# Enduro-- First impressions



## Dan_F (Feb 29, 2008)

I got my 2 oz. sample of Enduro from Beartooth the other day, and finished my first pen with it last night. It is very simple to use following the directions provided---3 coats sanding sealer, sand, and 3 coats of topcoat, sand, and buff. It dries within a couple of minutes with the blank spinning, and you can apply the coats as soon as the last one is dry, but you need to allow at least 6 hours or so of curing time before sanding. I am very pleased with the result. It's virtually odorless, and no worries about spontaneous combustion. 








Dan


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## R2 (Feb 29, 2008)

The finsh has done your pen real justice![^]


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## LostintheWoods (Feb 29, 2008)

Great finish! But.....what is the wood used? That's gorgeous! Nice job!


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## toolcrazy (Feb 29, 2008)

I love Enduro, I won't use anything else. 

Beautiful Pen BTW. Looks to be dyed box elder, to me.


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## Tea Clipper (Feb 29, 2008)

I allow the top coat to cure for at least a week before final sanding/polishing. YMMV.

The wood looks like buckeye burl to me.  Nice pen, btw.


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## Proud_Poppa_of_2 (Feb 29, 2008)

That's a great looking piece of work, Dan.  And, thanks for your impression of Enduro.  Please clarify for me on the curing/sanding.  Do you need to let the sanding sealer cure, as well, before sanding, or is it just the poly top coat that cures before the final sanding?  Also, what grits did you use for your final sanding?  My guess would be MM 3600 on up.


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## Tea Clipper (Feb 29, 2008)

Wayne's Enduro instructions are an excellent starting point.  My variation is to allow the top coat to cure for a week before I micromesh followed by Hut's plastic polish.


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## Ligget (Mar 1, 2008)

I like Enduro too, I think the longer you leave the top coat to cure = better shine.[8D]

It works that way for me anyhow!


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## Dan_F (Mar 1, 2008)

Thanks all! The wood is indeed buckeye burl. The directions linked to above by Tea Clipper are the same as supplied by Beartooth Woods. I followed them pretty much, but tried a shortcut which didn't work out. Followed the sealer directions as written, waited overnight, then topcoated, and again waited overnight. Thinking I might be able to save some time, and based on good results with acrylic blanks, I went straight to the 3 step Beall buff system. That didn't work so well. Gave a great shine, but if you looked closely, there were imperfections in the finish. So I went back to 3600 MM through 12,000 to get rid of the lines, and did a final buff with white diamond, then Trade Secret for Wood. That evened everything out nicely. 

Next time I'll have to marshal the discipline to wait for a week and see how that goes. Jeez, can't you just stick "em in a microwave for a few minutes and accomplish the same thing? 

Dan


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## wdcav1952 (Mar 1, 2008)

Nice work Dan!!

I would like to point out that the directions Ernie supplies are the result of experimentation with the material by one of our members, Wayne Swindlehurst.  Wayne took a material that was not designed at all for the use we put it to and developed a technique that turns out great results.  I found that the curing time for the gloss poly was one of the most important parts of the technique.


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## Dan_F (Mar 1, 2008)

Cav---How long do you let it cure before final sanding/buffing?

Dan


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## Sfolivier (Mar 1, 2008)

"Next time I'll have to marshal the discipline to wait for a week and see how that goes. Jeez, can't you just stick "em in a microwave for a few minutes and accomplish the same thing?"

Maybe... Why don't you try? [}]


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## wdcav1952 (Mar 1, 2008)

> _Originally posted by Dan_F_
> 
> Cav---How long do you let it cure before final sanding/buffing?
> 
> Dan



Dan, I would wait a couple of days prior to sanding, and then 5-6 days before assembling the pen.

As a side note, I have switched to Unaxol as it gives me the same results as Enduro and sets faster.


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## jttheclockman (Mar 1, 2008)

Cav

Unaxol, what is it and where do you get it?? What makes Enduro better than any other water based poly??? That is a long curing time for a pen that you are not putting a heavy coat on.


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## Sfolivier (Mar 2, 2008)

When I use Enduro, I usually put more than 3 coats of sealer and gloss finish. I usually build the undercoat to a point where the pen is already almost glassy. After sanding to MM12000, I add 3-7 coats of the gloss finish. I wait at least 5 minutes between any coats. I found that I can sand the undercoat and the topcoat after a couple of hours of curing. Although you can shine the topcoat, I would advise to wait overnight to assemble it. It is cured enough to polish, but not hard enough to go through rough handling during assembly. Nothing prevents you from buffing just before assembly, or    quickly sand with MM8000-12000 just before putting the pen together.

I think that Enduro has been the victim of a curing creep  Someone started with 6 hours, then it became overnight, then 2 days, then 3 days... I guess everyone always want to do it a little bit "better" than the last person who did it... You really don't need to wait that long.

PS: I have been unable to use TSW with the finish, even after weeks of curing. Renaissance wax is fine after overnight curing but I don't think it's necessary at all.


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## Dan_F (Mar 2, 2008)

> _Originally posted by Sfolivier_
> 
> 
> 
> PS: I have been unable to use TSW with the finish, even after weeks of curing. Renaissance wax is fine after overnight curing but I don't think it's necessary at all.



What happens if you use TSW with Enduro? I didn't notice anything bad happen to mine. 

Dan


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## wdcav1952 (Mar 2, 2008)

> _Originally posted by Dan_F_
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Dan, apparently he was a victim of "wax creep"   I have absollutely no problem with TSW and Enduro or Unaxol.

As for a source for Unaxol, remember the search function Jeff has provided here at the site:

http://www.penturners.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=33781&SearchTerms=Unaxol


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## jttheclockman (Mar 2, 2008)

Cav

Thanks for the heads up on the search thing. Spent quite a bit of time reading past posts about Unaxol. Question for you or others that use this product, what is the method you use to apply???  It has been some time now since this product has been discussed. Has it held up as well as touted???  Does everyone use the gloss or do they use the one designed for high traffic such as for floors. I think it uses another ingrediant a part B. I will be placing an order for a sample package.


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## wdcav1952 (Mar 2, 2008)

John, I use the clear gloss referenced in my post on the thread I linked to.  Below is the clip I wrote on the method I use.  It is based on Wayneis' Enduro instructions.



I bought the following: M038-D Clear Sealer and M023-D Clear Gloss. They also include a bottle of reducer, which I put up and am not even sure where it is.

After I get my wood blank as smooth and finished as possible, often using thin CA to fill any porosities in the blank, I apply a thin coat of sealer with cut up T shirt material with the lathe turning pretty slowly. (You will get a feel for what speed works best to give a smooth coat. Also, I buy the best quality of T shirt material Lowes sells as it helps me get a smoother coat.) About every 5 minutes I apply another coat for 5 or 6 coats. If it is warm enough, you can sand the sealer down in less than a hour, as long as it sands to dust. I run through all 9 grits of micro mesh until I get a smooth and shiny coat.

Then, I do the same thing with the gloss, usually applying 6-8 coats. The more smoothly you can put down each coat, the better. I leave this overnight (I love having two lathes!) and then go through the micro mesh grits again. Then it gets a light buff with TSW. I prefer to let the gloss harden a couple of days prior to assembling the pen.

That is about it, and it is worth every cent it cost you.


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## Sfolivier (Mar 2, 2008)

Oh, it always dulls it. I recently had a pen that after a few months of use, was starting to get small scratches / wear and tear on its finish. Since it was Enduro and was that "cured", I decided to just buff some TSW on it. The pen lost most of its finish to the TSW wheel [:0] I know this is not supposed to happen, but well... It happened to me the 3 times I applied TSW on top of Enduro (???).


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## jttheclockman (Mar 2, 2008)

Another one of those abreviations. What is TSW??? I need a list. 

Thanks Cav.


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## wdcav1952 (Mar 2, 2008)

> _Originally posted by jttheclockman_
> 
> Another one of those abreviations. What is TSW??? I need a list.
> 
> Thanks Cav.



John, it stands for Trade Secret for Wood.  I think you can still get it from ArizonaSilhouette.

Oliver, your comment that TSW always dulls the finish is simply wrong.  I agree that if you use a buffing wheel as you described that you will damage the finish.  Neither TSW nor Ren Wax should be used as a buffing compound.  They are a WAX topcoat.  They should be rubbed on a finished pen and then lightly buffed off.  I use a piece of sweatshirt fleece material and lightly rub the turning blank with it.  No one would use a car wax to buff out surface scratches.  You would use buffing compound, and then wax to protect the finish, not to improve the finish.


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## Proud_Poppa_of_2 (Mar 2, 2008)

> _Originally posted by jttheclockman_
> 
> What is TSW???



Trade Secret for Wood


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## Sfolivier (Mar 2, 2008)

"Oliver, your comment that TSW always dulls the finish is simply wrong."

Well... If it did dull it for me, it did. There's nothing wrong or right about something that just *happened*. I realize that it's obviously something I'm doing. Maybe the buffing speed, maybe a poor topcoat (I always had to remember not to sand my Enduro through the glossy part[)]), maybe an odd bottle. After making a couple of very nice satin finishes on pens  I'm just careful now.

As for buffing, I though you HAD to buff TSW to get a high gloss finish (as it is part of the instructions that come with it). It's a pretty thick/filling compound and I read a few times about people using it to "repair" tiny scratches as it builds better than most waxes.

Anyway, I'm glad you're having such a great experience with the Enduro / TSW combo. I just don't want people to dive in thinking that it works 100% of the time for everyone. That's just "wrong"


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