# Burl Identification and Use Question



## Noot17

Hey all, 
Still new to the forum so hopefully I'm not posting in the wrong spot, but I was given a piece of Burl that was harvested in the 1930s. A couple questions: I was going to try to make some pen blanks out of it - any tips or anything I should be aware of? 
Also, can anyone identify the wood? I think it might be red oak based on the one picture from harvesting the Burl, but not sure if anyone could tell just from the Burl? I could probably post a couple more pics later. 

Thanks! 
Eric








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## Skie_M

Most definitely NOT any kind of Oak.


I would guess at some type of Mesquite or Cocobolo ... leaning towards the latter, as Mesquite doesn't quite grow very large.

How hard and dense is it?  There doesn't appear to be any sapwood between the heart of the burl and the bark, though that might not be a common occurrence if it's a bark inclusion.


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## Noot17

Interesting. I should also note that it was harvested in southwest Washington. 
It's pretty hard, but not super dense. It's also really dry though. 
Thanks for the help. 


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## jttheclockman

Very tough to guess woods. But if I were to venture a guess it wood be a walnut burl wood. a realy rare piece.


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## Noot17

This might help... Picture of them sawing the burl off.





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## Curly

One of the Western Maples.


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## Rob

Big leaf maple.  A lot of it was logged in the northwest years back.


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## 1080Wayne

Probably big leaf maple , although from the harvesting picture I would have thought there would be a bit of sapwood on the outer edges . Also darker than normal but 80 years of aging could do that . If you could sand some of the face and edge grain to about 400 grit , it would remove some of the oxidized layer and give a better look at it . 

If it were walnut , it would have the characteristic walnut smell when sanded .


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## Skie_M

Never would have guessed maple from that color ... but yeah, it's a very old piece of wood ... Hit the edge and face with some 120 and work your way up to 400 (less work) and then snap a few pics ... include a ruler next to it so we can give you some advice on which angles would be best to work!


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## Rob

Here's a maple burl pen I turned some time ago...surprisingly dark colored, but I think this is what the OP has.  Should make for a very attractive pen or ten!


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## Noot17

Awesome! Thanks for the input. I'll sand it down and get some pictures with a ruler. 

Any tips for making blanks? (besides the angle bit after I get some pics)


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## Skie_M

Once we can see the dimensions as well as the underlying grain, everybody will be able to have some idea of which directions it may be best to cut it in ... probably the best idea for processing it would be using a bandsaw, as a tablesaw's larger kerf would mean more wasted wood.


I see two flat areas on the edge of the burl .... my input will likely involve taking off the lesser left side flat area or simply splitting it up the middle where the angle meets, and then putting the flat sides against a fence on the bandsaw to cut your blanks to size.  See picture for a visual of this idea ... obviously, the size of the cuts you make depends on the actual size of the material you have.






If you are needing normal sized pen blanks for smaller pens, then 5/8ths to 3/4ths would be ideal ... if you are wanting oversized pen blanks for larger pens, then go to 7/8ths up to 1 inch squared for your blank size.

I would also highly recommend that if you are CLOSE to the proper depth of cut but a little over, use the bandsaw and fence combination to slice away some veneer and save it for later use.  Doing this before cutting it down to the small pen blank sizes would be best, if you can manage it.


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## Noot17

Thank you for the explanation and visuals! That helps a lot. Unfortunately the piece is pretty curved, but if I cut it in half like you show, each half is a lot closer to level than the whole. 
I sanded it down to 400 and also used some mineral spirits to wet it down some for a picture. 
Definitely excited to get such a great piece of wood. I think I'll practice quite a bit more before turning a pen from this... 











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## robutacion

Hi,

The burl is not from around my neck of the woods and I'm most surprised that you have a pic of these burl being cut all that long ago, that is priceless.

If pen blanks is what you want to get out of it, knowing now what the underside of that slice looks like, my suggestion to where and how that piece should be cut, is explained in the pic attached.

After you got it divided into the 3 pieces and then sliced at approx. 20mm slices/boards, you can then slice them again at 20mm and then decided where to cut to get you pen blanks from, all the edges could be used to make hybrid/cast blanks and use the whole thing, absolutely no waste.

Best of luck...!

Cheers
George


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## 1080Wayne

You have more wood there than I thought . I would start with George`s first two cuts . Then , you have to decide whether you want all pen blanks or a mix of pen blanks and larger pieces . The thickness would allow larger items to be made , such as bottle stoppers or S&P shakers . As George said , all of it can be used . Potential for lots of nice castings .

Looks like the colour will be very close to Rob`s picture .


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## Skie_M

Definitely pay attention to George's advice!  He's been round the block a few dozen times with burls!


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## Noot17

Great! Thanks all. I'm a ways off from doing castings, but I think I'll cut some blanks and then save the other stuff to cast down the line. I might even try to get a large enough piece for salt and pepper shakers too. That sounds cool. 


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## Noot17

Last question (maybe) - best way to clean off the bark side? It's obviously saturated in dust... 


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## Skie_M

Clean off? .... vacuum hose or blast it with some compressed air ....

Remove? just cut it away as you work your material to get your blanks out of it.


As you work the material ... the thickest parts are where you are going to want to try to get your large blanks from.  Cut those sections out first, and trim them up.

As you get to making the pen blanks, you'll want to set your band saw fence up to perhaps 3/4" or 5/8" for best yield for that particular chunk and your plans for it in the future ... slice it with the flat angle against the fence and the large flat face DOWN on the table, and if it's thick enough (or you just want to trim it square, which I would do anyways), you take the piece you just cut and turn it so that the face you just cut is now against the table, and run it through again to get your squared blank.  If there's enough material to do it again, count yourself a lucky man and run it through again!  Continue in this manner till you are finished cutting the pen blanks square.

At this point, grab your miter gauge, set it for 90 degrees, and run your blanks through as a crosscut, to square your blank ends ... makes things so much easier when it's time to put them on the lathe or try to stabilize them  (a good idea, with burls!).

When all is said and done, grab your off-cuts and leavings, and if you DO NOT plan to get into doing mutt blanks or hybrid casting blanks or whatever they're being called behind their backs, you can offer them up for a flat fee + shipping or something over in the "For Sale" forum, and someone who wants to take up that challenge will snap them up in a hurry, I'm sure ... 

Last, but not least ... you really DON'T want to remove the bark, itself.  That's one of the selling points of the hybrid type blanks .... a natural live edge surface that can be seen as part of the finished pen... but bark is typically a fluffy, weak material that breaks and damages easily, so stabilization is a must for that type.


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## Noot17

Once again, thank you for your very helpful input! I'll reach out if I run into any other questions in the blank making process  


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## Noot17

Also, do you have an example of a hybrid blank pen with the bark still attached? I've seen hybrids but not sure if I've seen one with bark... 


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## Skie_M

Hmmm ... went poking around a few sites .... this is a "mixed mutt" blank with bits and pieces suspended in a black resin, I don't see any bark included.






Quick check of PeachTree's hybrid blanks shows that their bark is all removed ...

This blank on Etsy appears to have had it's bark left on ... it's a bottle stopper sized blank, 6 cm x 6.5 cm x 11.5 cm...







So ... I guess it depends on the preference of the maker and end user, ultimately, as to which is preferred ... but in order to give the best choice, I'ld leave the bark on and send it on to whoever's making the blank, and let them choose whether to remove the bark or include it.

In that bottle stopper sized blank, there are two pieces of burl ... the larger one is bottom left, smaller one tucked top right.  (This item is not mine, just grabbed a random link off the search page and came across this image.)


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## 1080Wayne

Further to Skie`s excellent advice on blank cutting techniques , I would suggest that after each cut through the bark you saturate the bark/wood boundary with thin CA , to ensure the bark stays on . I don`t have any experience with bark on big leaf maple , but on some other maples the bark is only loosely bound to the wood when dry . 

S&P shakers can also have natural edge bark surfaces . I usually sell them at a premium . Will see if I can find a photo or two . 

Last thing to consider is the influence of the finish on the appearance . CA usually doesn`t darken wood much unless it is very punky , but isn`t something I would often use on S&P shakers . Walnut oil seems to darken wood less than linseed oil or tung oil finishes .


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## robutacion

Well, I have cast many blanks with the bark, and blanks made only of bark but those are not what you are after, here.

From pen to knife handle blanks, I still have a few that can be seen on my web-store, this is one of the places where bark is found on many blanks.https://www.georges-bits-of-timber.com/collections/resifills-resin-filed-cast-knife-blanks/products/resifills-polyester-resin-cast-knife-handle-blanks-and-others-sold-singly

Cheers
George


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## 1080Wayne

Found a few pictures . First is big leaf maple , not a burl but with a type of spalting that it sometimes has , tung oil sealer finish ; second is Diamond willow , totally natural edge , bark and orange pincushion lichen adhere tightly , but used thin CA on them to be sure ; third is Saskatoon , part of the bark natural edge , part partially turned through , bark is held very tightly but may have assisted it with CA in a place or two , tung oil sealer finish
IAP Home - Photos - S&P shakers
IAP Home - Photos - S&P shakers
IAP Home - Photos - S&P shakers


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## Noot17

Very cool. Thanks for the examples. That helps visualize what can be done and definitely gives me something to work towards! 


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## Noot17

For anyone interested, here are the first pens I made from this burl. 









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## Gwatson50

Very pretty 


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