# Spray Lacquer



## 4reel (Jun 20, 2006)

I am spraying Lacquer on Blanks, I get grey streaks on occasion and need to clean them off with alcohol and sand and spray again. I am using micromesh, is this dirty micro mesh or is it something else that someone else has found the answer too. If finished to a 12000 grit nothing comes close to the depth and clarity of the shine. It is a ton of work however.


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## mrcook4570 (Jun 20, 2006)

Sounds like you need to let the lacquer cure longer.


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## Rifleman1776 (Jun 20, 2006)

It is possible you are dragging material from the bushings on to the blanks when you sand. Many clean the blank with denatured alcohol before applying finish. I have found that the alcohol a/k/a DNA tends to raise grain slightly and requires resanding. Not fatal but just another step or two on the finishing process.


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## wdcav1952 (Jun 20, 2006)

I agree with Stan.  It sounds like you are trying to finish the lacquer before it cures.  I wait at least a week before trying to mm or buff a lacquer finish.


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## 4reel (Jun 20, 2006)

I waited 24 hours that is what the can says for full cure. I have put a good shine on some with only 2 hours of cure. That may have been just lucky.


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## bjackman (Jun 20, 2006)

If you're "spraying" your laquer from an aerosol type spray can, ie deft spray can, you may have problems sanding regardless of how long you let it cure. They add lots of drying agents, etc in most of those cans and they can end up a much softer finish than using the same laquer brands stright from the paint brush type can. 
I have ruined many a finish trying to buff  after deft spray finishing, even after many days or months of curing.
If you are spraying straight laquer from an airbrush or airless system you probably just need to let it cure some more.


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## Firefyter-emt (Jun 20, 2006)

Huh, I do all mine is Deft spray can. I have had no problems other than blushing if it's too humid (then I spray and hang them in my off ice with the A/C on) [ I am looking into dipping though.

Do you have a photo of what is going on? I also wait a week for 7 coats


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## RussFairfield (Jun 20, 2006)

My first thought was that you are getting blushing. You said it was in streaks, and that could be from the wood not being as dry as you think it is. You can solve that problem by turning the pen to "close", letting it sit for a couple days, and then finishing it.

If you live in a humid climate, you can also get blushing by putting the spray lacquer on too soon after sanding. Let the wood cool down to room temperature before putting the finish on it and see if that solves the problem. Remember that the mandrel also will have to cool, so this can take an hour or two.

Wiping the wood with alcohol or thinner before spraying can be the cause of the blushing if you didn't wait long enough for all of it to evaporate out of the wood. Alcohol can hold a lot of water that is absorbed into it from the air, and that water could be your source of blushing in streaks. If you are using alcohol or thinner to clean the wood, the solution is to us fresh alcohol and give it an hour to evaporate. Alcohol is relatively slow in drying, and it penetrates into the wood, so it takes awhile for it to evaporate out of the wood, even though the surface might appear to be dry. 

People who use Isopropyl Rubbing Alcohol are asking for trouble, because it contains 30% water that is introduced into the wood.

I always do a wip-on-wipe-off with lacquer from the can before spraying. This cleans all of the contaminates from the wood without introducing anything that is incompatible, and it leave a primer coat on the wood that is ready fro spraying.

But I am wondering why you are having to sand a sprayed lacquer finish. You should be leveling the surface between coats, but the final spray coat of the lacquer  should be giving you a surface gloss that doesn't need sanding or polishing. It should be smoother and have a brighter gloss than anything you can do to it. 

I would suggest that you might be do a better job of sanding and polishing the wood before putting the lacquer on it. Sand the bare wood to a flawless 12,000 Micro-Mesh surface, and then spray on the lacquer.

If you are still having to sand and polish, do as everyone else has said, and let the lacquer sit for a week before doing anything. That week can be shortened to a couple days if you are in a dry climate, but most of us will have to wait a week.

This is probably more than anyone wants to know about spraying lacquer. But, lacquer is the easiest finish to put on a piece of wood, but I think it is the most difficult of all finishes to do well. 

What I have said makes no difference whether you are using a spray can or a gun.


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## 4reel (Jun 20, 2006)

Thanks Russ, I will try the polish the wood then spray. I was taking it down quite a way but not that fine. All you guys have been helpful. I was not aware of the moisture issue. The wood was over a year so I was a dry as it could be but I did not wait for cooling. I thought the warmth would speed the cure. Not true as I hear. Thanks


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## Rifleman1776 (Jun 21, 2006)

Bill's comments are interesting because a number of people here and other lists use spray Deft with success. In fact, several produce spectacular results. Spray a light coat, let dry a couple hours, resand with fine grits, repeat as many times as you want until desired effect achieved.


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## bjackman (Jun 21, 2006)

Frank,
Maybe I'm just too "aggressive" when buffing.... []
It has usually just been attempts to fix a flaw in the finish. Had a couple that took on the pattern of the fabric of my tri fold pen case, A couple that "might" have been dropped or damaged by someone looking at them, etc.
Sanding seems to work ok usually unless I let too much heat build up, then I have seen a ring/line appear on the outer surface.


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## Rifleman1776 (Jun 21, 2006)

> _Originally posted by bjackman_
> <br />Frank,
> Maybe I'm just too "aggressive" when buffing.... []
> It has usually just been attempts to fix a flaw in the finish. Had a couple that took on the pattern of the fabric of my tri fold pen case, A couple that "might" have been dropped or damaged by someone looking at them, etc.
> Sanding seems to work ok usually unless I let too much heat build up, then I have seen a ring/line appear on the outer surface.



The advice given me when I started using Micro Mesh was "light touch". That is what I do, the MM has nearly zero pressure on it when against the wood. Understand, my finishes are still a long way away from a Lou or Griz (or others) finish. That's probably due to a personality flaw of being impatient. But to look at my pens now and my early ones it is hard to believe the same person made them. Gather the advice given here and adapt to your own style.


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## 4reel (Jun 22, 2006)

When you spray with Deft or which ever product you use. Do you leave the pen rotating? I have been spraying while the pen rotates at about 1000 rpm. I ahve also tried at a very low speed, not much different in results. Also I thought that if you re-spray before 4 hours that you did not need to sand the surface.


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## Firefyter-emt (Jun 22, 2006)

I will tell you what I do, I have found (for me) the best way to spray them is on a spray rod. I turned some quick handles and epoxied a 1/4-20 rod into that. I have a normal nut towards the handle and then I have a brass tube cut into 3 pieces. I put on a piece of tube, then a blank, then a tube and blank followed by the last tube and an accorn nut. I have an eye hook screwed into the end of the handle to hang it on while they dry. This keeps the bushing from bridging to the blank and you can let them dry right on the rod over night. I then put them on pegboard hooks to cure for a week. The nice thing is that I do not get lacquer all over my lathe or mandral & bushings. I have "sleeves" that I use to mill larger tubes and I have enough to put larger pens on so I can spray cigars and what not the same way. 

To "strip" the finish, but a can of Acetone.. Better than thinner and vastly better than alcohol.. If you ever need to refinish a pen after you get it apart, it will wipe the lacquer right off weeks or months later. 

This has worked very well for me with the Deft, and like I said, if it's real humid and you can place them in a room with A/C you can stop the blush.


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## 4reel (Jun 23, 2006)

Great idea, it also frees up the lathe and you can organize what blanks for each type of pen. I like it.


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## 4reel (Jun 25, 2006)

Another question if anybody is still looking at this. I took Russ's idea and polished the pen prior to finishing it. The first coat was like glass, all it lacked was depth so I figured a second coat would be a good idea. Two hours after the first i sprayed on the second coat. IT still is shiney but I can see small dimples that have started. Was I spraying to far away, second coats are a bad idea? Any thoughts


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## Firefyter-emt (Jun 25, 2006)

It could all depend on your choice in lacquer. I have used the Deft for almost all of them, the pen on the spray rod above was done in a diffrent lacquer. (Old Masters) and it is junk. It went on like spraying glue! Compared to the nice fine mist of the Deft this stuff just spat out of the can and went on three times as heavy. I left it on just for a test, but a wipe with aceatone will take it all off if I want to start over with the Deft. Give it a week, wet sand it on a slow setting and a fine grit paper (I use 2000 wet, no MM yet) and polish with some automotive synthetic compound & glaze. Then you will have glass! []


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## MDWine (Jun 29, 2006)

I love the deft finish, but for my process, it takes time to do properly... 

1. turn to dimension, sand to 800 at the least, most of the time to 12000.  ALL sanding is done end to end, the length of the blank, the lathe IS NOT SPINNING.

2. remove from mandrel, transfer to a 1/4" threaded rod "mandrel" using tapered washers to separate the blanks.

3. I spray deft on each blank.  all coats are lightly sprayed.  Day one: two to three coats of deft (gloss) with no less than 30 min between coats, I prefer an hour between.

4. Day two, same thing... and repeat until I have at least 6 coats, I prefer 8 or 9 coats.

5. THE HARD PART... I rack the fake mandrel in a 2X4 drying rack, and don't touch them for at least a week, I prefer two... sometimes when I am lucky or busy, it is three!!

6. I use MM to sand the finishes.  I use a very light touch, and magnifying glasses to examine the progress...  Once I hit it with the 12000, it looks great!

7. Another hard part, I let the rested "finished" finish stand for another day before waxing or TSW.. (gotta check w/sensei on that one)

8. I've tried TSW on these, and I regularly use RenWax.  I am wondering if the finish isn't just a tad soft.  Maybe it needs to rest even more after finishing.  I use one of those elastic string boxes to transport pens.  If I leave the pens in there too long, I can see the marks left by the elastic... quite distressing.

I have done CA, and can get a pretty good finish on a pen, but I prefer the warm feel of the deft... unless "unaxol" proves to be as pretty and more durable.  I'll be checking with sensei on this one!


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