# 1st. dumb question from a noob



## mikeinco (Aug 1, 2014)

I'm brand new to the world of pen turning and have the first of probably many questions. Here goes, I've been doing a lot of reading about drilling blanks and the question is this if you put a chuck into the tailstock to hold a drill bit and the head stock with a chuck to hold the blank, what stops the tailstock chuck from rotating when engaged with the spinning blank? Thanks.


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## Rockytime (Aug 1, 2014)

Hi Mike,
The blank in the headstock does the spinning. The drill chuck in the tailstock is prevented from turning by virtue of the morse taper gripping the female taper securely in the tailstock.


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## Charlie_W (Aug 1, 2014)

Check out Exotic Blanks website. Scroll down and you will find " How To" videos. Number 1 addresses drilling a blank.

Answer: The morse taper on the drill chuck seated in the tailstock will usually prevent the drill chuck from spinning while drilling, BUT, you must hold the drill chuck with your hand so it will not come out of the tailstock when you withdraw the bit from the blank. Damage to your lathe and you can occur.


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## navycop (Aug 1, 2014)

So the top part of this (end with drill bit) will not turn while in the tailstock? Also welcome to IAP mikeinco.


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## ed4copies (Aug 1, 2014)

navycop said:


> So the top part of this (end with drill bit) will not turn while in the tailstock? Also welcome to IAP mikeinco.



Yes, it WILL turn if it doesn't seat completely or if the blank "grabs".
SO, keep your left hand on it, while your right hand turns the handle of the tailstock, advancing the quill.  CONTINUE TO HOLD as you pull the bit OUT of the blank.


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## sbell111 (Aug 1, 2014)

navycop said:


> So the top part of this (end with drill bit) will not turn while in the tailstock? Also welcome to IAP mikeinco.



The top part of the drill chuck does not turn in relation to the morse taper.  If you think about it, the one in your drill press doesn't, either.


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## WriteON (Aug 1, 2014)

ed4copies said:


> navycop said:
> 
> 
> > So the top part of this (end with drill bit) will not turn while in the tailstock? Also welcome to IAP mikeinco.
> ...



Sorry keep hands away from chuck.  Don't get injured over a pen blank. If the drill chuck spins shut off the headstock power and gently reseat the tail stock drill chuck. Remove the drill bit and retract the chuck jaws. I put a small block of wood against the face of the chuck and tap gently with a rubber mallet.


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## Dale Allen (Aug 1, 2014)

Righton WriteON.  I do not hold on to the drill chuck either.  I value my wrist way too much.
If you advance the drill chuck a small amount each time and not let it or the blank get too warm, it generally won't get stuck in the blank.
Take small bites.  Back it out often and use the suction end of a vac to clean up the shavings and cool the bit.
I often take 10-15 minutes to drill a 2" hole in a blank.
Put the vac hose right over the end of the bit while it is out of the blank and you would be amazed how quickly the suction will cool it down.
And, for plastics, use some non-stick spray as a lube...you'll be glad you did.


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## edstreet (Aug 1, 2014)

I am shocked that no one has mentioned it before. ....

The drill chuck has a key that is used to clamp to the drill bit to keep it from freely spinning.  (note this, it is very important)

With ease and 100% safety with assurance the housing will never, ever, spin you can hand hold it.  Simply hand tighten it so if there is a catch the drill bit will freely spin.  just like the nut on a mandrel shaft being tight enough to do light work but allow free spinning blanks in the event of something harsh coming in contact with it 

So, same concept, same principal, same safety factor.  The worse thing that can happen here is the drill bit snaps, which I might add is way cheaper to replace than your hand.


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## kovalcik (Aug 1, 2014)

With all due respect, you need to hold onto the chuck while backing the bit out of the blank.  If the bit catches and pulls the chuck from the tailstock while the lathe it on, it can throw the chuck and bit assembly across the shop if your lucky, or right at you if you are not.  There is very little chance of injuring your wrist from holding the drill chuck. There is a much greater chance of damaging youself and your equipment if you don't hold the chuck in the tailstock.

Anybody remember this post:
http://www.penturners.org/forum/f18/hang-your-chuck-117339/


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## Smitty37 (Aug 2, 2014)

I don't think I turn anything hard enough to over power my hand hold on the chuck. I think that especilly VS mini/midi lathes with a DC motor, probably won't develope enough torque to cause injury befor you could let loose of the chuck if something does catch.


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## Jim Burr (Aug 2, 2014)

http://www.penturners.org/forum/f18/hang-your-chuck-117339/

This covers it well...


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## mikeinco (Aug 2, 2014)

Thanks for all the responses. I now have a clearer idea of what happens with the chuck in the tailstock. I'm will be using an old(1955) Shopsmith that I just recently traded for and am still learning how the thing works. Thanks again.


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## sbell111 (Aug 2, 2014)

Jim Burr said:


> http://www.penturners.org/forum/f18/hang-your-chuck-117339/
> 
> This covers it well...



Just like it did two posts prior to yours.


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## mikeinco (Aug 2, 2014)

Second dumb question: I have a pen mandrel for the SS, do I need different size mandrels or do the bushings for different pen blanks all fit the same mandrel?


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## kovalcik (Aug 2, 2014)

mikeinco said:


> Second dumb question: I have a pen mandrel for the SS, do I need different size mandrels or do the bushings for different pen blanks all fit the same mandrel?



Most bushings will fit a standard type A mandrel, which is probably what you have for your SS. It is ~1/4".  There are a few that are made to fit a type B mandrel which is larger.  With the vendors that I deal with, I have not seen a pen that needs a type B mandrel.


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## Smitty37 (Aug 2, 2014)

Tom, covered that well.  I think there are some specialty mandrels but you don't need to know about them until you are ready to use them.


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## turncrazy43 (Aug 2, 2014)

There are two size mandrels, A and B. The A is the most common and all "A" bushings will fit that size mandrel. The B size is slightly larger and the "B" bushings will fit that mandrel properly. See Berea Hard Woods web sight to see the difference. Be sure the MT size matches that of your lathe. Use the A or B bushing size that matches your mandrel and kit and you should be fine.
_______________________________________________________
Everyday I'm vertical is a great day


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## mikeinco (Aug 2, 2014)

Thanks for all the great info, I really appreciate it. The only "current" issue is trying to process all the information I've read, and at my age the "processor" is starting to slow down.:biggrin:


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## edstreet (Aug 2, 2014)

mikeinco said:


> Thanks for all the great info, I really appreciate it. The only "current" issue is trying to process all the information I've read, and at my age the "processor" is starting to slow down.:biggrin:



wood craft, local IAP chapter, local turning club and various other places can offer help in this matter.


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## Smitty37 (Aug 2, 2014)

mikeinco said:


> Thanks for all the great info, I really appreciate it. The only "current" issue is trying to process all the information I've read, *and at my age the "processor" is starting to slow down*.:biggrin:


Yea, tell me about it.....


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## Big (Aug 2, 2014)

Welcome from Pensacola, FL and another Newbie!


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## plano_harry (Aug 2, 2014)

Welcome from Texas Mike!  Don't recall seeing anyone mention it --

Some tailstocks are self-ejecting: when you back the tailstock crank to retract the quill (extending part) all the way into the tailstock it pops the taper out for ease of changing.  If your SS does this, you will need to advance the quill about a 1/4" out to allow the jacobs chuck taper to seat completely.

The technique is: wipe off the taper to make sure it is clean and free of debris, then either mildly (where mildly is suitably defined, not much force) slam it into the quill female taper, or insert while pressing and twisting.  This should form a tight friction taper fit that will be pretty difficult to rotate or pull out without a drive rod inserted through the quill, or using the self ejector (if it has one)


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## skiprat (Aug 2, 2014)

Well, I for one am not doing to find out if either of my lathes are more powerful than my wrist or fingers or any other bits I was born with.
I drill and turn a lot of stainless and the long ribbons will remove my fingers quicker than you can say ' F..Darwin' 

My method has served me well.....

1. Maintain your morse tapers and seat them properly and they wont fall out. My drill presses have B16 and morse tapers with no drawbar.....never fallen out.

2. I have my right hand on the TS wheel and if I think the drill bit may bind, then my left hand hovers over the stop button. :wink:


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## Smitty37 (Aug 2, 2014)

skiprat said:


> Well, I for one am not doing to find out if either of my lathes are more powerful than my wrist or fingers or any other bits I was born with.
> *I drill and turn a lot of stainless and the long ribbons will remove my fingers quicker than you can say* ' F..Darwin'
> 
> My method has served me well.....
> ...


If I was drilling and turning stainless steel, I don't think I'd be doing it on my midi wood lathe.  And I would probably have an entirely different thought about what is safe to do and what isn't.


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## Ambidex (Aug 2, 2014)

skiprat said:


> Well, I for one am not doing to find out if either of my lathes are more powerful than my wrist or fingers or any other bits I was born with.
> I drill and turn a lot of stainless and the long ribbons will remove my fingers quicker than you can say ' F..Darwin'
> 
> My method has served me well.....
> ...


 

wait...Darwins first name was Fred????..dang I miss being a regular here:biggrin:


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## navycop (Aug 2, 2014)

The Shopsmith is backwards from say a jet lathe. The tailstock is part of the assembly. There is a MT2 in it for a live center and drill chuck. The blank has to be mounted to the headstock and then quill advanced to the bit.


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## skiprat (Aug 2, 2014)

Smitty37 said:


> I don't* think* I turn anything hard enough to over power my hand hold on the chuck. I *think* that especilly VS mini/midi lathes with a DC motor, *probably* won't develope enough torque to cause injury befor you could let loose of the chuck if something does catch.


 


Smitty37 said:


> If I was drilling and turning stainless steel, I don't *think* I'd be doing it on my midi wood lathe.  And I would *probably* have an entirely different thought about what is safe to do and what isn't.


 
You see the difference here Leroy??  *You're* not sure, but *I know* for sure. :wink:

The problem here is that some people are just too damned quick to dish out advice. You *now* know that for me, it would be stupid to hang on to my chuck, but advice has been given to a new guy without knowing just how strong they or their machine might be. 

This thread is proof to the old saying....
'There are no stupid questions,.....only stupid answers':wink::biggrin:


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## Smitty37 (Aug 2, 2014)

skiprat said:


> Smitty37 said:
> 
> 
> > I don't* think* I turn anything hard enough to over power my hand hold on the chuck. I *think* that especilly VS mini/midi lathes with a DC motor, *probably* won't develope enough torque to cause injury befor you could let loose of the chuck if something does catch.
> ...


 I am not sure because I don't know enough about drilling stainless steel anywhere.  I believe I can honestly say I have never drilled stainless steel so I don't think would not treat it like wood, acrylic or polyresin.  You on the other hand, have drilled it and know what the "risks" are.


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## sbell111 (Aug 2, 2014)

I'm confused.  Was the OP asking a question about working stainless steel?


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## Rich L (Aug 2, 2014)

sbell111 said:


> I'm confused.  Was the OP asking a question about working stainless steel?



Post #3 suggested that the OP hang on to the drill chuck to avoid a problem if the workpiece grabbed and the chuck came out of the tailstock. That's the origin of some of this discussion.

Couple things:

1) smack the taper together so it doesn't come out
2) no machine shop I know or have heard about espouses or allows anyone to hold on to the drill chuck in order to prevent a problem. Why? It's bad practice.

The good practice is to smack the taper together, know your materials, speeds and feeds, coolant, lube or not, depth of cut, etc., and to operate accordingly.

I know that a lot of lathes and power tools used by members of this forum are light duty and may or may not be overpowered by muscle but that doesn't make it good practice just because you can. A sharp edge powered by a thousandth of a horsepower will draw significant blood and part you from your measly pound of flesh.

When was the last time your drill press chuck came out of its taper? Doesn't happen often even when the drill grabs. It's because it's smacked in there. I know a lathe is a different beast and the moving piece vs stationary piece is reversed but if the taper slips, that's detectable immediately under manual operation and the red button should be handy.

More fingers than workpieces will be saved by good practice.

All right --- done. Thanks for reading and happy turning.

Peace,
Rich


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## WriteON (Aug 2, 2014)

At Ease everyone. Regardless of everyone's technique and advice I'd like to see the manufacturers lathe manual where it says...Hold onto the chuck while drilling. At that point we can close this thread. Until then...Err on the side of caution and safety. 1 mistake,1 accident is way too many. Have fun but safety is always first. Follow the same safety routine each and every time. Do not improvise.


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## Smitty37 (Aug 2, 2014)

sbell111 said:


> I'm confused.  Was the OP asking a question about working stainless steel?


No the subject was related to holding the chuck while drilling on a lathe...drilling stainless steel was injedted as a reason not to.


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## kovalcik (Aug 3, 2014)

A couple things to add in.  You are not holding the chuck to overpower the lathe.  Most catches are not severe and a little hand pressure will keep the chuck seated in the tailstock.  If a catch is more severe, you will feel the chuck coming loose and can stop moving the tail stock and power down the lathe before the chuck can free swing.  I agree that drill press MT do not come loose often, but I am not taking my chuck in and out of my drill press many times, and there is no chance of dust or buildup that can cause the taper not to grab.  I don't drill stainless on my lathe, so that is not something I am addressing and I will defer to those with experience.

To each his own.  If it does not feel safe to you, don't do it.  I was told to keep my hand on the chuck by a very experienced turner (20+ years) who uses a wood lathe that, as he puts it, could turn a VW.   He has all his fingers and no wrist issues.  It has been reinforced  by other experienced turners in the turning clubs I belong to.  I think I will stay with his advice.


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## JimMills (Aug 3, 2014)

*Drill chuck taped to hold a draw bar*

1/2 in. Drill Chuck #2MT at Penn State Industries


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## Birch Green (Aug 9, 2014)

Dale is correct, don't hold on to the drill chuck.  make sure both the male and female tapers are clean and free of any oil, also set the tapers together with some force.

If the tapers are in good condition they will hold fast.

Happy  Turnings


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