# Talk about LOW!! Virulent Rant



## bitshird (Apr 11, 2011)

It seems that I have fallen prey to a company similar to Oklahoman (Roy) and had my good name stolen and besmirched Now Crafts USA is selling a Pen Pro tool, BUT it's not mine. How can this be you may ask, well it seems there is this guy who incorrectly thought he owned the interchangeable carbide insert wood turning world. 
But a letter a year ago to his Attorney proved him wrong. I should have expected some underhanded slimeball trick from the guy, cause that's the way he operates.  A friend in Baja told me a few days ago that easy wood tools was making a Pen Pro but I looked on their site and it wasn't there. Sure enough on the front page of CSUSA there is a nice You tube presentation of a easy wood tools with it's original designation Ci2m, but the chumps are calling it a Pen Pro after I've built a rather nice reputation on that name, AND they have it TM'd   Stupid  Stupid  Stupid  Stupid . How stupid can an old man be. 
Well I guess it's time to call the Lawyers like I need the money, and if I remember just filing the Patent doesn't have much bearing on the Trade Mark even if I did file the paper work for the patents as Pen Pro and Bowl Pro. I\at least I know one thing, He's noticed me. I can't become as large as he is nor do I want to, that's for wonderkind Animefan also called Andrew (on a good day, several other names for the other days). but I have a real choice one for the guy I'm upset with. It regards him in the traditional 1800's 1900's family planning in eastern Kentucky, it almost worked with their Thoroughbred Horses, if they weren't bred to closely, I think his stable missed the mark. Please do not interpret this as a slam on Kentucky, those polices were outlawed about a week after his conception.
If this gets deleted or I get censured I will understand, I have never openly criticized any one to this degree on this forum, but I can't wait to meet him at the next show, there may be an old west shootout in Waco, only with turning tools at 20 paces.
OK I feel a little better here is the link to CSUSA from whom I will purchase nothing ever again  I know my 300 to 400 a month won't hurt, but it can't help either.  http://www.woodturnerscatalog.com/
Stepping off soap box


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## thetalbott4 (Apr 11, 2011)

I looked at CSUSA just yesterday and noticed the ad. My thought was that bitshird is doing ok for himself....that sucks it wasnt you. On the one hand you think maybe its more trouble than its worth to go after him, on the other hand you get tired of getting kicked in the nads and doing nothing about it. Good luck with your choice.


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## Simplex (Apr 11, 2011)

Ken -

I think I can say with pretty good confidence that your product has a loyal following here at IPA.  I purchased you Pen Pro last Christmas and have not opened my box of traditional turning tools since.  Besides, your prices are better, too.  Hopefully, this all works out.  Best of luck.


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## bitshird (Apr 11, 2011)

Scott, we went around with his Attorneys about 15 months ago, but it turns out his Attorneys weren't well informed, in fact they actually helped me make my case.
I don't think it's EZ wood tools I have a feeling it's CSUSA, they've been pulling things off this site a while. I imagine they have better attorneys than I do so tomorrow we are filing a new trademark with the full name Woodchuck Pen Pro, and go after them for selling an imposter tool, not a Genuine Woodchuck Pen Pro but well see.


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## Smitty37 (Apr 11, 2011)

*Hmmmm*



bitshird said:


> It seems that I have fallen prey to a company similar to Oklahoman (Roy) and had my good name stolen and besmirched Now Crafts USA is selling a Pen Pro tool, BUT it's not mine. How can this be you may ask, well it seems there is this guy who incorrectly thought he owned the interchangeable carbide insert wood turning world.
> But a letter a year ago to his Attorney proved him wrong. I should have expected some underhanded slimeball trick from the guy, cause that's the way he operates. A friend in Baja told me a few days ago that easy wood tools was making a Pen Pro but I looked on their site and it wasn't there. Sure enough on the front page of CSUSA there is a nice You tube presentation of a easy wood tools with it's original designation Ci2m, but the chumps are calling it a Pen Pro after I've built a rather nice reputation on that name, AND they have it TM'd Stupid Stupid Stupid Stupid . How stupid can an old man be.
> Well I guess it's time to call the Lawyers like I need the money, and if I remember just filing the Patent doesn't have much bearing on the Trade Mark even if I did file the paper work for the patents as Pen Pro and Bowl Pro. I\at least I know one thing, He's noticed me. I can't become as large as he is nor do I want to, that's for wonderkind Animefan also called Andrew (on a good day, several other names for the other days). but I have a real choice one for the guy I'm upset with. It regards him in the traditional 1800's 1900's family planning in eastern Kentucky, it almost worked with their Thoroughbred Horses, if they weren't bred to closely, I think his stable missed the mark. Please do not interpret this as a slam on Kentucky, those polices were outlawed about a week after his conception.
> If this gets deleted or I get censured I will understand, I have never openly criticized any one to this degree on this forum, but I can't wait to meet him at the next show, there may be an old west shootout in Waco, only with turning tools at 20 paces.
> ...


 
I wonder if they can trademark a name already in use for the same thing by someone else?  It almost seems that wouldn't be allowed....


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## babyblues (Apr 12, 2011)

I just opened an advertisement from CSUSA that came in the mail today and saw their Pen Pro. I thought it sounded a little fishy as they claim it's made exclusively for CSUSA when I remembered seeing it on here. That's too bad. Personally, I won't be boycotting CSUSA, but I only buy from them what I can't find anywhere else (I do like Jr Gents). If they sell something I can get from someone on IAP I get it here. If I ever decide to try a tool like that I'll definitely get one from you.

Is there some way you can contest the trademark? It would be easy to prove that you were already DBA "Pen Pro". It might be that a name can't be trademarked if it's already in use, even if that name hasn't already been trademarked by someone else. It's worth checking out.


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## jttheclockman (Apr 12, 2011)

Now I am shooting in the dark here but I am guessing you are going after the name more so than the tool. The reason I say that is because that tool has been around for awhile but with a longer handle. Many of the turners over at AAW have been using similar tools for quite some time. I belong to another site and have to say about 5 years ago a fellow sent me the carbide cutters that he was using in a tool very similar to that. He made calls for a living. 

Keep us informed as to the outcome but I think you may need deep pockets.

http://www.easywoodtools.com/


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## MesquiteMan (Apr 12, 2011)

Ken,

All is not lost.  From the USPTO:



> *What are “common law” rights?*
> 
> Federal registration is not required to establish rights in a  trademark.  Common law rights arise from actual use  of a mark and may  allow the common law user to successfully challenge a  registration or  application.


 http://www.uspto.gov/faq/trademarks.jsp#_Toc275426712



> The owner of a registered trademark may commence legal proceedings for trademark infringement  to prevent unauthorized use of that trademark. However, registration is  not required. The owner of a common law trademark may also file suit,  but an unregistered mark may be protectable only within the geographical  area within which it has been used or in geographical areas into which  it may be reasonably expected to expand.


 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trademark



> *What are common law trademark rights?     *
> 
> Federal registration is not required to establish trademark rights.  Common law rights arise from the actual use of a mark. Generally,  whoever first uses a mark in commerce or files an "intent to use"  application with the Patent and Trademark Office has the ultimate right  to use and registration. However, there are many benefits of federal  trademark registration.


 http://www.legalzoom.com/trademarks-faq/common-law-trademark-rights.html



> *Common Law Trademarks*: At common law, a trademark is obtained          by adopting and using the trademark in association with goods or services.          The mark must be placed in actual use before protection is available. Once          the mark becomes associated in the mind of the public with the particular          good or service, the common law trademark is established. Ordinarily, the          geographic scope of the common law trademark is limited to the area of use.


 http://www.expertlaw.com/library/intellectual_property/trademark_law.html


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## MesquiteMan (Apr 12, 2011)

Oh yeah, their ™ is not registered or they are just stupid and not using the ®.  They are claiming a Common Law trade mark and you can prove that you have senior rights since you have been using it longer.  Get your IP lawyer involved and I bet the name gets changed.


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## MesquiteMan (Apr 12, 2011)

One other thing...I just did a trademark search for the term Pen Pro and there is no registered trade mark for that name.


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## workinforwood (Apr 12, 2011)

Sorry Ken, I feel your pain and support you. I advise you stop talking now and see if you can have a mod go back delete certain comments you made as to how you would fight this. This is open forum they can read too. You don't go to war and broadcast your strategy.


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## Dave_M (Apr 12, 2011)

I saw that a few days ago and thought to myself "Here we go again.  Must they steal everything that comes from this site."  I sent CSUSA an email immediately letting them know I was fed up with these tactics and I had spent my last dime at CSUSA.  I'm sure they could care less about where I shop, but it matters to me.


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## jd99 (Apr 12, 2011)

I had to do this battle a while back it's no fun, but it's great to stop them in their track. I also looked at the trade mark DB, there are a few records that are assoicated with Pen Pro but they are all dead most just cancled, and none of them deal with tools or anything like that.

I would submit the trade mark ASAP.

Good Luck.
Danny


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## witz1976 (Apr 12, 2011)

Totally not cool.  Ken sorry for your woes and I wish you the best of luck in the legal battle I am sure you are now engaging in.  

I know CSUSA has reps on this site, so I hope they realize that this is bad business for them.


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## OKLAHOMAN (Apr 12, 2011)

Ken, in my case it was MY stuptity, in yours its CSUSA's it seems. Put up a good fight to protect your well deserved name. As a side the person who "USED" my name has never done a single thing other than drop from his website selling "SECONDS" but just a few weeks ago contacted me after he was contacted about a certain imited Edition pen I made by a customer and at that time told me he was getting ready to work on his site  and explained that life has gotten in the way of him making any additions to it. I am in the process right now of makinf a copy of that limited edition pen.


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## Dalecamino (Apr 12, 2011)

workinforwood said:


> Sorry Ken, I feel your pain and support you. I advise you stop talking now and see if you can have a mod go back delete certain comments you made as to how you would fight this. This is open forum they can read too. You don't go to war and broadcast your strategy.


 Exactly what I thought when I read the OP. Hope this works out for you Ken.


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## PenMan1 (Apr 12, 2011)

Ken:
I almost sent you a note of congratulations after seeing the Pen Pro on the CUSA home page. Then, I noticed that the tool didn't look right and after reading more it occurred to me that someone had "borrowed" your good name.

I'm really sorry about this! In your shoes, I'd probably spend all of Andrew's inheritance trying to reclaim my good name. This is simply WRONG!


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## dankc908 (Apr 12, 2011)

Well --- After buying two of bitshird's tools and thinking about a third one I guess it's time I put my CSUSA catalog in the recycle bin since I won't be needing/using it anymore!

Dan


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## IPD_Mr (Apr 12, 2011)

How much you want to bet there won't be one word on here from any of the CSUSA employees that monitor this site.  I have always liked CSUSA but this is the kind of stuff that will make me take my business elsewhere such as Aaron.


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## Andrew_K99 (Apr 12, 2011)

I was planning on making my first order from them, guess I'll need to find someone else that sells Jr. Gents/States II.

Let the CSUSA boycott begin :biggrin:

AK


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## Chasper (Apr 12, 2011)

To expand on and add a few points.

1.  Proof of first usage of the name by you can provide legal basis to vacate allowable trademark usage of the name by someone else.  Even if they have made claim of TM and you didn't, you can still stop them from using the name.  In about 2005 I obtained a court order prohibiting the usage of a name by a company that filed TM in 1936, I was able to prove first usage in 1896.
2.  First usage only protects the usage of the name, it doesn't provide basis for claiming damages.  To be able to claim damages you must register the TM.
3.  Go after any and all resellers, not just the rogue manufacturer.  As a reseller they are party to the intellectual property theft and they bare equal responsibility.  CSUSA might be very unhappy with a tool supplier who knowingly exposed them legal expenses, reputation damage, and possible financial damages.


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## Boz (Apr 12, 2011)

Ask your lawyer about "Prior Art" if you can show that you had developed and marketed the product prior to this guy then you should prevail.  Unfortunatly this can be costly.  I worked for a company that had developed a product and had shown it at trade shows and had articles published in trade journals about the product.  Then a large company took the idea and started to market it.  With our prior art, the marketing pieces and articles,  went to a lawyer and the response was come with $250,000 and we will take the case.


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## Jim in Oakville (Apr 12, 2011)

workinforwood said:


> Sorry Ken, I feel your pain and support you. I advise you stop talking now and see if you can have a mod go back delete certain comments you made as to how you would fight this. This is open forum they can read too. You don't go to war and broadcast your strategy.



Ditto


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## jttheclockman (Apr 12, 2011)

I noticed there is a place to put comments about the video underneath the video. Has anyone left any comments and have they been deleted????  I see there is 0 comments. Maybe time to flood the comment box with comments.


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## TomW (Apr 12, 2011)

Ken,

One Word : *ROYALTY!*

Tom


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## bitshird (Apr 12, 2011)

Every one, thanks for your support, I really shouldn't blast Crafts USA  after all they are a large company and need all the revenue they can grab, even if it is a little on the slightly wrong side. Were I in their shoes though I don't think I'd go to that level, but I don't have a bunch of marketing geniuses to contend with, I do hope they put their marketing geniuses back under the rock they found them under.  BUT CSUSA is a decent company, and I'm very certain in the end they will do the proper thing, if not then we'll see. But here's hoping they are at least half the honorable company I've always credited them with being.
And to the folks that are retailers of the Pen Pro tools we will be engraving ID marks (registered) on the tools shortly.
I still am not sure whether this scheme was cooked up by them or EZ wood tools, either way Thanks to everyone for you emails, PMs and emails to CSUSA.
Ken.


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## dankc908 (Apr 12, 2011)

jttheclockman said:


> I noticed there is a place to put comments about the video underneath the video. Has anyone left any comments and have they been deleted????  I see there is 0 comments. Maybe time to flood the comment box with comments.



I just noticed that they have disabled both Comments and Ratings (I had posted one "dislike" and when I went back in under my regular account name it had been disabled).  Like most big companies they will do anything to avoid being held responsible for their own dishonest actions.  This is very disappointing and I had planned to go to one of their turning classes this summer.  I guess the trip to Utah is now "off"!


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## PenMan1 (Apr 12, 2011)

jttheclockman said:


> I noticed there is a place to put comments about the video underneath the video. Has anyone left any comments and have they been deleted???? I see there is 0 comments. Maybe time to flood the comment box with comments.


 
John:
Comments are disabled for the video. I guess they knew that they would get an "ear full".

You can, however "thumbs down" it.


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## Jim in Oakville (Apr 12, 2011)

PenMan1 said:


> jttheclockman said:
> 
> 
> > I noticed there is a place to put comments about the video underneath the video. Has anyone left any comments and have they been deleted???? I see there is 0 comments. Maybe time to flood the comment box with comments.
> ...



I see two comments there now


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## Russianwolf (Apr 12, 2011)

I was able to thumbs down the video and leave a comment. Also thumbs upped the other comments saying the name isn't theirs.


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## witz1976 (Apr 12, 2011)

Russianwolf said:


> I was able to thumbs down the video and leave a comment. Also thumbs upped the other comments saying the name isn't theirs.



+1 just need a youtube account...I did the same!


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## mokol (Apr 12, 2011)

i got 3 of your tools  and love them
keep up your good work, victor


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## PenMan1 (Apr 12, 2011)

Andrew_K99 said:


> I was planning on making my first order from them, guess I'll need to find someone else that sells Jr. Gents/States II.
> 
> Let the CSUSA boycott begin :biggrin:
> 
> AK


 
Exoticblanks.com has a better price on the Jr. Gents/States II, anyway.:biggrin:


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## bitshird (Apr 12, 2011)

Folks, Thanks again for your support, I just got off the phone with CSUSA and the matter has been resolved, They had no intention of trying to capitalize on my name and they will be making changes to their website as soon as they can, It was a very informative conversation, and as I had thought Craig Jackson of EZ wood tools had nothing whatsoever to do with this. I don't think this need be carried out any further, CSUSA has offered to go above and beyond and settle this in a very professional matter and I wish to thank them for their prompt and courteous response. 
Again thanks to all of the folks that supported this on my behalf, I guess we are still one large dysfunctional (on occasion) family.
Ken


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## Russianwolf (Apr 12, 2011)

Good to here you got is worked out.


Watching them


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## wood-of-1kind (Apr 12, 2011)

Ken, I am happy to hear that "things" are working out for you. Continued success with your Woodchuck line.


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## PenMan1 (Apr 12, 2011)

Restores my faith in CUSA! I thought that they were better than this!


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## GregHight (Apr 12, 2011)

I would have been surprised to hear that Craig with EWT was behind something like that as I know he is an honorable man. You both make great product and I can say that both of you provide great customer service. I'm glad to hear that this issue has been resolved in a satisfactory manner!


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## IPD_Mr (Apr 12, 2011)

PenMan1 said:


> Restores my faith in CUSA! I thought that they were better than this!


 
Well said Andy.
The fact that they acknowledged and handled this so quickly says a lot.  Let's see how long it takes for them to fix the website and the You Tube video.


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## PenMan1 (Apr 12, 2011)

I just went to the CSUSA website and it has already been removed (at least from the home page).

That's the way to do business! When wrong, admit it, fix it and move on.


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## PenMan1 (Apr 12, 2011)

On a funny note, I'd HATE to be that marketing guru that went rushing in with the idea to "re-brand" the EZ tools as an "exclusive" product.

It really is a dog-eat-dog world. Today is the marketing guru's day to wear the Milk Bone underpants


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## Jim in Oakville (Apr 12, 2011)

PenMan1 said:


> I just went to the CSUSA website and it has already been removed (at least from the home page).
> 
> That's the way to do business! When wrong, admit it, fix it and move on.



Handled well so far


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## Andrew_K99 (Apr 12, 2011)

Good to hear that they stepped up the plate on this.

FYI, it is still on their site, just off the main page, hopefully their working on this as well.

http://www.woodturnerscatalog.com/store/New_Products___Easy_Wood_Pen_Pro_Tool___pen_pro?Args

AK


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## wizical (Apr 12, 2011)

after reading all of the posts, and what people are saying....im going to play devils advocate on this one....

If you create a product(like the Woodchuck Pen Pro) and no one else on the market has a product like this out....wouldnt you copyright and trademark your item right away!  I have looked through the site(the woodchuck-tools.com) and see nothing of copyright or trademark anywhere to be found!  If you are going to create/invent a product, wouldnt you want to protect your investment!  im not condoning the actions taken by CSUSA or anyone else...and im sure people are going to come down on me for this comment, but this is my opinion and I am entitled to it


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## Padre (Apr 12, 2011)

I just started reading this, and I couldn't find the video on their site.  Then I see they took it down.  Good for them.  It only took about 12 hours it seems, or less actually, because they weren't working last night.  So from 8 this morning to noon, 4 hours, they made part of it right.  That's cool.

On the other hand: I so totally sympathize with Ken on this.  He has worked long and hard to establish a NAME for himself.

I think this is a good reminder for all of us to be very careful about what we call stuff, whether it be praise or criticism, and especially if we start to offer something for sale on this site.  For example:
Pen Pro = Ken's Woodchuck
EWT, or Easy Tools = Craig's Easy Wood Tools
Resin Saver Molds = Charlie (NewLondon88)
Exotics = Exoticblanks.com (Ed and Dawn)
and on and on.  

Like the Sarge used to say from one of my old favorite shows "let's be careful out there."


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## ericatcraft (Apr 12, 2011)

Message from Darrel Nish at Craft Supplies USA

Dear IAP Members,

It has been brought to my attention that Woodchuck Lathe Tools is currently using the name Woodchuck Pen Pro for a carbide tipped tool like the Pen Pro we are currently advertising.  I apologize to all for the chaos and speculation that has ensued regarding the Pen Pro and our use of the name.  I spoke to Ken Ferrell this morning to apologize for the confusion and to resolve the Pen Pro name issue.  I told Ken we will select a different name today and make the appropriate changes to our website, labeling, etc.  For the IAP members, I would like to clarify a few things as speculation and blame are counterproductive for all.

1.	Craft Supplies USA approached Easy Wood Tools to produce the Pen Pro Tool, which is simply a Ci2 Mini with a 2” radius cutter that we’ve sold for a couple of years in our pen turning booth at The Woodworking Shows.  Craig Jackson/Easy Wood Tools is in no way responsible for the confusion surrounding the use of the Pen Pro name.  Craft Supplies USA chose the name and asked Craig to produce the tool for us using this name.

2.	Prior to deciding on the Pen Pro name, we searched the United States Patent Trademark Office trademark database to determine whether or not the name “Pen Pro” was registered or in use.  After our USPTO search yielded no claim to the “Pen Pro” name and no results were found on Google searches under Pen Pro, we felt comfortable with proceeding with using the “Pen Pro” name.

3.	As the owner and founder of Craft Supplies USA, which is a family-owned and operated business, I understand Ken’s frustration with this situation and apologize for the anxiety and stress this has resulted.  It was not our intention to infringe on Ken’s business and we apologize for inadvertently having done so.  

I understand the effort it takes to create a successful business and the accompanying frustration of seeing products “knocked off” as this situation first appeared to be.  We wish Ken the best in business and appreciate his entrepreneurial spirit. 

Best wishes to all IAP members

Darrel Nish
Owner- Craft Supplies USA


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## Jim15 (Apr 12, 2011)

Ken, i'm glad it was resolved to your satisfaction.


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## JerrySambrook (Apr 12, 2011)

I too am going to play advocate here.

Ken, if you had done so in the first place, they would have been fine with fixing the issue, All you had to do was call them first.
The people at CSUSA are all very very decent people.

Once again, a whole lot of people join in a bashing sceme, without giving some credit to people who have done a lot for this community.
Also, your tool is no where near new or innovative.
I have owned a few from a place called New Edge Tools for well over 5 years now.

Great job guys. and I would not be suprised if they said the heck with this place in next years bash.

I wonder what would happen if the company Woodchuck, or Woodchuckers would say if they knew you were stealing their name, as both companies have been around for a while as well.


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## wizical (Apr 12, 2011)

awesome letter from Dale @ CSUSA


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## Andrew_K99 (Apr 12, 2011)

Not to put down the CSUSA appolgy but ...
1. I searched "Pen Pro lathe tool" and the FIRST hit was Ken's site.
2. Being a member yourself since 2006 there is certainly no way you didn't know about or hear about the Pen Pro Ken offers. I have only been a member for a few months and have read lots about it.
3. Odds are the other CSUSA reps that come on here knew about it as well.

Good on CSUSA for changing the name, but I have my doubts CSUSA didn't know about the name.

AK


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## PenMan1 (Apr 12, 2011)

Thank you, Darrel Nish, for re-confirming that your company does, indeed,  have the best of business practices and standards.


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## Russianwolf (Apr 12, 2011)

For those that asked, A Trade Mark is similar to a Copyright in that it exists at inception regardless of registration. Registration just makes it easier to protect and is the only way to file for damages.

You can even register a trade mark and have to allow someone else the use if they were using it before you and continuously up to date. If they stop the use, then they can no longer use it. (Seen this happen in sports team names)

A trade mark isn't just the words, it's the words in relation to the subject. So Jerry, unless Woodchuck and Woodchuckers have anything to do with lathe tools, Ken is safe from them.

I'm getting to dang well versed on this stuff. :frown:


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## Russianwolf (Apr 12, 2011)

PenMan1 said:


> Thank you, Darrel Nish, for re-confirming that your company does, indeed,  have the best of business practices and standards.



++1


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## Padre (Apr 12, 2011)

STOP PEOPLE!! STOP!!!!!

Ken voiced an opinion and frustration.  He is a respected, well-liked member and vendor here.

CSUSA fixed it.  They are a respected, well-liked vendor/member here.

Nuff said.


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## witz1976 (Apr 12, 2011)

Thank you Eric for passing along Mr. Nash's response to this issue.  

I am a little curious however  as you have been a member on this site since 2006, how come you or a representative did not approach Ken about CSUSA's desire for a pen pro type product as he has been advertising his Pen Pro since fall of 2009?  (see Ken's thread on the business classifieds http://www.penturners.org/forum/showthread.php?t=53620)   Granted, Ken should have registered his products and tradenames, however as stated a simple google search would have directed everyone to Ken's site immediately.  (and to be clear I have not owned or used either the Pen Pro or any of the Easy Wood Products so this is just a question)

In either case I am glad to see the issue is resolved and both parties are satisfied.


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## bitshird (Apr 12, 2011)

Thanks to everyone who voiced an opinion, and thanks to Darrell Nish who handled this in a much better manner than I did, I have requested that the thread be locked or closed, I also would like to thank Eric for Posting Mr. Nish's explanation of the circumstances, So let's let this thing die a quiet peaceful end All is right in Mudville I mean Adamsville.


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## Russianwolf (Apr 12, 2011)

bitshird said:


> Thanks to everyone who voiced an opinion, and thanks to Darrell Nish who handled this in a much better manner than I did, I have requested that the thread be locked or closed, I also would like to thank Eric for Posting Mr. Nish's explanation of the circumstances, So let's let this thing die a quiet peaceful end All is right in Mudville I mean Adamsville.



okay Ken, now get back to grinding my duplicator tool!!!!
:wink:


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## maxwell_smart007 (Apr 12, 2011)

As Ken has said, both parties are satisfied, and thus we should be as well.  

If Ken considers the matter closed, that's good enough for me.  Please refrain from allowing this thread to continue down a path it needs not take any further.  

Andrew 
assistant moderator


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## OKLAHOMAN (Apr 12, 2011)

Great to hear that you and CSUSA worked it out, I always thought that they were a reputable company and now I know it. Wish you much sucess and thanks for clearing this up...


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