# Pen Wiki!



## jeff (Aug 27, 2007)

Over in this topic I gave you a hint that I'm working on a new penturning information resource. I want to give you some more information and get you all thinking about how YOU can contribute. This isn't something I can do, or a few of us can do. It will require the support of our entire community. 

Heard of Wikipedia? Familiar with the concept of a Wiki?

As the Wikipedia article says, a wiki is *a collaborative website which can be directly edited by anyone with access to it.* I encourage you to read the Wiki article as it answers a lot of questions I'm sure many of you have about just how the heck something like that can work.

The bottom line is that we're going to build the biggest, most complete, most easily used encyclopedia of penturning anywhere. Whenever you're looking at a page in the wiki, you'll be able to add to it, fix errors, adjust grammar, etc. It might sound like anarchy, but it's collaboration at it's finest. Remember, "none of us are as smart as all of us". As the years go by, the wiki will just get  bigger and better. 

I'm still working on installing and configuring the wiki software on one of our servers. I have never administered a wiki before, so there's been a bit of a learning curve. Hopefully the time I'm taking now will pay off later in ease of use and less effort for all of you content authors.

Once I get this done, I'm going to solicit about 20 people to work on getting some basic content in there. They'll be assigned to write very simple paragraphs (wiki pages) that describe the basic elements of pen making that we discussed over here.

They'll cite dozens, probably hundreds of terms and concepts that you all can then define, refine, and describe. For example, one of the original authors might write an overview of the tools and equipment needed to make pens, but won't describe things like the various types of lathes, or the various ways to sharpen a chisel. You can imagine that concepts fan out like a spider web from a single original article.

After the original authors get done, we'll open it up to the world to revise and improve. There will be plenty of how-to info coming on editing and working with the wiki software, and I'll also appoint some wiki "champions" who will be able to provide help using the wiki, and will arbitrate disagreements. We'll also set up a forum section just for discussing the wiki and it's content.


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## wdcav1952 (Aug 27, 2007)

WOW, Jeff, that sounds ambitious, to say the least.  Are you really going to let people like Ed4copies loose on a project like this???? [][]


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## GaryMGg (Aug 27, 2007)

Cav
We thought you'd watchdog over Ed [][}]


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## alphageek (Aug 27, 2007)

Jeff...  I had half a feeling thats where you were headed... Which Wiki 'engine' did you go with... PM me if you'd like - I would love to help where I can - I have gotten alot from this site already and can try to help where I can....

I develop software in my 'real' life - so I can help with some of the technical side.

Dean


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## RonRaymond (Aug 27, 2007)

Will it be called Wikipenia?  Sorry, couldn't help myself.[]


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## jeff (Aug 27, 2007)

> _Originally posted by RonRaymond_
> <br />Will it be called Wikipenia?  Sorry, couldn't help myself.[]


Nope, "The Pencyclopedia" I registered ThePencyclopedia.org and .com a few weeks ago. They'll point back to the wiki at penturners.org.


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## jeff (Aug 27, 2007)

> _Originally posted by alphageek_
> <br />Jeff...  I had half a feeling thats where you were headed... Which Wiki 'engine' did you go with... PM me if you'd like - I would love to help where I can - I have gotten alot from this site already and can try to help where I can....
> 
> I develop software in my 'real' life - so I can help with some of the technical side.
> ...


I evaluated a bunch, then selected http://www.pmwiki.org/ It's written in PHP and does not use a database, which for the size wiki we'll have is fine.

The next competitor was MediaWiki, which is what runs Wikipedia, but managing that beast is a full time job. It also has a lot of built-in stuff that we don't need which would have made it harder for casual contributors to help out.


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## gerryr (Aug 27, 2007)

> _Originally posted by wdcav1952_
> <br />WOW, Jeff, that sounds ambitious, to say the least.  Are you really going to let people like Ed4copies loose on a project like this???? [][]



You'll just have to follow him around and correct his spelling and grammar.  It's a hard job, but someone has to do it.[]


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## alphageek (Aug 27, 2007)

Looks like a logical choice.  It should fit well with this crew.. The sandbox on their site looks like the editor is clean and easy.


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## ed4copies (Aug 27, 2007)

> _Originally posted by gerryr_
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I'm certainly glad my "friends" have defined their expectations of my entries.

I wil mak f-ry tmpt 2 keeeep em buzxy![B)][B)][:0][:0]


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## gerryr (Aug 27, 2007)

Aren't you glad you have friends like us, Ed?[][}]


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## ed4copies (Aug 27, 2007)

> _Originally posted by gerryr_
> <br />Aren't you glad you have friends like us, Ed?[][}]



Beets halving enemyys!!!![:0][:0]


(Marginally, sometimes!)


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## Texatdurango (Aug 27, 2007)

> _Originally posted by ed4copies_
> <br />...Beets halving enemyys!!!![:0][:0]
> 
> (Marginally, sometimes!)


I'm glad I re-read that comment, for a second I thought you said "beets having enemas"  then I thought, anything beats that![]

Can't wait to start in on the Pencyclopedia, I'm assuming rookies will have the same access as the "OTF's" (Old turning... uh, Folks)!


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## GaryMGg (Aug 27, 2007)

I thought Ed meant "[I'll] be halving my enemies." Kind of Machiavellian, don't'cha know. []


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## wdcav1952 (Aug 27, 2007)

> _Originally posted by GaryMGg_
> <br />I thought Ed meant "[I'll] be halving my enemies." Kind of Machiavellian, don't'cha know. []



I'm not sure, Gary, I lost my concentration when Tex asked for an enema!!!!! [:0]


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## gerryr (Aug 27, 2007)

I'm try to visualize a beet having an enema.[?][}][][]


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## Glass Scratcher (Aug 28, 2007)

> _Originally posted by jeff_
> Nope, "The Pencyclopedia" I registered ThePencyclopedia.org and .com a few weeks ago. They'll point back to the wiki at penturners.org.



Jeff, what's to keep some Yeahoo from joining, logging in and then being destructive to the articles?


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## Rifleman1776 (Aug 28, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Glass Scratcher_
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That's the downside of a 'wiki' concept. No vetting or control. And, it is why I never use Wikipedia for reference or information. Anyone can put anything up there, right or wrong. Sadly, many believe what they see and often pass it on as fact. OTOH, I have to admit it is very popular and hundreds of millions of people like it and use it. This old cynic ain't one of them.


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## gerryr (Aug 28, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Glass Scratcher_
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That's what we're all here for.


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## Texatdurango (Aug 28, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Glass Scratcher_
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Jeff, I think this Wiki idea sounds great on the surface but with the mix of people we have, some of the articles are going to be hilarious as they go along.

Can you imaging how a simple tutorial is going to look after Ed with his spelling disability or Julia with her Tennessee drawl get through editing?

Then along come a few of our northern neighbors putting an â€œehâ€ at the end of every sentence or the folks across the pond correcting the phrase â€œyou have to get durn near center or the blank will be off a hair and turn caddywhompusâ€ with phrases like â€œnot quite spot onâ€.

Heck, Iâ€™ll bet thereâ€™s some that donâ€™t even know the difference between yaâ€™ll and all yaâ€™ll! 

This otta be fun![]


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## Fred (Aug 28, 2007)

Just how far off is caddywhompus anyways?


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## ed4copies (Aug 28, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Fred_erick_
> <br />Just how far off is caddywhompus anyways?



Just a hair north of FUBARed.[][][][]


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## alphageek (Aug 28, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Texatdurango_
> Heck, Iâ€™ll bet thereâ€™s some that donâ€™t even know the difference between yaâ€™ll and all yaâ€™ll!



Even knowing the difference doesn't mean that some of us will ever understand that the contraction for "you all" is singular![?]

Dean


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## jeff (Aug 28, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Glass Scratcher_
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You didn't dig in to the article link I posted. []

Try this one: http://computer.howstuffworks.com/wiki.htm

See the section on wiki vandalism and edit wars.


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## Rifleman1776 (Aug 29, 2007)

> _Originally posted by alphageek_
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You must be from New Yawk City. Don't ye know nuttin'? [] Y'all means just that, y'all. Don't matter how many y'all are. It's just y'all. Sheesh.....


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## alphageek (Aug 29, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Rifleman1776_
> You must be from New Yawk City. Don't ye know nuttin'? [] Y'all means just that, y'all. Don't matter how many y'all are. It's just y'all. Sheesh.....


Actually.. I'm from the land of Frozen Tundra (the Packer kind, not the Canada kind)... And if it doesn't matter how many y'all are, then why is there also "all y'all"???


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## GoodTurns (Aug 29, 2007)

Those from the "Nawth" (spit) often have trouble understanding their cousins from the holy land (the south).  I order to help bring us a little closer, I have composed a short pronouns guide for those who were not blessed to be born south of the line....

Conjugation Chart for Southern Pronouns

Singular (I)	I, Ah or ignored, i.e.  I am goinâ€™ down the store, Ahâ€™m goinâ€™ down the store, or simply Goinâ€™ down the store are all acceptable.

Singular (you)		You, yâ€™all	You goinâ€™ down store with me, Yâ€™all goingâ€™ down store with me?

Plural (We)	We, weâ€™uns (generally Pittsburgh area, Appalachia) us, usâ€™n(s) we all	We are goinâ€™ down the store, Weâ€™uns goinâ€™ down the store, usâ€™ns goinâ€™ down the store, We all goinâ€™ down the store.

Plural (you)	You, yâ€™all, all yâ€™all, youâ€™ns (generally Pittsburgh area, Appalachia)
	You goinâ€™ down the store? Yâ€™all goinâ€™ down the store?(usually directed at a previously identified sub-group)  All yâ€™all goinâ€™ down the store? (usually indicating everyone present)

Plural (them)	Them, them all, they, they all (all fully interchangeable) Them allâ€™s goinâ€™ down the store.

Obvious care must be taken when interpreting the potentially convoluted syntax of, say, an invitation to a social gathering or event. I.e. Ahâ€™m goin down the pig roast with them all, yâ€™all comin? Could represent any number of people in any number of trucks (assumed).

All firmly tongue in cheek!  I gots roots in both camps![][][][]


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## Glass Scratcher (Aug 29, 2007)

You forgot the singular, WE/US to replace I that some of us more eccentric Southroners use as well...[]


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## ed4copies (Aug 29, 2007)

I believe this thread has become a great example of a new term I will coin, "IAPped" (pronounced similar to Yapped).

We can define "IAPped" as a complete deviation from the initial intent.  Moving so far "off subject", Sherlock Holmes would be left clueless in an attempt to return to the source.

I expect we will NEED this term frequently, if we assemble a Pencyclopedia.  Which, by the way, in no way discourages an attempt to do so.  "IAPping" (the present form of IAPped) can be a very GOOD thing and is one way this group of strangers has turned into a "community" (as opposed to a "village" for you Hillaryats-pronounced similar to "hillarious").

So, Jeff, you are directly responsible for a new word that I bet we can get into the dictionary in about five years!!!!  Congrats!!!!!!!!!![:0][:0][:0][:0][:0]


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## GoodTurns (Aug 29, 2007)

how about IAPjacked?


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## ed4copies (Aug 29, 2007)

> _Originally posted by GoodTurns_
> <br />how about IAPjacked?



Hard to pronounce, but worth consideration!!

Also COULD take us down roads that are better left untravelled!!![}][}]


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## Rifleman1776 (Aug 29, 2007)

> _Originally posted by alphageek_
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Like I said, 'sheesh'. Ye don't know nuttin'. If'n ye gotta ask, ye been froze up too long. After all, don't y'all wear cheese on yer haids?


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## GoodTurns (Aug 29, 2007)

Ed-  I was just worried about confusion....everyone's yapping all the time![]  guess that works for either definition!


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## drayman (Aug 30, 2007)

jeff, this all sounds fantastic, and i think you deserve a medal as big as a soccer ball[^]i think even me a computer novice will be able to understand and use it. cheers colin.[:I]


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## jeff (Sep 1, 2007)

Just a little update... I'm a bit held up on configuring the wiki... I am trying to integrate the security here with security in the wiki. I don't want people to have to have yet another username and password. That drives me nuts. I must have at least 20 passwords for stuff at work. Anyway, I am getting a little professional help (not the kind I really probably need [], but programming) to tie the two databases together. Updates soon...


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## drayman (Sep 1, 2007)

thanks for the update jeff.


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## Rifleman1776 (Sep 1, 2007)

A mini-scandal in Arkansas today. Wikipedia had some unflattering comments about former Governor Mike Huckabee. Mysteriously, they disappeared. Huckabee is Republican, the new Governor is Democrat. And, supposedly, his staff is also Democrat. However, Wikipedia was able, and did, trace back to the computer that was used to edit the remarks by using it's ISP number thingy. They discovered that a State, employee assigned, computer was responsible for the editing.  Will this be possible with Pen Wiki?


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## jeff (Sep 1, 2007)

> _Originally posted by Rifleman1776_
> <br />A mini-scandal in Arkansas today. Wikipedia had some unflattering comments about former Governor Mike Huckabee. Mysteriously, they disappeared. Huckabee is Republican, the new Governor is Democrat. And, supposedly, his staff is also Democrat. However, Wikipedia was able, and did, trace back to the computer that was used to edit the remarks by using it's ISP number thingy. They discovered that a State, employee assigned, computer was responsible for the editing.  Will this be possible with Pen Wiki?


Will what be possible? Tracing the IP back to the person who made the edit? Yes, however, we'll be using our penturners.org member accounts to log on to edit the wiki, so the member name will be recorded with edits.


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## jeff (Sep 11, 2007)

SUCCESS! I've finally got the Wiki talking to the forum user database. So we'll have logons and edit tracking based on username here. After tinkering with this thing for almost two months, I'm more excited than ever by the possibilities. There are still some wrinkles, and it isn't pretty yet, but we have to start somewhere.

SO, it's time to get the "Barn Raising" going. (That's how they describe the initial effort by a team to get some basic content in the Wiki.)

If you are interested in investing some time, you think you can write clearly, and you have enthusiasm for the Wiki concept, I want your help! We need about 20 people at most to work on this, so let me know by email if you want to help out.

I've set up a forum for discussion of this part of the wiki development, and I'll add the volunteers to it so we can have a place to discuss concepts, processes, etc.

Here's one request. You WILL need to invest a little time to understand the wiki concept, learn the editing tools, and understand the architecture of our wiki. ALSO, you'll need to check your ego at the door. This kind of collaborative effort doesn't have room for personal agendas, arguments, or big heads. If you're good with all that, jump on board!

Thank you all in advance. This is going to be fantastic!


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## alphageek (Sep 11, 2007)

Way to go Jeff... This will be GREAT.. If this gets setup well, it will make information for all more available!


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## GBusardo (Sep 12, 2007)

Excellent Effort!! []


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## jeff (Sep 16, 2007)

Still looking for a few good writers to get the wiki going. 

Being enthusiastic, somewhat computer savvy and good with words is all we ask. If you've got experience in various areas of penturning, we'd love to have you help get the wiki off the ground. 

Email me and I'll add you to the wiki discussion group.


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