place I have seen a crack on an El Grande is the posting finial.  (Where the cap posts.  May not be using the right terminology)  I don't know how somebody did that, unless he had a hard time keeping the cap posted, and shoved it down really hard all the time.

Glad to hear that the hardware is a bit more stout on the Toro/Presidente.   I also do plan to use the presidente tubes to make full sized pens.  I will think about the smaller converters instead.  Maybe I can extend the body halfway out by shortening a Presidente tube until the balance I am looking for is achieved.  I wonder if the Monteverde mini converter would fit?

Thanks again,
Dave


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## DCBluesman (Nov 1, 2007)

Dave - The Monteverde mini converter will fit as will the  short, squeeze-style converters that I sell.  $3.50 each or 10 for $25 plus shipping.


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## Narwhale (Nov 1, 2007)

Dave,
These ae my favorite pens, and yes they are much nice to make and write with than the el Grande.  The one negative comment about them is they are large and some people think to large for a shirt pocket.  they do fit in my XXL tall dress shirt pockets real well though.
If I remember right, some of the parts on the el Preisdente interchange with the the Gentlemens pens, both from CSUS.
Have three of them shown here: http://www.penturners.org/forum/photo_album_view.asp?cname=Pens&mid=3288&cid=3558&page=3
Rich S.


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## Geo in Winnipeg (Nov 1, 2007)

The El Presidente rollerball and El Toro fountain are from Berea. The Havana rollerball and Little Havana fountain are similar (close to identical??) and are from CSUSA. The Gentlemen's is also from CSUSA.


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