# Epoxy?



## ilikewood (Feb 8, 2005)

I have been playing a bit with some epoxy finishes lately on some bigger projects.  It really seals the wood well.

Has anyone tried it on pens yet?  Just curious here as I might give it a try on some different pens to see if I can get it right.  I would like a bit of some advice before ruining a bunch of blanks.


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## Tom McMillan (Feb 8, 2005)

Haven't tried it on pens yet myself---look forward to hearing how it works out for you Bill.  What kind of epoxy have you been using???  Wonder what would work best on pens---I know at one time there was some discussion about the possibility of using the type used in rod building.  I helped a rod builder for a short time---he used a small alcohol burner to remove bubbles when covering the windings with epoxy---but, not sure if that would work with wood??


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## ilikewood (Feb 8, 2005)

Would you believe I used a 5 minute epoxy on that pepper grinder?  I heated up the wood by buffing it with a rag (makes the epoxy more fluid), then wiped on the epoxy with a small rag.  I then turned on the lathe and buffed the epoxy down.  It really sealed the wood well and was easier than I thought.  I wouldn't recommend it for a final coat like this, but it sure made the best undercoat I have ever used.


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## Tom McMillan (Feb 8, 2005)

Wow, sounds interesting for sure---5 minute epoxy---wow.  No trouble with any bubbles then??  I wonder if there were bubbles to get out---if a heat gun would work??


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## ilikewood (Feb 8, 2005)

By using a rag to buff most of it off, it really wasn't thick enough to form bubbles.  The epoxy when it is that thin (from being warm) actually soaked into the wood quite a bit before hardening.  I buffed it mostly off before it was even close to being cured.  If you let it set just a bit too much, it becomes too sticky and your rag will stick to it.


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## Mudder (Feb 8, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Tom McMillan_
> <br />Wow, sounds interesting for sure---5 minute epoxy---wow.  No trouble with any bubbles then??  I wonder if there were bubbles to get out---if a heat gun would work??



I think it has more to do with CO2 than heat. I used to use the self leveling epoxy for casting specialty curcuit boards and used a propane torch passed over the top after about 5 minutes. I think that if you exhale, like you are cleaning your glasses you do the same thing but don't quote me on that as it has been too many years.


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## jwoodwright (Feb 8, 2005)

Something to try, make a great article...[8D]


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## RussFairfield (Feb 8, 2005)

You are getting into some uncharted territory. The problem with clear epoxy coats is that they get yellow and brittle with age, and the faster they cure the more yellow and brittle they will become. Being a petroleum product, epoxies have an affinity for oil, and the contact with our body oils from our fingers will speed the color change.

I see a bigger problem in that the Epoxy finish will be no better than what you would get from a waterborne lacquer. There has already been some information written here on using the product called "Enduro". They can be of similar hardness, and the Enduro is a lot easier to use than an epoxy; and doesn't have the same yellowing problem or the same affinity for absorbing oils. 

Personally, I think that a stabilized wood is a better choice than using an epoxy coating on the wood. You are doing the same thing, only with a different plastic.

If you wish to try an epoxy coating, you won't find one on the store shelf that will not have the problems of yellowing with age and contact with body oils. There are clear epoxies where these are less of a problem. I am familiar with some of the System-3 products.  You should give them a call, and ask for their recommendation. However, they take a long time to cure, and you will have to find some way to slowly spin the pen barrels while the finish is curing. Otherwise the low viscosity epoxy will all run to one side. A gentle amount of heat will solve the bubbling problems and speed up the cure, but heat will also lower the viscosity of the epoxy, and the spinning becomes even more important. The heated air makes the bubbles expand and rise more quickly to the surface of the lower viscosity of the liquid where the lower surface tension allows them to break through the surface and pop.

There is a woodturner in Texas named Steve Russell who has done some experimenting with epoxy coatings on pens. Look him up on the Internet to find an e-mail address. If you aren't in a hurry, or you can ask me and I will send it to you the next time I run across it.


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## ilikewood (Feb 8, 2005)

Thanks Russ, that does help me bunches.  Luckily I have just been using it as a wood sealer or undercoat so far.  I have lacquered over everything for my final finish, so the epoxy should be protected very well from finger oils.  I have seen the product you are talking about and that is one of the things that triggered my curiosity.  Also, CSUSA also had something as well, but I didn't research that one yet.

I will keep an eye out for anything Steve Russell puts out.  His name rings a bell with me, so I think I have seen some of his things somewhere.


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## Lornek8 (Feb 11, 2005)

Be careful with the 5 min epoxy.  As Russ said, it turns yellow fast!  I think it has a lot to do with UV as well as contact.  I've used epoxy to make fishing flies that have turned yellow in a matter of months despite being unused.  They were in a clear box and exposed to in direct sunlight for app. 8 hours and eventually turned yellow in a few months.


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## ilikewood (Feb 12, 2005)

There is literally no thickness to the epoxy.  Almost all was virtually adsorbed into the wood.  I'm not sure how that will yellow as it doesn't add any color because it soaked in (like CA).


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## sptfr43 (Feb 12, 2005)

I have also used the 5 min epoxy for a finish and as you mentioned it soaks in pretty well. I was able to get a nice semi gloss shine by buffing after it was cured for a couple hours.Doesn't seem to be thick enough to show much yellow even if it does change. However it's only been a week so far so I don't know yet. Sorry but I haven't mastered the picture posting yet.


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## RussFairfield (Feb 13, 2005)

I am having a problem with why anyone would want to use a finish that is no better than CA glue and takes several hours to overnight to cure, while CA glue cures in less than 3-minutes.


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## wayneis (Feb 13, 2005)

Russ maybe if you gave one a try you would understand.  A three coat Enduro finish has a lot more depth than ten coats of ca.  Also ca makes a lot of people ill, I kinda got tired of pukin every time that I finished a pen with ca, it gets a little old real quick.  Speed is not everything.

Wayne


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## wayneis (Feb 13, 2005)

Bill, (ilikewood) if you go to the Que Component site you will find that they finish all of their pool que's with epoxy and also have a clear epoxy finish that they sell.  I bought some but I've had so much success with the Enduro that I have not got around to trying it yet, one of these days.

Wayne


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## RussFairfield (Feb 13, 2005)

Ah, but I do understand. My comments were relative to the topic of this discussion, EPOXY; and not Enduro or other water borne finishes, which were not the topic of discussion.

The Enduro IS a good finish.


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## ilikewood (Feb 14, 2005)

I think the whole thing of "size matters" is in place here.  I honestly wouldn't try to CA a whole pool cue here.  I do turn larger things as I don't make pens my whole fun.  If I had perfected a good epoxy finish on larger items (which is more flexible than CA), I would try just use the same finish on pens.


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