# let's take a stand !!!



## Pipes (May 9, 2006)

Let's take a stand!!!!!!!!!!! 


FYI.......... 


GAS WAR - an idea that WILL work 
This was originally sent by a retired Coca Cola executive. It came from one of his engineer buddies who retired from Halliburton. It's worth your consideration. 

Join the resistance!!!! I hear we are going to hit close to $4.00 a gallon by next summer and it might go higher!! Want gasoline prices to come down? We need to take some intelligent, united action. Phillip Hollsworth offered this good idea. 

This makes MUCH MORE SENSE than the "don't buy gas on a certain day" campaign that was going around last April or May! The oil companies just laughed at that because they knew we wouldn't continue to "hurt" ourselves by refusing to buy gas. It was more of an inconvenience to us than it was a problem for them. 

BUT, whoever thought of this idea, has come up with a plan that can really work. Please read on and join with us! By now you're probably thinking gasoline priced 
at about $1.50 is super cheap. Me too! It is currently $2.79 for regular unleaded in my town. Now that the oil companies and the OPEC nations have conditioned us to think that the cost of a gallon of gas is CHEAP at $1.50 - $1.75, we need to take aggressive action to teach them that BUYERS control the marketplace..... not sellers. With the price of gasoline going up more each day, we consumers need to take action. The only way we are going to see the price of gas come down is if we hit someone in the pocketbook by not purchasing their gas! And, we can do that WITHOUT hurting ourselves. 

How? Since we all rely on our cars, we can't just stop buying gas. But we CAN have an impact on gas prices if we all act together to force a price war. 

Here's the idea: 

For the rest of this year, DON'T purchase ANY gasoline from the two biggest companies (which now are one), EXXON and MOBIL. If they are not selling any gas, they will be inclined to reduce 
their prices. If they reduce their prices, the other companies will have to follow suit. 

But to have an impact, we need to reach literally millions of Exxon and Mobil gas buyers. It's really simple to do! Now, don't wimp out at this point.... keep reading and I'll explain how simple it is to reach millions of people. 

I am sending this note to 30 people. If each of us sends it to at least ten more (30 x 10 =3D 300) ... and those 300 send it to at least ten more (300 x 10 =3D 3,000)...and so on, by the time the message reaches the sixth group of people, we will have reached over THREE MILLION consumers. If those three million get excited and pass this on to ten friends each, then 30 million people will have been contacted! If it goes one level further, you guessed it..... THREE &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;HUNDRED MILLION &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;PEOPLE!!! 

Again, all you have to do is send this to 10 people. That's all. (If you don't understand how we can reach 300 
million and all you have to do is send this to 10 people.... Well, let's face it, you just aren't a mathematician. But I am, so trust me on this one.) 

How long would all that take? If each of us sends this e-mail out to ten more people within one day of receipt, all 300 MILLION people could conceivably be contacted within the next 8 days!!! 

I'll bet you didn't think you and I had that much potential, did you? 

Acting together we can make a difference. If this makes sense to you, please pass this message on. I suggest that we not buy from EXXON/MOBIL UNTIL THEY LOWER THEIR PRICES TO THE $1.30 RANGE AND KEEP THEM DOWN. 

THIS CAN REALLY WORK AND DON'T FORGET TO STOP BUYING GAS FROM THE ORGANIZATION THAT HAS MADE MORE PROFIT THAN EVEN WALMART





http://affordablepipes.com/


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## JimGo (May 9, 2006)

Emotionally, it's an interesting idea.  Unfortunately, this won't work.  Check out http://www.snopes.com/politics/gasoline/gasout.asp

I wrote a short economic explanation about why this won't work to my mom the other day; I think I deleted it, but I'll see if she has it.

BTW, this is a better idea, IMHO:

http://autos.msn.com/everyday/gasstations.aspx?zip=&src=Netx


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## Draken (May 9, 2006)

You do realize that they sell gasoline to the "independent" stations, such as Wawa, Sheetz, etc. so they will continue to sell gasoline and I doubt this boycott of a particular company will have much of an effect, they rarely do.

Just my opinion.
Draken


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## Pipes (May 9, 2006)

It beats doing nuthen :O) []




http://affordablepipes.com/


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## Dario (May 9, 2006)

> _Originally posted by Pipes_
> <br />It beats doing nuthen :O) []



Maybe we can start a thread on how to make our vehicles run more efficiently.  I know most of us know those already but...a reminder usually helps [].

If you can't get more gallons for your dollar...at least make more miles out of your gallons []

Are you game? [}]


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## Paul in OKC (May 9, 2006)

Government makes more money off gas in taxes than the oil companies do in profit.


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## KingBubbaTruck (May 9, 2006)

Basically, as I understand it, the gas that comes out of the refinery goes into the truck, and the only difference in which 'brand' it is the little bit of the 'additive' package that the put into the truck as it leaves the refinery...


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## chitswood (May 9, 2006)

> _Originally posted by Paul in OKC_
> <br />Government makes more money off gas in taxes than the oil companies do in profit.



Yup, "big oil" companies earn 7% profit from the total money they make on their "Big oil",
more than %50 of the total money made goes to the government[:0] [!]

And %7 profit is the average for US companies, so their not ripping us off, they just can't offer cheaper gas[xx(]

How about the government stops taking so much? That'd lower prices


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## Ron in Drums PA (May 9, 2006)

http://www.snopes.com/politics/gasoline/gasout.asp


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## Pipes (May 9, 2006)

Well IF I did nothing else I got a lively discussion started[]

By they way WHO is the Goverment ?? I think its WE the people LOL JK :O)





http://affordablepipes.com/[8D]


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## Chuck Key (May 9, 2006)

The Federal Gas Tax is 18.4 cents per gallon.
State gas tax varies by state:  http://www.gaspricewatch.com/usgastaxes.asp
Some localities also collect gas tax at lower rates.


Thats maybe $.40 to $.60 per gallon lets say at three dollars per gallon.  Hardly 50% of the total collected.




> _Originally posted by chitswood_
> <br />
> 
> 
> ...


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## bigvoots44 (May 9, 2006)

it is a good idea and i feel the gas companies will feel the pinch.so will the government. as to WHO IS THE GOVERNMENT it sure as he;; is not us or the bunch of walking rectums we elect. It is the buracrats SP who run the system. But anything is worth the try

fred


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## terry q (May 9, 2006)

Probably an unfavorable suggestion but if everyone slowed down and drove the speed limit think of the thousands of gallons of gas that would be saved every day.  It wouldn't take long for the prices to come down because of reduced demand.

Terry


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## DCBluesman (May 9, 2006)

I always enjoy these debates.  Is cheap petroleum really what we want?   It's a pollutant.  A large percent of the worlds oil is under control of people who do not like the Western world.  Those who like the Western world don't particularly like the US.  The real question here is how quickly can we relieve our dependence on a non-renewable resource.  There are options.  

Ethanol is a nearly-clean alternative.  Brazil already has a requirement that all vehicles must run on ethanol.  Guess what?  They all do.  And all of the major auto manufacturers make cars for Brazil.  

Where do we get ethanol?  From grass.  From corn.  Renewable resources.  Jobs back here at home.  Independence from those who currently control the markets.  

If it were up to me, I'd jack the price of gas up to about $7 a gallon and force then hands of business and the government!

Of course, I'm a radical! [8D]


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## Pipes (May 9, 2006)

> _Originally posted by DCBluesman_
> <br />I always enjoy these debates.  Is cheap petroleum really what we want?   It's a pollutant.  A large percent of the worlds oil is under control of people who do not like the Western world.  Those who like the Western world don't particularly like the US.  The real question here is how quickly can we relieve our dependence on a non-renewable resource.  There are options.
> 
> Ethanol is a nearly-clean alternative.  Brazil already has a requirement that all vehicles must run on ethanol.  Guess what?  They all do.  And all of the major auto manufacturers make cars for Brazil.
> ...



That would ONLY IMHO HURT us I know it would help UPS and FedX and USPS !!! But it would put folks like my daughter a travelen sells  Rep outa work almost instantly !!!and drop our economy right in the tank pardon the pun !! But thousands would be outa work again IMHO ..that again is a problem NOT a solution again MY opion only []folks NOW can't afford medcine ! 7 bucks a gal and they would NOT be able to even drive to a DR !!!so then the city ambulance service becomes a taxi and that is just not a answer again IMHO only 




http://affordablepipes.com/


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## DCBluesman (May 9, 2006)

Same problem everytime.  Everybody wants to go to heaven but nobody wants to die. []


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## Pipes (May 9, 2006)

To a popint BUT we don't need to go from one PITA to one that takes food off the table a 100's a thousands !!IMO now []




http://affordablepipes.com/


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## Randy_ (May 9, 2006)

Ask that retired Coke executive if he is willing to allow a new refinery to be built in his neighborhood.  If I remember correctly, there hasn't been a new refinery built in the US since 1970.  US oil companies could stop buying that expensive $60/bbl oil from the Middle East; but the oil suppliers would just sell it to China, India and Japan whose appetite is growing by leaps and bounds.  The issue is much more complicated than a simplistic view that Exxon is making too much profit.  Grab your kids HS economics book and read up a little.  Americans have had a cushy ride for a long time with inexpensive gas and now we are seeing what most other countries have had to live with for many years.  

This not to suggest that folks on this side of the pond are totally blameless.  Government of both parties have been lax about encouraging more exploration and developing safer ways of extracting oil from the ground, auto companies have been lax in developing more energy efficient vehicles and the American public wastes incredible amounts of energy including the continuing purchase of SUVs and other gas hogs in large numbers.  

I have no way of knowing if the figures are true or not; but according to what I have seen, the big oil companies have less return on investment than the average US company.  Maybe we should all be screaming about lowering the price of a McDonald's hamburger because they are making too much money.

And one last thought......I'll bet a lot of those folks who are screaming about the high price of gas are the same ones who don't think twice about plunking down 4 bucks for a Starbucks Latte or a buck and quarter for a bottle of Evian.


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## alamocdc (May 9, 2006)

Okay, so 7% profit doesn't sound like much. Go look at the numbers. Oil companies profits totalled over 30 billion dollars last year. But they aren't gouging and raping the public. Of course not... that's just silly conspiracy theory stuff. [!] I don't begrudge anyone making a living, and certainly not even a profit, but my fuel bills are over $200 a month higher than this time last year and I certainly didn't get a $200 a month raise. Did you? If so, I'm happy for you. If this keeps up you'll see me in bankruptcy court. Corporate greed is at an all time high today (and countless books have been written about it recently) and no one seems to give a damn. Well I do. Unfortunately, like the rest of you, I'm at the mercy of our capitalistic (read rapidly becoming socialistic) society. Okay, 'nuff said before Jeff banishes me. [:0]


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## woodbutcher (May 9, 2006)

Well guys the good news is I can pull up to any station anywhere and fill my tank, no minimums or waiting in line all day. If you figure in inflation $3.00 a gallon isn't so bad either. If the average American car had properly inflated tires and a tuneup and mebe a change of oil to a synthetic product the average savings nationally would probably be in the 10% range. I drive a F-150, a Lincoln Town  Car and an '04 Mustang Cobra. Keeping those tanks full is not cheap. My point is if we just made our vehicles run as efficiently as possible some of this might fix itself. You can be sure that once all is said and done about high gas prices more will have been said than done.
Jim[]


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## loglugger (May 10, 2006)

Not defending the oil Coâ€™s but does anyone know how much they have invested to make those big profits? 
Bob


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## KingBubbaTruck (May 10, 2006)

I'll ask my BIL (Brother In Law).  He's currently working in one of those something-stan countries trying to make sure the blood of commerce flows freely.  It's incomprehensible how much money goes in to pulling that slick stuff out of the ground.  

I can't remember off the top of my head, but the project he is working on is just incredibly expensive.  It's hard to believe it's even economically viable, but they pull incredible quantities out of the ground and then we burn it!

As far as taxes and profits go, If the price of gas is $3.00, at 7% the oil company gets $0.21 (21 cents) of profit.  The Feds get 18 cents, Kalifornia gets another 18 cents, and those countries that really don't like us get a whopping big part of the rest of it......  So basically, the Government is still making a bit more on every gallon than the Oil companies.

It'd be nice to think that hyrdrogen or hybrids or electric would solve our problems, but personally, (Since I am from the midwest) I'd like to see something like ethanol become a bigger player.  I really don't know much about the economics of corn, but it seems to me that at some point, when the oil prices get high enough, it will become viable...

Ahhhh, why am I getting involved in this..... It's just like throwing gasoline on a fire[}]


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## penhead (May 10, 2006)

I know I should keep my fingers off the keyboard, this is sent from a personal point of view.  It's my understanding that the oil co's have desired, for quite some time now, to start new explorations in areas that were previously 'off-limits' to new exploration.  Suddenly the price of gasoline hits the $3/gal line before the news media starts making it news. Big oil company's report record profits for the first quarter (surprise??). President Bush makes a speech in which he states he will make sure that those profits are put toward new research (including opening up previously closed areas of explorations).

Hmmm, let me think about all that for a moment...nope, couldn't be what I'm thinkin..nope.


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## penhead (May 10, 2006)

If those people purchased their Hummers or Tahoes or whatever gas guzzler when the price of gasoline was in or close to the $3/gal range, then they have no reason to complain. However, if they purchased that same vehicle when gas was around the 1$+ range, and now its at the $3+ range...well, that might give some cause to verbalize discontent.

As for paying the price for a good espresso or latte...well, ya gotta do what ya gotta do []


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## whatwoodido (May 10, 2006)

But given that gas guzzlers are one of the reasons that the demand for gas is so high, it is its own self fulfilling prophecy.  They buy something that will cause increases in demand and then complain when the increased demand increases gas prices.  And the best part of it is that if gas prices drop again sales for gas guzzlers will increase again even knowing that the likelihood of their being higher prices in the future.

Drew


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## Chuck Key (May 10, 2006)

It is my understanding that the oil companies make much less that seven percent on a gallon of gas perhaps half that.  The seven percent is on total revenue where the oil company may be getting 70 percent profit on that cup of coffee and doughnut you buy with your gas at a company owned convenience store.


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## gerryr (May 10, 2006)

Lou is right about ethanol.  Last summer I drove through North Dakota and had to stop for gas.  The station also had something called E85, which I believe is 85% ethanol(could be wrong though).  The price of E85 was about 60% of the price of regular gas, but of course my behemoth Expedition couldn't use it since it was too old.  Ethanol makes perfect sense economically and environmentally.  It also helps the farming community.  The next vehicle is going to be a hybrid and hopefully one that can use E85.


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## alamocdc (May 10, 2006)

New exploration? Why? I owned an oil field service company from 1079 until the bottom fell out of the market for CONUS production in 1983. My company worked over 300 wells during that time and only 1 was dry (wouldn't be a producer). How many went into production, or have been put into production since they were drilled? About 10%... MAYBE. Why? Because of contractual stipulations, etc., old production doesn't sell at the current rate. In other words, they wouldn't get as much for it so they leave it in the ground. Did I say corporate greed earlier? Just checking.


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## Dario (May 10, 2006)

Some (conspiracy theory) say, the reason for reduced local production is because US doesn't want to deplete its local supply.

Use everything out there and when one one else have any oil left...we corner the market or atleast have some for ourselves.

Could this be true???  Nope not US, we won't think this way. [][}]


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## wood-of-1kind (May 10, 2006)

> _Originally posted by alamocdc_
> <br /> I owned an oil field service company from 1079 until the bottom fell out of the market for CONUS production in 1983.



OK, Billy I knew you are OLD but not that old. Did you really have your company from 1079? Creepers, like you're now a 1000 years old.[:I]Man, you don't look a day over 99[)]

-Peter-[]


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## penhead (May 10, 2006)

OK, math word problem... []

So if oil companies are getting 7% or less on a gallon of gas, ...and if one oil company made over $8-billion dollars _profit_ in the 'first' quarter of this year....how many gallons did they sell?


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## Dario (May 10, 2006)

If it is sales it will be much easier...since $8B is only PROFIT, it will be tough. [}]

You know, the small things like: 
How much does the CEO get paid?
How much political "contributions" they give?
etc. 

Oil is slick...but for some reason....money makes things move a lot easier [}][}][}]


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## huntersilver (May 10, 2006)

I just think it is odd that when the Oil Execs went before congress
last October after Katrina.  Gas magically went from over $3 a gallon to $1.99, how is that.

My sense is a boycott on Exxon, would not work.  The total demand for gas would remain the same, just spread among fewer players.

Is 7% a fair profit margin?.  I would be willing to trade a 40% profit on a $1M business for a 2% profit on a $10B business any time.


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## PenWorks (May 10, 2006)

Okay....okay, my turn.....
Not everbody hates the oil companies, my little cousin who graduates from Texas A&M this year was courted real heavily by Shell oil. My jaw dropped when I heard his starting pay, then when I got it back in place, slammed the floor when I heard his signing bonus. Now granted, little Jimmy got his degree & masters in 4 years, where he got his smart genes sure don't know, wasn't my side of the family. []

Another thought on the huge profits from the oil companies, it only cost them about 5-15 dollars a barrel to pull it out of the ground. They are making huge profits, selling the barrels on the spot market.

And the last thing....every company I have invested in the last several years that was energy related, fuel cells &  hydrogyn fuel , I lost my arrss. I think there is a conspericy to keep them off the market or for me to loose my money [V]


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## PenWorks (May 10, 2006)

While gas has went up $1.00 a gallon, have you looked at gold lately..
From $450 to $690 in less than a year. [:0]
So who manipulates this market ??
Don't cry to me when the cost of gold nibs go up []
Today it hit 708.00






<br />


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## alamocdc (May 10, 2006)

> _Originally posted by alamocdc_
> <br />New exploration? Why? I owned an oil field service company from 1979 until the bottom fell out of the market for CONUS production in 1983. My company worked over 300 wells during that time and only 1 was dry (wouldn't be a producer). How many went into production, or have been put into production since they were drilled? About 10%... MAYBE. Why? Because of contractual stipulations, etc., old production doesn't sell at the current rate. In other words, they wouldn't get as much for it so they leave it in the ground. Did I say corporate greed earlier? Just checking.



Oops, edited to correct 1079 to 1979. Y'all didn't know I was that old, did you? [?][B)]


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## huntersilver (May 10, 2006)

Yes, but Gold was above $800.00 in 1980.
Isn't that market mostly manipulated by fear
and uncertainty?


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