# INTERNATIONAL SHIPPING



## Smitty37 (Feb 7, 2013)

AS MANY OF YOU ALREADY KNOW - INTERNATIONAL SHIPPING HAS BECOME A CAN OF WORMS FOR A LOT OF US SMALL VENDORS - TO THE POINT WHERE AT LEAST SOME OF US ARE CONSIDERING ENDING SHIPMENTS TO OTHER COUNTRIES.

DEPENDING ON THE SHOPPING CART WE'RE USING WE HAVE LIMITS ON WHAT WE CAN DO WHEN CALCULATING SHIPPING CHARGES.  HENCE, IT IS DIFFICULT TO LET OUR CART CALCULATE INTERNATIONAL SHIPPING, ESPECIALLY WHEN USING USPS.

I WANT TO GET INTERNATIONAL (NON-USA) BUYERS OPINION ON A COUPLE OF OPTIONS.


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## UKpenmaker (Feb 7, 2013)

I have voted, but to be honest i would go with whatever is easiest for the seller.

I don't know about other people over here in the UK, but i am just glad there are people who are prepared to ship overseas. 
It would make things very thin on the ground if we had to source supplies from just the UK


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## ed4copies (Feb 7, 2013)

As you consider this question, bear in mind that EVERY international requires more steps than a domestic shipment.

The shipper has to do the Customs paperwork and, in the case of SOME countries, the shipper has to appear at the Post Office, stand in line and complete the transaction there.  

We can ship four domestics in the time it takes to ship ONE international, assuming we don't have to go to the post office.  If we DO have to go to the post office, the ratio becomes closer to 10 to 1 (domestic to International).

Every step we add increases the cost of that transaction.


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## skiprat (Feb 7, 2013)

No biggie at all really. 
When we order from any overseas company, we know it's not going to get there the next day anyway, so waiting for an actual price for postage isn't a problem.

CSUSA used to send you a seperate email with the shipping costs and if you replied that it was ok, then they would simple add the cost to your transaction. 

But Like Andy said, what ever suits you guys is normally fine with us. :biggrin:


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## Mack C. (Feb 7, 2013)

I voted #3!  That's the method CS USA uses and it hasn't caused me any delay! At least until I experience rate the cost of shipping from individual retailers, I may change my mind after that.


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## Ligget (Feb 7, 2013)

I agree with Andy and Steve, plus I order a larger quantity of items rather than several small orders when buying from overseas.


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## Smitty37 (Feb 7, 2013)

I like #3 myself....but shopping cart limitations might mean a separate invoice for shipping and a separate payment...I don't know if I can get my shopping cart service to make a change or not.


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## Smitty37 (Feb 7, 2013)

ed4copies said:


> As you consider this question, bear in mind that EVERY international requires more steps than a domestic shipment.
> 
> The shipper has to do the Customs paperwork and, in the case of SOME countries, the shipper has to appear at the Post Office, stand in line and complete the transaction there.
> 
> ...


Also more cost if paying via paypal or credit card.  I think I my paypal fee is 1.5% higher on international payments...I've been eating that charge up til now but I don't know that I can continue to do so.


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## OKLAHOMAN (Feb 7, 2013)

Most shopping carts will NOT let you have the option to hold the order than let the customer pick a shipping method. I have  chargeing a flat rate  no matter the size and absorb  any overage most customers are very happy, if the flat rate is much higher refund the overage. I'm in the mist of developing a new site and I'll ask if there could be shipping options that the customer can pick.


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## Smitty37 (Feb 7, 2013)

OKLAHOMAN said:


> Most shopping carts will NOT let you have the option to hold the order than let the customer pick a shipping method. I have  chargeing a flat rate  no matter the size and absorb  any overage most customers are very happy, if the flat rate is much higher refund the overage. I'm in the mist of developing a new site and I'll ask if there could be shipping options that the customer can pick.


I know they won't that's why I said it might involve a separate invoice and payment for shipping.  

The problem with the flat rate is where the weight goes over 4 pounds or $400.00 value or the volume becomes too much for a small flat rate box -  the shipping then takes a huge jump when you need to go to a medium Flat Rate Box.  I will be talking to my store to see what we can do to put an order on hold.


For me, I either find a way to handle this or stop making international shipments.


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## skiprat (Feb 7, 2013)

Roy and LeRoy

Please note that I really doubt that any person from outside USA would begrudge you charging a suitable fee to cover your costs.  If your charge was silly, then we'd quietly just vote with our feet. 

Our big gripe is when the stuff lands in the UK....
It's most often hit and miss as to whether we get snagged for customs duty and other handling charges.
My experience has shown that the more 'professionaly' a box is packed and labelled determines whether or not it attract the customs man.
For me, most 'hand packed' stuff sails through, but for example, most CSUSA stuff is pro packed and often gets their attention.
What's on the label hardly matters. For some reason, CSUSA always use a huge box for just a small order. 
However, I will always still buy from CSUSA as they always seem to be the silent pro's in the background. Nothing phases them. 

An extra dollar or two certainly won't make any difference at all to us.

Even now, it's most often still far cheaper to buy from USA or OZ than in the UK.

Any vendor that thinks it's a chore to sell stuff to me won't be getting my money. It might be a big palaver to take my stuff to the post office now, but it wasn't such a big deal when they were just starting out.:wink:


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## OKLAHOMAN (Feb 7, 2013)

Smitty, just using today as an example, I had one order to Spain, one to Canada and one to Scotland and I'm offering a nice shipping discount during the bash, after charging my flat rate and giving the discount I lost $18 on the shipping, not a big enough deal for me as if I wasn't giving the shipping discount I would have not lost a cent and would have refunded a couple of dollars. I'm using International first class as much as possible. If I lose a few dollars to my international buyers again not a big deal as I think most would understand if we raised our prices to stay in business for them, but not until it effects my bottom line.


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## maxwell_smart007 (Feb 7, 2013)

I hate refunds, as we get charged currency conversion in the first place, and again on the refund.  

Not a big deal once in a while, but expensive on a regular basis.


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## Smitty37 (Feb 7, 2013)

maxwell_smart007 said:


> I hate refunds, as we get charged currency conversion in the first place, and again on the refund.
> 
> Not a big deal once in a while, but expensive on a regular basis.



Well they get us on both ends - I get charged because you are out of country
you get charged to convert currency.


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## Smitty37 (Feb 7, 2013)

OKLAHOMAN said:


> Smitty, just using today as an example, I had one order to Spain, one to Canada and one to Scotland and I'm offering a nice shipping discount during the bash, after charging my flat rate and giving the discount I lost $18 on the shipping, not a big enough deal for me as if I wasn't giving the shipping discount I would have not lost a cent and would have refunded a couple of dollars. I'm using International first class as much as possible. If I lose a few dollars to my international buyers again not a big deal as I think most would understand if we raised our prices to stay in business for them, but not until it effect my bottom line.



We have very different business models Roy.


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## Smitty37 (Feb 7, 2013)

*MY PURPOSE*

My purpose in this is not to settle on how we do things - that's up to each of us.  I'm hoping we can all gain some information about what our customers would like.  Shopping carts may dictate how we handle it, since most of them are not very flexible on shipping and not all of them will allow customizing, but at least we will know what to ask the cart services to provide. If international shipping is a headache for us, you can bet it's a headache for lots of other small vendors as well.


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## ed4copies (Feb 7, 2013)

Another aspect of this is the changing procedures of the USPS.  Only recently have they demanded that we come to the Post Office to mail to some countries.  I drop off packages every day, so they do know me by sight, but now I have to stand in the line and it takes the clerk 10 minutes to do the label that I can do at my desk much more quickly.

Local guys don't know why I have to "present myself" for some countries, but they do believe there will be additional countries added to that list.

As a side note, one bank that I go into to make deposits has a sign on the door now--they would prefer if I would remove my sunglasses and leave them in the car. "Those who are likely to rob banks prefer disguises".  I guess their video surveillance is fooled by sunglasses????

So, at least the USPS lets me come in with the sunglasses on---They seem to recognize me, nonetheless!!!

I don't know what a "package bomber" looks like---but I guess they do, so they will stop any "bad" packages.   Yeah, right!!


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## rixstix (Feb 7, 2013)

ed4copies said:


> Another aspect of this is the changing procedures of the USPS.  Only recently have they demanded that we come to the Post Office to mail to some countries.  I drop off packages every day, so they do know me by sight, but now I have to stand in the line and it takes the clerk 10 minutes to do the label that I can do at my desk much more quickly.



The rules must be different or enforced differently around the country.  Our post office asks why I stood in line when I could have either put the package into any "BlueBox" for pickup, into the package bin in the lobby or just put my stack of packages onto the pile at the unattended counter position for domestic and international.

"International mailpieces, including mail destined to APO/FPO/DPO  addresses, with a customs declaration *form that was not completed and  submitted online (e.g., using Click-N-Ship®)* must be presented by the  customer to an employee at a retail service counter at a Post Office  location."  I was assuming that everyone is submitting their customs forms online; not handwritten.

Like Smitty said, we're all different but our cart talks to either Stamps.com or ShipStation.com and can autofill the customs forms.  Cart talks to the USPS servers to provide 1st class and FR quotes based upon country.  Fedex has been a preferred choice by some customers over the Medium FlatRate boxes due to 2 day delivery, only a few dollars more and customs clearance is included in the pricing.


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## ed4copies (Feb 7, 2013)

Try Russia.

The drop down on USPS says it is available, then fill out the form and it tells you to go to the Post Office to purchase postage.

There are others we have encountered, but we don't remember which ones.  We do a number of International every week.

Edit in:  There is a list of about 30 countries that Dawn located for me.  Most of Africa, much of Russian Federation, Cambodia.

Also recall our shipments are frequently 10 pounds or more, not two pens.


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## rixstix (Feb 8, 2013)

ed4copies said:


> Try Russia.
> 
> The drop down on USPS says it is available, then fill out the form and it tells you to go to the Post Office to purchase postage.



Using an address in Moscow, ShipStation just allowed me to print the Endicia label with customs form without a problem.

I really hadn't a clue if it would be allowed or not and surprised me that it did print.

Is there a URL to an official list of countries not available using Click-N-Ship?  It wouldn't be the first time that we found a glitch in a 3rd party postage app.


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## maxwell_smart007 (Feb 8, 2013)

If I pay in US dollars, why do you get charged for me living in Canada?  Does paypal charge both ends?  Seems odd!


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## MesquiteMan (Feb 8, 2013)

Paypal charges a 1% Cross Border premium for all payments received from out of the country regardless of the currency paid in.  If the vendor allows payment in anything other than US dollars, then there is a currency conversion fee that is charged to the seller.  Most of us only accept payment in US dollars so the buyer has to pay any currency conversion fees.

Here is a really good Paypal fees calculator that I use:  PayPal Fee Calculator | SaleCalc.com


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## lorbay (Feb 8, 2013)

Smitty37 said:


> OKLAHOMAN said:
> 
> 
> > Most shopping carts will NOT let you have the option to hold the order than let the customer pick a shipping method. I have  chargeing a flat rate  no matter the size and absorb  any overage most customers are very happy, if the flat rate is much higher refund the overage. I'm in the mist of developing a new site and I'll ask if there could be shipping options that the customer can pick.
> ...



And thats why I voted #2

Lin.


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## maxwell_smart007 (Feb 8, 2013)

MesquiteMan said:


> Paypal charges a 1% Cross Border premium for all payments received from out of the country regardless of the currency paid in.  If the vendor allows payment in anything other than US dollars, then there is a currency conversion fee that is charged to the seller.  Most of us only accept payment in US dollars so the buyer has to pay any currency conversion fees.
> 
> Here is a really good Paypal fees calculator that I use:  PayPal Fee Calculator | SaleCalc.com



I thought it was just the buyer who took it for the team on Paypal - didn't realize they charged the seller too - for no reason, really...

Paypal seems like a bit of a racket!


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## OKLAHOMAN (Feb 8, 2013)

Admittedly 99% of my orders are not in the 10 pound range so that could make a difference but I do ship to Russia, Georgia and some African countries  often and never had to take to the P.O. using a third party postage supplier Endicia. 



ed4copies said:


> Try Russia.
> 
> The drop down on USPS says it is available, then fill out the form and it tells you to go to the Post Office to purchase postage.
> 
> ...


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## rixstix (Feb 8, 2013)

> The problem with the flat rate is where the weight goes over 4 pounds or  $400.00 value or the volume becomes too much for a small flat rate box -   the shipping then takes a huge jump when you need to go to a medium  Flat Rate Box



Did you know that the Priority Mail 0-1096L Large Video box can be used for International and ships for the Small Flat Rate International fee?  There's quite a bit more volume available when the O-1096L box is used.

The reason for the significant price increase on Jan 27 is that USPS International classes were moved into a category that competes with UPS and Fedex which also allows the USPS more flexibility in pricing than they have in pricing correspondence class mail.


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## Smitty37 (Feb 8, 2013)

OKLAHOMAN said:


> Admittedly 99% of my orders are not in the 10 pound range so that could make a difference but I do ship to Russia, Georgia and some African countries  often and never had to take to the P.O. using a third party postage supplier Endicia.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Roy might be using carrier pickup, I do - if you do, most things that say "go to the post office" are considered "handed" to an employee when the carrier takes them.

Strange as it seems Endicia does allow you to print some labels that the USPS website does not, but I never seem able to print APO labels there.

Someone mentioned dropping them in any blue box -- read the notifications -- some items can't be dropped in them.


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## Smitty37 (Feb 8, 2013)

maxwell_smart007 said:


> MesquiteMan said:
> 
> 
> > Paypal charges a 1% Cross Border premium for all payments received from out of the country regardless of the currency paid in.  If the vendor allows payment in anything other than US dollars, then there is a currency conversion fee that is charged to the seller.  Most of us only accept payment in US dollars so the buyer has to pay any currency conversion fees.
> ...


The General Rule is the receiver of the funds takes the hit all the time. The buyer only gets nailed for out of country --- If you get a lot of refunds and do a lot of purchasing from the USA you might look into keeping some funds in USD and when you have enough pay with them and avoid the conversion.  I think PayPal will let you do that.


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## Smitty37 (Feb 8, 2013)

rixstix said:


> > The problem with the flat rate is where the weight goes over 4 pounds or  $400.00 value or the volume becomes too much for a small flat rate box -   the shipping then takes a huge jump when you need to go to a medium  Flat Rate Box
> 
> 
> 
> ...


No I didn't know that - do you know where that is published.


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## Smitty37 (Feb 8, 2013)

As my cart is right now, I can't setup #3.  There is one possible way to do it but I don't know if it will work.  I'm going to look into it.  In the mean time I'm going with Charging a flat rate and refunding excess charges.


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## maxwell_smart007 (Feb 8, 2013)

Smitty37 said:


> As my cart is right now, I can't setup #3.  There is one possible way to do it but I don't know if it will work.  I'm going to look into it.  In the mean time I'm going with Charging a flat rate and refunding excess charges.



My concern with that is that it may affect your sales.  most of us will not buy ten kits with 20 shipping, when it'll be cheaper elsewhere, not knowing how much may be refunded

Just an observation...


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## OKLAHOMAN (Feb 8, 2013)

Smitty37 said:


> OKLAHOMAN said:
> 
> 
> > Admittedly 99% of my orders are not in the 10 pound range so that could make a difference but I do ship to Russia, Georgia and some African countries often and never had to take to the P.O. using a third party postage supplier Endicia.
> ...


 

I've made arrangements with the local postmaster to have a postal truck pick up packages daily at around 2PM every day so maybe that and Edicia printing lables that can't be printed on the USPS site account for me not having to personaly stand in line. Talk to your local postmaster about a daily pick-up or ask your post man.


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## Smitty37 (Feb 8, 2013)

*Restrictions*

This is from the USPS website:

Any mailpiece, including mail destined to APO/FPO/DPO addresses, with a customs declaration form that was not completed and submitted online (e.g., using Click-N-Ship®) must be presented by the customer to an employee at a retail service counter at a Post Office™ location. In addition, any mailpiece that requires a customs declaration form and bears postage stamps must also be presented by the customer to an employee at a retail service counter at a Post Office location.


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## rixstix (Feb 8, 2013)

Smitty37 said:


> rixstix said:
> 
> 
> > *Did you know that the Priority Mail 0-1096L Large Video box can be used for International and ships for the Small Flat Rate International fee*?  There's quite a bit more volume available when the O-1096L box is used.
> ...


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## rixstix (Feb 8, 2013)

rixstix said:


> "International mailpieces, including mail destined to APO/FPO/DPO  addresses, with a customs declaration *form that was not completed and  submitted online (e.g., using Click-N-Ship®)* must be presented by the  customer to an employee at a retail service counter at a Post Office  location."  I was assuming that everyone is submitting their customs forms online; not handwritten.





			
				smitty37 said:
			
		

> This is from the USPS website:
> 
> Any mailpiece, including mail destined to APO/FPO/DPO addresses, with a  customs declaration form that was not completed and submitted online  (e.g., using Click-N-Ship®) must be presented by the customer to an  employee at a retail service counter at a Post Office™ location. In  addition, any mailpiece that requires a customs declaration form and  bears postage stamps must also be presented by the customer to an  employee at a retail service counter at a Post Office location.



I don't see any difference in the 2 statements.  If you print your label online and you print your customs form online, you can drop the package in any BlueBox or any other mail receptacle.  The only thing that cannot be placed in a BlueBox is packages that use postage STAMPS.


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## Smitty37 (Feb 8, 2013)

rixstix said:


> Smitty37 said:
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> 
> > rixstix said:
> ...


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## rixstix (Feb 8, 2013)

Our cart currently offers customers choice of


First Class
Priority SM FR
Priority O-1096L
Priority Regional FR Box A
Priority MED FR
Express FR envelope
Fedex ground
Fedex economy
Fedex 2 day

USPS options are automatically removed from being offered to customers when the volume of the package is too small to contain the items purchased or weight limit is exceeded.  OR when international value is exceeded.

Quotes are obtained realtime from the USPS servers and Fedex servers and automatically include insurance.


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## Smitty37 (Feb 8, 2013)

maxwell_smart007 said:


> Smitty37 said:
> 
> 
> > As my cart is right now, I can't setup #3.  There is one possible way to do it but I don't know if it will work.  I'm going to look into it.  In the mean time I'm going with Charging a flat rate and refunding excess charges.
> ...


That could happen, but there's nothing I can do about it.  There are limits as to what my shopping cart will allow - I can't have both fixed rate (priority mail) and weight based (first class mail) to the same country.


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## maxwell_smart007 (Feb 8, 2013)

Smitty37 said:


> maxwell_smart007 said:
> 
> 
> > Smitty37 said:
> ...



As an option, then, would the following scenario help you?:
Base your shopping cart on weight - i.e. first class mail
Give an opt-out for purchasing a medium or large flat rate box, in which shipping would be pre-set to zero, and the shipping would appear as an item in the invoice - or would that affect your accounting? 

I'm not sure how often you ship first class as compared to flat-rate, but thought it might help sales to have both options on your site.


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## Smitty37 (Feb 8, 2013)

maxwell_smart007 said:


> Smitty37 said:
> 
> 
> > maxwell_smart007 said:
> ...


I would have fits trying to do my taxes - shipping would then be mingled with sales....


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## leehljp (Feb 9, 2013)

Having returned from living outside the US just over 2 years ago, and now having a daughter living in Brazil and lots of friends still in Japan, all I can say is that postage has increased tremendously in the last 3 years while affordable shipping SIZE has decreased quite a bit. I remember when we could ship "book boxes" (approx 12 X 12 X 18) and larger for $40 or less. And now small shipping is out of this world.

AS to what customers as a whole prefer, it will vary from person to person. I personally considered it a priviledge to be able to receive an order from the US, England, Canada, Oz, SE Asia or other country, if it was what I wanted. Rarely did I consider the shipping price to be a rip-off. 

There is only one company that I deal with on occasion that I do not order small parts from simply because their policy involves an outrageous shipping cost that involves processing and that is Grizzly. I think they charge about $7.00+ or so even if you order a specialty screw or washer.


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## Smitty37 (Feb 9, 2013)

leehljp said:


> Having returned from living outside the US just over 2 years ago, and now having a daughter living in Brazil and lots of friends still in Japan, all I can say is that postage has increased tremendously in the last 3 years while affordable shipping SIZE has decreased quite a bit. I remember when we could ship "book boxes" (approx 12 X 12 X 18) and larger for $40 or less. And now small shipping is out of this world.
> 
> AS to what customers as a whole prefer, it will vary from person to person. I personally considered it a priviledge to be able to receive an order from the US, England, Canada, Oz, SE Asia or other country, if it was what I wanted. Rarely did I consider the shipping price to be a rip-off.
> 
> There is only one company that I deal with on occasion that I do not order small parts from simply because their policy involves an outrageous shipping cost that involves processing and that is Grizzly. I think they charge about $7.00 or so even if you order a specialty screw or washer.


They're not alone...I ordered a small $1.50 fan for my computer from Tiger Direct and paid $10.00 shipping.  The thing is that if someone orders a single refill spring from me, it costs me as much to fill that order as it does to fill an order for a $50 package of pen kits and my margin on the spring won't even pay the postage. When someone buys something like that he's really buying the service not the part.


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## leehljp (Feb 9, 2013)

Smitty37 said:


> leehljp said:
> 
> 
> > . . .
> ...



Smitty,

Not arguing with you on this, but just giving some observations and some things that just don't make logical sense with that, especially with Grizzly. I go into Grizzly store in Springfield MO about 4 or 5 times a year (when visiting my daughter there) and I will spend 20 to 30 minutes talking with a sales person and getting great service. On a couple of occasions, I have needed a part that they spend 5 to 10 minutes looking for parts or the right tool.  These have not been high priced items or large parts, but small parts that would fit in an envelope. I spend less than $5.00, get 15 to 20 minutes of service together with some great conversation. 

Now compare that to an order for a washer or specialty screw. (Yes, I have picked them up when visiting.) They will spend 5 minutes looking, and 5 processing and packaging and charge me a total of about $10 for processing, packaging and postage. They spend more time on me for free (and other customers) than they do with an order. They can take care of 3 to 4 times more volume from orders in less time than they can from live customers, so why charge more for the processing fees? Doesn't make sense to me. This is not meant as a disrespect to you in any way, and I agree that people have to make enough of a profit to stay in business. But there seems that there is some wiggle room between small parts and customer service. :wink:


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## Smitty37 (Feb 9, 2013)

leehljp said:


> Smitty37 said:
> 
> 
> > leehljp said:
> ...


The difference is the clerk in the store gets paid the same whether talking to you, someone else or no one at all.  His/her job is waiting on customers.

Suppose you buy a single Parker refill spring from me for a dollar and pay via PayPal or credit card. Paypal takes $.33 and I get $.67 and the item might have cost me $.15 that leaves me with 52 cents. Without going into details I assure you that comes nowhere near covering the cost of shipping it much less the cost of handling and my overhead even if I figure nada for my time.


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## Jeannius (Feb 10, 2013)

skiprat said:


> Roy and LeRoy
> 
> Please note that I really doubt that any person from outside USA would begrudge you charging a suitable fee to cover your costs.  If your charge was silly, then we'd quietly just vote with our feet.
> 
> ...



hear, hear


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## rixstix (Feb 10, 2013)

Smitty37 said:


> Suppose you buy a single Parker refill spring from me for a dollar and pay via PayPal or credit card. Paypal takes $.33 and I get $.67 and the item might have cost me $.15 that leaves me with 52 cents.



If you have a significant number of $10 or less sales, have you considered processing those through a *PayPal MicroPayment account*?  5% plus $0.05 per transaction instead of 2.9% plus $0.30

I haven't a clue about the details other than it is one exception to PayPal where they will allow a second account associated with a SSN/EIN


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## ugrad (Feb 10, 2013)

If it is necessary to issue a refund for overpaid postage and both parties take a hit on currency conversion, wouldn't it be better to issue a Credit Note, that can be redeemed with the next order, of course that may not be acceptable to a one off buyer.

Regards
Peter


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## Smitty37 (Feb 10, 2013)

ugrad said:


> If it is necessary to issue a refund for overpaid postage and both parties take a hit on currency conversion, wouldn't it be better to issue a Credit Note, that can be redeemed with the next order, of course that may not be acceptable to a one off buyer.
> 
> Regards
> Peter


I would be perfectly willing to do that if the buyer was happy with it.  I would make that optional though so the buyer would know I was not trying to force them back to my store if they didn't want to come.


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## ed4copies (Feb 10, 2013)

One quick note on the "consensus choice":  Hold the order and present options to the potential buyer.

This is very labor intensive.  First, you need to "pick" the order---small companies don't have software that will weigh AND figure the geometry of every item in stock, so the only way to know what box is required is to "pick" the order.  Then, box and weigh it, just as if it were going to ship.   

If it does NOT fit in the "small flat rate", then the vendor needs to put it in a box and weigh.  Again, finding all the alternative shipping methods and the related cost.

I have done this for customers, only to find out that they then decide not to order.

Again, all the products need to be restocked, in correct bins.

So, I have "killed an hour" for absolutely no benefit to ANYONE.  And all my other customers' orders have been delayed for no real reason.

I am always happy to try to help customers.  In order to do that most effectively, I try to avoid chasing "wild gooses"!!
YMMV!!
Ed


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## OKLAHOMAN (Feb 10, 2013)

ed4copies said:


> One quick note on the "consensus choice": Hold the order and present options to the potential buyer.
> 
> This is very labor intensive. First, you need to "pick" the order---small companies don't have software that will weigh AND figure the geometry of every item in stock, so the only way to know what box is required is to "pick" the order. Then, box and weigh it, just as if it were going to ship.
> 
> ...


 
Totally agree!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, much rather give a refund or absorb the small difference, as we all are still giving the customer great products at good prices that they can't get anywhere else.


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## ugrad (Feb 10, 2013)

Smitty37 said:


> ugrad said:
> 
> 
> > If it is necessary to issue a refund for overpaid postage and both parties take a hit on currency conversion, wouldn't it be better to issue a Credit Note, that can be redeemed with the next order, of course that may not be acceptable to a one off buyer.
> ...



The Credit Note system would probably be welcome by your repeat foreign customers, but not by a one off. It would help you and help your customers who want it. Win/Win.


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## Smitty37 (Feb 10, 2013)

ugrad said:


> Smitty37 said:
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> > ugrad said:
> ...


Agreed, that's why I would make it an option, I would ask the customer "do you want a refund or a store credit good for your next visit?"


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## Smitty37 (Feb 12, 2013)

It looks like the overwhelming preference is one that most of us probably can't implement in our shopping carts.  I am going to be checking with my provider and see if there is a way to intercept orders before they actually get into the payment process, make manual changes then send them on their way.  It sounds easy but might actually be difficult (which is probably why it isn't there already).


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## Sylvanite (Feb 12, 2013)

None of the poll options apply to me.  I hate doing extra work to invoice customers manually, or to refund excess charges.  As a customer, I also dislike extra waits or not knowing the actual total price of my purchase.

I'm fortunate, however, that my products have a pretty consistent density, so I know based on their weight when I need to switch from First Class Mail to Flat Rate Envelope to Medium Flat-Rate Box.  I use ZenCart Zone-Based Shipping which enables me to charge the desired rates for US and international shipping.  Customers pay the shipping charge shown in the cart.  

When USPS raised the rates, it made international shipping much more expensive, so I expect to do even less business outside the USA.

Regards,
Eric


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