# Polishing CA, but it's not a deep shine



## ossaguy (May 22, 2010)

Hi everyone,

I'm trying to get that deep shine in my pens,and am having some problems I hope someone here can help me with.

After putting about a dozen coats of medium CA, I work my way up through the MM grits to 12000.It's now smooth,but not shiny.So I got some Novus scratch remover,with a soft cotton rag and have experimented doing it with the lathe off,on and slow,and then medium,then fast speeds.Ends up not a deep shine most of the time.

Today I tried a bottle of Plastix after reading about it here.Same results.Tried all of the above different ways.The wood is BOW.

Before I was letting it sit a day to harden,and have tried wet sanding with MM and dry sanding,besides the polishing,but no "Ah Huh!" moment of discovery of how to get a deep shine......every time.

Have tried BLO/CA, CA/BLO, & straight CA.

A few pens I lucked out on and they have that deep lustre.

Is the polish called " One Step" a better product? 

Is the felt buffing wheel kit they sell that was designed by Barry Gross a good setup? 



Thanks for any feedback!

Steve
San Diego


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## thewishman (May 22, 2010)

When I first started, I sanded through the finish with the first few grits of MM. That 1500 will cut right through pretty quickly.


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## toddlajoie (May 22, 2010)

That was my thought reading his post, are you sure there is CA left? Is the finish sometimes "spotty" as in places that are dull and spots that are shiny? That's a sure indication that you have sanded down to the wood fibers in some areas. If you're really hitting the first few MM grits hard and long, as said, it doesn't take long to take it all off. I go very quickly and lightly with the first grit, and stop and dry the blank (I always us MM wet), watching for when the majority of the small pits are gone. Then quickly through each of the other grits, then finish with Plastic Polish.


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## ossaguy (May 22, 2010)

Hi Chris,

     Do you have a good technique on using the MM ? I've had that happen too,where I went past the CA.That's why I tried waiting a day before sandng. 

    Do you use the whole square face,or just the corners? Is there a rule for how long you do each grit? 

     Would starting out like at 3600 grit gthen go from there help?

     I forgot to ask for lathe RPM settings that work the best for finshing.Today I tried slower speeds,didn't really help.Before I was in the fastest range.

    Thanks for replying,I appreciate it.

     Steve


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## witz1976 (May 22, 2010)

Hey Steve, have you tried William Young's method?  Works really well and no need to use MM afterwards, just some plastix (I use this atleast)  Here is his video if you missed it.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=orcgOf4siqc

(I use the whole MM pad when I use MM FYI, just use very light touches and only for about 5 - 10 seconds)
Good Luck!


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## ossaguy (May 22, 2010)

Yeah,I can tell now that I'm sanding with the MM too long. I've been applying the BLO/CA
like on his video,but after reading posts here about getting cloudiness in the finish,this last one I tried doing the 1st coat in CA only.( I did have one pen that got a little cloudy)

      Next time I'll try to copy his video exactly,with doing 6 coats,and just a small amount of Plastix and see what results I get.

      I have not tried curling the paper towel around like he does,for fear of getting it wrapped up,or stuck in the finish.I'll give that a shot,also.

     Thanks eveyone!

     Steve
     San Diego


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## Mark (May 22, 2010)

Hopefully that is your problem. Maybe the MM technique will solve your issues.

I was going to suggest the humidity in your shop. I had a problem with humidity about a month ago. All my CA was drying cloudy. I could polish to my hearts desire and still not have a deep shine. Polished, but not a deep shine. Anyway, once I got the humidity down, my issues with the CA finish disappeared. Just my $.02 worth.


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## ossaguy (May 23, 2010)

Hi Mark,

     I never thought about the humidity.I do it outside,and I remember looking at at concrete several times to watch for raindrops,since it's been so overcast and damp the last two sessions I was out there. 

    Here in San Diego,we get "May-Grey",and "June-Gloom" this time of the year.Makes for nice working weather for those of us that burn easily,since the marine layer stays socked in.So next time if it's like that,I'll just set the blanks aside to finish them during a clear day,and just do the turning and sanding on the other blanks that are ready to turn.

  Thanks,
      Steve


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## thewishman (May 23, 2010)

ossaguy said:


> Do you use the whole square face,or just the corners? Is there a rule for how long you do each grit?
> 
> Would starting out like at 3600 grit then go from there help?
> 
> I forgot to ask for lathe RPM settings that work the best for finshing.Today I tried slower speeds,didn't really help.Before I was in the fastest range.



I sand at 1800rpm, for the 1500 and 1800 just 2 or 3 seconds is enough after that no more than 3 or 4 seconds for each of the rest (sometimes I use the 12,000 a bit longer). I used to use a corner, now I use strips about 1/2 inch wide. I almost always use the mm wet.


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## DurocShark (May 23, 2010)

Use the slowest speed on your lathe.
Never use the same part of your pad (aka: paper towel) twice.
Use lots of water in your MM.
Don't be afraid to start over. You want perfection, not your five minutes back.


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## alawoodman (Jun 13, 2010)

I've seen several good answers, which is not to say that any of them is the correct one, because it's impossible to diagnose this. Which is another way of saying my .02 is probably misdirected as well, but I'm throwing it out anyway. 

I went through every video and every piece of advice in sight (which is a bunch!) before I started getting that deep shine, and in my case, the big issue always came down to not getting a thick enough coating of CA or sanding through too much of it (which ended up being the same thing). 

My solution was to (1) lose the BLO. It just took too much of the glue with it, and I was working forever to get the thinnest of coats, and (2) Apply several coats of CA without sanding in between, but allowing five minutes or so for it to dry between coats. (10 for thicker glue). Once it starts "ridging," I've got enough. Then I sand it down at 600 or the first MM pad just until it's smooth and the ridges are gone. From there, I can skip over to 4000 MM and work up to the maximum, which invariably gives me that deep shine we all crave, often producing a 3D kind of effect. Nine times out of 10 that gets it where I want it. That other time, I just put another couple of coats on top of what's already there and repeat the process.


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## mdburn_em (Jun 21, 2010)

I'm late jumping in here, but how thick is your finish?
You put 12 coats on, what was the diameter before you startedand what was the diameter after the 12 were put on?  Answering that question will tell you if you're sanding through the coats.  Of course you do have to have a digital caliper to figure that out.


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## ossaguy (Jun 22, 2010)

The digital caliper is next on my tool list.( I want to learn TBC,also )

So I followed William Young's video as exact as I could,trying just the Plast-X but it still ended up pretty dull looking.Looked better before the Plastix,actually.


The next one I used the MM wet,and tried the 2-3 seconds only,with real light pressure,and it turned out better,but needed 1 last light final "wet coat",then left it til the next day,and it looked pretty shiny,but still not that deep lustre look.

So now I'll try putting it on thicker,with 5 mintes dry-time in between .....but I wonder if I have the patience to wait! Then I'll do just the 1500 lightly,then go to the 4000+ next and see if I can do that right.

I'm just bummed that the Plastix hasn't worked for me.At least I can use it on my headlights..........

Thanks everyone for the help! I hope I can get the technique down.

Steve


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## soligen (Jun 26, 2010)

I have had sand through problems too. then I noticed that the pens where I accidentally over sand before finish were better becasue I had to put on lots of CA to build the diameter back up. Right now I Try sanding down to .003 or 4 past my target diamerter before finishing. I re-check the diamerter as I apply finish and polish. This way I know I have CA left if I hit my target diamerter. I try to hit my target diameter within .001. I'm still not very experienced, so I check the diamerter (on the edges) a lot. My caliper is my best friend - and digital is not really necessary. I got mine for about $15 at a discount tool place. As an added bonus, you get a great transition from hardware to wood when you turn to this spec.

I lost patience with Med CA dry time too. Now I use the thin without BLO. If I want a satin finish, then the Med with BLO and no MM afterwards.


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## IPD_Mrs (Jun 26, 2010)

I've read all the answers you received to your question and all of them can be the issue at any given time.  Here are a few thoughts I had.  1. BOW is an oily wood and if you are getting cloudy spots that aren't explained by accidentally sanding through the finish (and the humidity is down - that is my number one culprit generally) remember that finishes will lift off of an oily wood if put on right after turning without doing a bit of extra "prep" before hand.
2. SPRING for the digital caliper.  We purchased some quite a while back for around $20 so I am pretty sure you can get them these days pretty cheap.  I would not dream of doing a pen or finish without one since this will allow you to build your finish to the exact fit of your pen fittings.
(remember I am the anal retentive 1/2 who looks at all of my finishes through a 30x jewelers eye before I assemble my finished product.)
3.  We have been using CA/Novus/Renwax combination for at least 1.5 yrs if not longer now and have no problems with the results at all - other than the human error you have been discussing thus far.  Humidity doesn't count as none of us really control that unless you have that type of equipment in your shop.
4.  We cut all of the MM sheets we buy into 1/4s and we rarely sand wet.  I wipe each piece off on a clean cloth (usually my old shop tshirt I'm wearing) before moving on to the next piece as this extends the life and cuts back on little flecks of wood being left to scratch the next round.  Since I get 4 at the price of one I don't mind tossing them when they look shoddy.  

Not sure if this helps or not .. maybe just rambling on and saying more of the same... but I hope it gives you at least another little piece to fit into your knowledge banks.

_Mrs.  _


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## NewLondon88 (Jun 26, 2010)

Two thoughts:

1. OLIVE OIL!  The oil in the wood may be causing problems with the CA.

2. How fresh is your CA? Old CA may not cure properly (or at all when it mixes
with oils)


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## RussFairfield (Jun 27, 2010)

Here is a link to an article and videos on how I do a CA finish. All I can say is that, it works for me. Others may disagree.

http://www.woodturner-russ.com/PenPages-FinishingPens-CAglue.html


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## Papa mark (Jun 27, 2010)

My suggestion would be to talk to Curtis, Mesquite Man about the way that he uses accelarator and CA together to produce a absoulty beatiful finish in less than 5 minutes. I have seen him do this live and in my oponion he is the master. I am realitive new to turning and this is the way that I have started doing it and for me it works everytime.


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