# pen mill pilot feeler



## Daniel (Aug 25, 2008)

Cancelled due to lack of demand.

8-31-08 estimated complete prices added
Photo added 8-31-08


Update 8-28-08
Cutter heads both 4 blade and 6 blade are being added for $1.75 ea not including shipping, postage or pay pal fees. compare to $2.42 from Rizheng.
these also carry a 500 pc min order. but can be ordered as a separate item.

I have done a complete re write of this post so that it is clearer. 
Prices now include all shipping, and pay pal. and for full sets postage. postage on individual pilots will depend on the weight of the order.

full set price $58.93 


pilots will be laser engraved for the bit sizes they match.
3/4 inch cutter head 4 blade $2.09
3/4 inch cutter head 6 blade $2.09
I bit                  $0.79
7mm, J, 9/32      $0.84
L                      $0.94
8mm, O, 8.2mm   $1.09
21/64                $1.16
11/32, S            $1.28
T, 23/64            $1.30
U                      $1.39
3/8, V               $1.51
25/64, 10mm, X  $1.62
13/32               $1.68
Z, 10.5mm         $1.92
27/64               $2.04      (compare at $14.99)
11mm, 7/16       $2.45
15/32               $2.85 (compare at $19.99)
31/64               $2.92
12.5mm            $2.82
1/2                  $3.06
33/64               $3.42
13.3mm            $3.35
17/32               $3.55
35/64, 14mm     $3.70
37/64               $3.98 (compare at $19.99)
19/32              $4.13

Full set total (Pilots Only) $58.93

At this time all prices are based on estimated weights for the pilots.
charges still not included
since these prices are all actual cost any changes in actual cost will result in a change in the final price.
some items that may cause changes.
1. Western Union transfer fee. this will be relatively small and I am not sure at this time if any adjustment to prices will even need to be made for it.
2. mailing small orders of a few pilots of heads will be done by First Class mail. the postage will need to be added as well as the cost of the envelope to mail them in. this will all be added up and simply called the postage charge.
3. my estimated weights are off. this could cause a change in price either up or down.
4. all prices that have been quoted to me are dependent on both steel prices and oil prices, and are subject to change at any time.


Min order is 500 pieces for any one size of pilot or cutter head. I know I will not do a 500 order buy in one shot. If there is enough interest I will see if someone is willing to do it. If not I will double these prices and do it my way.
The shank on all of these pilots are 0.247 inch this means the 7mm pilot is basically straight. cutter heads with smaller holes will not work with these pilots.

list for full set (21 of 500)
heads (53/500)
sdlewis 1 set 10-4 blade head
markgum 1 set
fritz64 1 set
GlassScratcher 1 set 10-4 blade cutter heads.
Joeatact 1 set 3-6 bladed cutter heads
will 1 set 2-4 blade heads 2-6 blade heads.
helgi 1 set
rhahnfl 1 set
Beck3906 1 set
jharvey1309 1 set
kcordon 1 set  2-4 blade heads 2-6 blade heads.
ScribbleSticks 1 set
brez  1 set 2-4 blade heads 2-6 blade heads.
RDH79 1 set 1-4 blade head 1-6 blade head.
                               Rob                                          1 full set and 4  6-blade cutter heads
JerrySambrook  1 full set and 4  6-blade cutter heads
MLKWoodWorking 1 full set 
1JaredSchmidt 1 full set 
gad5264   1 full set 2-4 blade heads 2-6 blade heads.
rjwolfe3  1 full set 
GeorgeM  1 full set 2-4 blade heads 2-6 blade heads.
Daniel


----------



## sdlewis (Aug 25, 2008)

In that case. Scratch my last, and I would be interested in a complete set.


----------



## Daniel (Aug 25, 2008)

a list of pilot sizes has been added to my original post.


----------



## markgum (Aug 25, 2008)

Hi Daniel;
  Sounds like a nice additon to my set of tools.  Put me on the list.
thanks.


----------



## Daniel (Aug 25, 2008)

Mark, I just read your signature, thanks for the laugh. I will add you to the list.


----------



## Glass Scratcher (Aug 25, 2008)

Daniel

I'm having a stupid post storm moment, so forgive me... Will these pilots fit the cutter heads we previously purchased in the group buy?


----------



## fritz64 (Aug 25, 2008)

one full set for me fritz64


----------



## Daniel (Aug 25, 2008)

Charles, Yes I am having them made to fit the heads that have been bought through other bulk buys. 
I have been adding bits and pieces of info to the original thread all day so keep checking back.
one thing I added was that the pilots will be engraved with there sizes like a drill bit is. a full set could get difficult to find the right pilot.
Fritz I will add you to the list.


----------



## Glass Scratcher (Aug 25, 2008)

Ok I'm in as well.


----------



## melogic (Aug 26, 2008)

Daniel,
Are you saying you can get a pilot for any of the sizes listed such as 12.5mm and 10.5mm? If so, how much extra would these two be if I was interested in the entire set?


----------



## Glass Scratcher (Aug 26, 2008)

Which also begs the question, what happens when a "new" pilot/drill appears on the scene?  The obvious answer from those that are handy turning to the nth measurement is make your own, however...


----------



## joeatact (Aug 26, 2008)

I would be in for a set Daniel.


----------



## Daniel (Aug 26, 2008)

melogic said:


> Daniel,
> Are you saying you can get a pilot for any of the sizes listed such as 12.5mm and 10.5mm? If so, how much extra would these two be if I was interested in the entire set?



Mark I can work up prices for each pilot, but it takes a mountain of time to do and I still have a lot of unknowns in order to do it. But if this buy manages to meet the min I will have individual prices posted before the end.

Charles, as it is there is a pilot for just about every 32nd of an inch from 1/2 to 37/64. hope that makes since. and a 32nd of an inch is just about what you can get away with for difference in sizes for the pilots. put more simply there are not a lot of bit sizes that could be added below 39/64 that this set would not work for in one way or another. It does not mean it cannot happen but i don;t see pens getting much larger than they are, or smaller.


----------



## will (Aug 26, 2008)

I would be interested in a complete set.

Please Add 2ea 4 blade and 2ea 6 blade cutter heads to my complete set order.

Bill
Baltimore, MD


----------



## Jarheaded (Aug 26, 2008)

I haven't passed on one yet, why start now? I'm in.


----------



## Daniel (Aug 26, 2008)

Johnnie, got ya, I know I can always count on you.

a little more info on the possibility that a tube size will come along later on.
this set starts at less than 9/32 in size. 9/32= 18/64. and has every 64 of an inch increment all the way up to 37/64 covered except 4
   19/64 (L pilot and 8mm pilot fall in this gap)
  20/64 (L pilot and 8mm pilot fall in this gap)
  29/64
  36/64
this means that you cannot have a pilot that is more than 1/64 of an inch smaller than any tube between those two extremes. 1/64 inch is 0.016 inches.
this means that 29/64 and 36/64 are the next two bits sizes to expect to have to buy. lol


----------



## Glass Scratcher (Aug 26, 2008)

Ya set the hook already!  Now yer just wiggling it around.  I said I'm in, didn't I?


Where are those dagum imoticons when you need them?


----------



## helgi (Aug 27, 2008)

Daniel,
Could you please add me to your list, and is the same working relation for this still in effect for up here in Canada.
thanks for doing all this,
helgi,


----------



## devowoodworking (Aug 27, 2008)

Yes Helgi, I'm working very closely with Daniel, as a Canadian 'hub' so we can get all the items he's offering direct from me to Canadian members so we can avoid all the usual problems with regards to shipments from the U.S.  (eg. shipping times, duty, currency exchange, etc......)


----------



## rhahnfl (Aug 27, 2008)

I'd be interested in a complete set as well...


----------



## beck3906 (Aug 27, 2008)

I would take a complete set also.

Rick


----------



## jharvey1309 (Aug 27, 2008)

I'd be in for a full set as well.


----------



## Daniel (Aug 27, 2008)

I have added everyone that has posted up to this point.
Same deal on Canadian orders.
Sorry Charles didn't mean to torture you like that. or diiiiiiid I....?

ok one more bit of info. at this time I have 6 seperate ads running. on these forums people are able to go back and edit there original post which means I have to keep a pretty sharp eye on every post on every thread. 
Not only that but information is sort fo scattered here and there. this message is a good example. it is likely that many of the very people that need to see it wil not come back to this thread to read it.
To make it even worse these are all new buys, and new buys always have adjustments, changes and just little pesky things involved. So I am constantly addign this and that message wondering int he back of my mind if it is not all getting just annoying to all of you.
SO here is my answer. I am working on making a web page on my site that will contain all this info in one place. it will include everything I am offering now
HSS twist drill bits
TiN twist drill bits
HSS Brad Point bits
TiN Brad Poiont bits
HSS Parabolic bits
pen mill pilot sets
pen mill cutter heads
It will also give my background in doing buys as well as my reasons for seeing the need for changes. I will also have an update section on each of the items so that you can easily find out if there is anything new such as price changes etc.
as buys get complete this web page will be chagned from a group buy development format, to having pay buttons on all the items so that people can click and pay . this is where all of you will be directed to go to pay for your orders once a buy is ready to collect payments. the experience for all of you would be the same as ordering from any other supplier. 
I hope to post a link to the rough draft on this web page in the next couple of days. Any comments or suggetions are not only welcome but incouraged. I want it to be smooth and easy to understand even though it will have a lot of information on it.
thanks to all and I plan to keep this going as long as it takes.



One problem wit this is keeping the buy in the public eye on groups. SO I am asking for any help in spreading the word on all of these buys. i don't mean go spam evey site you know of. but if you see someone asking about drill bits please post a notice about these bit buys. if you see people having trouble with pilots let them know about this. it wil help fill this buy up faster and get your items to you quicker.
500 sets sold is not impossible. I did far better than that with cutter heads. but it could take a very long time.


----------



## Daniel (Aug 28, 2008)

I have added Cutter heads to this offer as well.
both 4 blade and 6 blade for $1.75 ea. again with no shipping, postage or pay pal added.
to get an idea how much that will add the actual price Rizheng charges for a 4 blade cutter head is $2.42. 
At this time I do not see this buy is likely to go anywhere. realistically for it to even have a chance it needs to have about 100 orders right now. For me to get these sets in the min amount needed would be over $20,000 so it will not be on the list to be bought by the group buy any time soon. I will keep this offer up and keep everyone on the list. who knows what will happen in the next year. I have been working on this idea for about 4 years so far and am in no hurry.

NOTE: I will consider ordering cutter heads separate from pilots but they also carry a 500 pc. min order. There have already been several large cutter head buys this year and I do not expect there to be a huge demand for them just yet. 

I have received to sample sets of pilots and cutter heads and they are nearly identical to the Rizheng sets. In my opinion these are made from better quality steel than anything I have seen from suppliers. they do not get dented when the set screw is tightened. and to me the machining looks ore like that of drill bits than pot metal that I see in my pilots and heads from both PSI and CSUSA. there are indications that these pilots are made by a different manufacturer though. angles on the ends are different, the flute is a different shape and the cutter head itself is just a little shorter. I will ahve to discuss theproblems I have had with Rizheng cutter heads with Vera onorder to help avoid any more defective heads. That is somethign I will do if this looks like it will fill up.


----------



## kcordon (Aug 28, 2008)

Daniel,

I would take a complete set with 2 of each cutter heads.

THanks,


----------



## beck3906 (Aug 28, 2008)

Daniel,

Is there a larger cutter head than 3/4 inch available?  I would like something up to 7/8ths or even 1 inch to cover the larger bodied pens.

Also, if the complete sets are in the $20-25 range, I would like 2 complete sets.  Let me know if they get to be more than about $25 per set and I'll decide from there.


----------



## Daniel (Aug 28, 2008)

Rick as of now a full set of pilots is $40.74 and that dose not include any shipping postage or pay pal fees. 
there are no larger cutter heads but the 3/4 inch should be big enough for any pen out there unless you are doing something custom. I am thinking that the Panach has the largest end of any pen and this cutter is large enough for it.
If anyone knows differently please post a correction.
I will re write my original post so that it is clearer.


----------



## brez (Aug 29, 2008)

Daniel,

Please add me to the list for a full set.

Thanks
mike


----------



## RDH79 (Aug 29, 2008)

Daniel,
Add me to your list for a full set and one of each of the cutter heads.
Thanks Rich H.


----------



## sdlewis (Aug 30, 2008)

Daniel,
    Can you add one of each cutter head to my complete set.  Thanks.


----------



## Daniel (Aug 30, 2008)

Mike, Rich and Steve, added you all or made changes.
Thank you.


----------



## robandkaren (Aug 31, 2008)

1 full set and 4  6-blade cutter heads please

Rob


----------



## joeatact (Aug 31, 2008)

Daniel,

 Add 3 of the 6 bladed cutters to my set


----------



## Daniel (Aug 31, 2008)

Rob, I added you to the list, Joe made your changes.


----------



## JerrySambrook (Aug 31, 2008)

Could you put me in for one full set and 4 six-blade cutter heads

Thanks
Jerry


----------



## Glass Scratcher (Aug 31, 2008)

Well you might as well add me in for a ten pack of 4 blade cutter heads.


----------



## brez (Sep 1, 2008)

Daniel,

Please add 2 of each of the cutter heads to my order.

Thanks
Mike


----------



## Daniel (Sep 1, 2008)

everyone to this point should be added to the list in my original post. please check it to make sure I have everything right.
Thank you.


----------



## 1JaredSchmidt (Sep 2, 2008)

I'd be interested in some.


----------



## gad5264 (Sep 2, 2008)

Daniel,
I would like to have a set also and please add 2 each of the 4 and 6 blade cutter-heads.


----------



## rjwolfe3 (Sep 2, 2008)

Daniel,
I might be able to swing one of these sets if the price stays down.  If you have to double, I won't be able to until next Feb or Mar.


----------



## Daniel (Sep 2, 2008)

Rob, I always like to keep prices as low as possible. I went lowest prices on this buy because the min is so high. This also means I will very likely never do another buy for them. at the rate orders are coming in the min will be met in just over a year. so no rush. If it does ever get made the shipment will weigh 1.25 tons (5lbs X 500) and it will take 20 cases of priority video mailers to re mail them. There is a lot to be considered in all that.


----------



## GeorgeM (Sep 2, 2008)

Daniel,
Please put me down for a set and 2 each of the 4 and 6 blade cutter-heads. 
Thanks,


----------



## helgi (Sep 2, 2008)

Hi John,
Finally back up and running again thanks for the info and will look forward to hearing from you.
helgi


----------



## sdlewis (Sep 4, 2008)

Hey Daniel,
    Put me down for a total of "10" 4 blade cutters, and a complete set.  that.  I promise this is the last change of mind for me.  Thanks


----------



## Daniel (Sep 4, 2008)

No problem Steve. just a sneak peak forward for everyone. assuming this buy will ever get off the ground. I will make a web page with pay buttons on it and that is how everyone can make there final order.
It looks like cutter heads could reach the min order but the sets are a long way off.
I will do a buy separately from the pilots if needed.


----------



## Daniel (Sep 7, 2008)

Sorry folks I am canceling this idea. not even close to enough demand even at cost pricing. besides I really messed up and could have lost a ton of money at these prices anyway.
anyone that needs cutter heads can contact me i will continue a list for them but doubt they will ever reach this min. I will no longer do cutter head buys from Rizheng. Since the last group buy I have found even more problems with the machining in those heads even in the replacement ones. These heads and pilots are from a different company.


----------

