# New Front Page



## jeff (Jul 3, 2019)

I've been working on a new layout for the front page.  More tinkering to do, but, it's coming along.
Have a look, then I'd love to hear your thoughts and suggestions. Please feel free to post here.

The left sidebar contains the most recent threads from SOYP. The center "Featured Pens" slider contains my selections for the featured pens. We used to just show one, but I think it might be nice to show several at once. The posts section in the middle has a tab selector for several things. The right sidebar is pretty similar to what we have currently.

I'm also thinking about a good way to use the open space in the header (next to the logo). I thought about putting a photo slider up there.

Here's the page:  Draft of New Front Page


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## 1shootist (Jul 3, 2019)

I like it. Has the features a front page needs. And adds color !


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## dpstudios (Jul 3, 2019)

Well done Jeff. Photos, color, movement, and info. Everything needed for a home page to attract new members and to entertain and inform the old. Looks good.


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## Curly (Jul 3, 2019)

Looks good. 

A suggestion for the space beside the logo would be the Annual and Summer Bash, MPG, etc., or any other group gatherings that come up. Groupe buys could also be there too.


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## leehljp (Jul 3, 2019)

Looks great! You know me - love the visual effects!


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## wood-of-1kind (Jul 3, 2019)

Very nice "look" and I certainly like what you have done so far.


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## SpinRight (Jul 3, 2019)

Curly said:


> Looks good.
> 
> A suggestion for the space beside the logo would be the Annual and Summer Bash, MPG, etc., or any other group gatherings that come up. Groupe buys could also be there too.


That's kind of what I was thinking. Sort of an important news section. Thanks for the idea!


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## mbroberg (Jul 3, 2019)

I like the look!  I also like the idea of using the upper space to make announcements of interest.


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## cjester (Jul 3, 2019)

I like it. I think another photo slider would be a little busy. I like some white space next to the logo. I agree that that space would be good for events and announcements.


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## CREID (Jul 3, 2019)

Well it looks ok but could use a little pizazz, like a picture of me.


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## More4dan (Jul 3, 2019)

How about a calendar were we can post upcoming get togethers, shows, demos, etc. ?


Sent from my iPad using Penturners.org mobile app


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## edman2 (Jul 3, 2019)

Like it!  I would suggest an adjustment on the timing of the slide movement on the featured pen section to give more time to look at the pens.


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## BRobbins629 (Jul 3, 2019)

I almost got used to the more minimalist version. To me, it’s a little busy but looks like I’m in the minority. Would also slow down the scroll of featured pens.


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## VA Jim (Jul 3, 2019)

Jeff,
I guess if there was one thing about the current homepage I would miss is the wide photo slide.  It's 8 pics wide and you can drag it.  Guess I'm impatient, but autoadvance on the pics always seems glacial - not just here - on most sites.  I really like being able to drag through a number of images and if I see one that interests me I can open it in a new tab.  When the slide is only two images wide, dragging isn't much of an option.  
(Interesting - just had a 'how about that'. On the new page Member photos - if you click & hold one of the pics, you can drag back and forth across the whole page and the pics keep scrolling.)
Few things to look at.
1) Guest/not logged in.  When I access as a guess/not logged there are no images above the center section - just the words "Featured Pens" (I've tried with both Firefox and Chrome & same thing - no images).  
2) Left side images & Featured images.  These appear to be 'thread' linked (whereas the member photos are 'media' linked).  Point is that the left & feature images are large and load slower (e.g. left side: rose-wood-ebonite-pen is 1000x750 and Featured: another-attempt-at-the-stained-glass-theme is 980x1080).  The member photos are all thumbnail 300x300.  
Just had a thought - could the no Featured Pens showing be a function of the images coming from threads?  (i.e. you must be registered/logged on to view...).
I've attached screenprints of what I'm seeing.  Curious if someone else might try viewing not logged in.
See, you ask for comments & get a missive! 
Jim


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## George883 (Jul 3, 2019)

I like it.  Looks crisp.  Good job.


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## jeff (Jul 3, 2019)

VA Jim said:


> Jeff,
> I guess if there was one thing about the current homepage I would miss is the wide photo slide.  It's 8 pics wide and you can drag it.  Guess I'm impatient, but autoadvance on the pics always seems glacial - not just here - on most sites.  I really like being able to drag through a number of images and if I see one that interests me I can open it in a new tab.  When the slide is only two images wide, dragging isn't much of an option.
> (Interesting - just had a 'how about that'. On the new page Member photos - if you click & hold one of the pics, you can drag back and forth across the whole page and the pics keep scrolling.)
> Few things to look at.
> ...



Jim - thanks for your comments. Much appreciated.

I've put the album slider in the center and increased the number of photos. Let's see how that goes over. I predict 50/50 love/hate   I had it that way originally, but there seemed to be too much horizontal scrolling going on in that center pane.

The no images as guest was a permissions issue. Should be fixed now.

You are correct. The left and center images are full size and resized on the fly. The album slider is using pre-generated thumbnails. When I select a featured pen, I have the option of providing a URL to the image, or uploading a fresh one. I can upload a reasonably sized one for the center slider which would speed up rendering of the page. Unfortunately for the sidenav images, they come from the first attachment in the thread and I can't control that. I recognize that 10meg+ images are unnecessary, but it's a tough sell to ask that they be resized when people are used to being able to upload whatever comes off their phone to social media.


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## jeff (Jul 3, 2019)

edman2 said:


> Like it!  I would suggest an adjustment on the timing of the slide movement on the featured pen section to give more time to look at the pens.



I slowed that down. I originally had it slower, but I got impatient while I was testing it.


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## jttheclockman (Jul 3, 2019)

I thought most were in agreement to have some sort of introductory notice as to who we are and what we do and a notice to make newbies welcomed and encouraged to join. Not sure yet how  I feel about all that info in the center. Sort of takes away from the forum "Whats New"  To me that is where the welcome thing comes in. I like the extra featured pens. It does add color.


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## Scott (Jul 4, 2019)

I like it!

Scott.


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## 1080Wayne (Jul 4, 2019)

Different scroll speeds on the member photos and featured photo are a bit disconcerting . Also , why both blue and a black `Whats new` buttons ? `Latest activity` also seems redundant . I like the way the page presents on my laptop .


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## TonyL (Jul 4, 2019)

I think it is very good. What is the difference between What's New and Recent Posts please? Thank you.


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## robersonjr (Jul 4, 2019)

I like it


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## JimB (Jul 4, 2019)

Did you do away with the Donate button? Maybe that was discussed before and I just missed it.


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## wolf creek knives (Jul 4, 2019)

I'm not sure how I feel about it.  I just got used to the new one but I'm sure this one will click as easy as the new (old) format.


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## jeff (Jul 4, 2019)

TonyL said:


> I think it is very good. What is the difference between What's New and Recent Posts please? Thank you.



What's new has multiple tabs. The new posts tab there should be the same as the new posts feed in the center box of the new front page.

That answer is "mostly" correct. There is some variability depending on user profile settings.

What would people like to see on the front page in the "latest from our forums" section? Chronological new threads? New posts? Posts you haven't seen since your last visit?


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## jeff (Jul 4, 2019)

JimB said:


> Did you do away with the Donate button? Maybe that was discussed before and I just missed it.



It hasn't been replaced yet. The page it led to needs to be reworked.


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## jeff (Jul 4, 2019)

1080Wayne said:


> Different scroll speeds on the member photos and featured photo are a bit disconcerting . Also , why both blue and a black `Whats new` buttons ? `Latest activity` also seems redundant . I like the way the page presents on my laptop .



Good question on the buttons. The top one opens the What's New menu. The lower one is the default tab that shows new posts.

What would be a more useful menu structure?  I can change anything.


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## jeff (Jul 4, 2019)

1080Wayne said:


> Different scroll speeds on the member photos and featured photo are a bit disconcerting . Also , why both blue and a black `Whats new` buttons ? `Latest activity` also seems redundant . I like the way the page presents on my laptop .



Even if I set them the same, the scroll speeds are unpredictable due to several factors. The best I can do is move the two sliders away from each other. 

How would you recommend they be arranged?


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## jeff (Jul 4, 2019)

jttheclockman said:


> I thought most were in agreement to have some sort of introductory notice as to who we are and what we do and a notice to make newbies welcomed and encouraged to join. Not sure yet how  I feel about all that info in the center. Sort of takes away from the forum "Whats New"  To me that is where the welcome thing comes in. I like the extra featured pens. It does add color.



I have not forgotten about the welcome notices.


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## TonyL (Jul 4, 2019)

jeff said:


> What's new has multiple tabs. The new posts tab there should be the same as the new posts feed in the center box of the new front page.
> 
> That answer is "mostly" correct. There is some variability depending on user profile settings.
> 
> What would people like to see on the front page in the "latest from our forums" section? Chronological new threads? New posts? Posts you haven't seen since your last visit?


I like New Posts to be relative to my last visit.
As far as What's new - whatever your present settings are fine with me. I really over 95% on New Post.

Maybe if we measure the average visitation frequency period across the entire forum, the resulting  average duration/time interval  can serves as the refresh period for What's New? Maybe it can be dynamic? This is not anything that I have any expertise with.


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## Penultimate (Jul 4, 2019)

I like it.


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## Dalecamino (Jul 4, 2019)

Looks good to me. I like your plan.


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## jeff (Jul 5, 2019)

I'll be tinkering with some layout changes this weekend. Both on the Test Page and throughout the forums. Post here if you see something you like or hate.

Right now the Main Forum List is in two columns. Nothing has moved between categories. Just trying to compact the layout a little.


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## pshrynk (Jul 5, 2019)

That one kinda threw me for a bit.  I thought I'd screwed something up!


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## Tony Salvatore (Jul 5, 2019)

The page looks great Jeff! Thanks for all your work for and helping the IAP!


Sent from my iPad using Penturners.org mobile app


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## jeff (Jul 6, 2019)

I'm kind of liking the simple 2-column layout on the Forum Overview Page Looks uncluttered and clean. 

Anyone have a thought on that? Like? Dislike?


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## mark james (Jul 6, 2019)

I also like the 2 column format.  I really like being able to place media in PM's, and have the message saved for editing.  It is much easier to look for links to add after I find them.  I'm also used the dark format.


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## 1080Wayne (Jul 6, 2019)

I like it . Works well with latest posts on the side . Have always wondered though if there is much value in showing thread and post counts .


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## jeff (Jul 6, 2019)

1080Wayne said:


> I like it . Works well with latest posts on the side . Have always wondered though if there is much value in showing thread and post counts .


Just for fun, I turned those off. I've wondered over the years if there's any value to showing those. 

Comments anyone?


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## Wayne (Jul 6, 2019)

I like this concept. Clean, and more friendly. Not over powering.

"Just the Fact Ma'm"


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## tbroye (Jul 20, 2019)

Wow haven't been by in a while, raising 3 teen age grandkids takes time for us oldtimers.  Really nice makeover easier to read.  Need to start spending time navigating but look like it will be easier


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## jeff (Jul 22, 2019)

I'm about ready to switch over to the new front page.  Check it out HERE

Before I make that the default, I thought I'd ask again if there are suggestions or issues that need to be addressed. I've incorporated a couple of the suggestions, such as not autoscrolling the photos.  Other issues, concerns, suggestions, VERY WELCOME.

Tell me what is in the wrong place, what needs to be added, etc.

Here's a brief rundown on what you'll see if you check it out.

The menu structure is exactly the same as it is now.
Left sidebar is the 5 most recent posts from the SOYP forum
The right side bar has blocks for online members, new vendor forum posts, birthdays, and statistics
The upper center section has a featured pens scroller, random album photos
The center also has "The latest from our forums" with tabs for new posts, recent threads, and sale/trade posts


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## KLJ (Jul 22, 2019)

Looks good to me I think it should work well. Thanks for the work you put into the forum.


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## magpens (Jul 22, 2019)

I like it, Jeff !!! . Thank you !!!

I really prefer the non-scrolling "Featured Pens".

The layout is really good, IMHO !

BTW, I am using the dark gray background all the time now ..... it is a great boon to the eyes for me !!!!


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## magpens (Jul 22, 2019)

@jeff

Have you reversed the 3-column decision ? . I am seeing 2 again . . I prefer 3, FWIW. . Oh ... maybe the view with 3 is just a trial pending "approval" .... well you have my approval ! 

Also FWIW, since you asked about post and thread count .... I don't see much point in displaying those.
And, in addition, I don't see too much point in displaying a member's message count either .... in fact, I think my number is way too high !! . Weird error ?


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## jeff (Jul 22, 2019)

Yes, the 3 column is not yet "live". 

Once I turn it on, that's what you'll see when you come to the site home page.

This software doesn't have the ability to hide the post count on a per user basis. The old forum didn't either - I had to code that feature.  I might get around to that here, but I have to admit I have no idea why someone would want to hide their post count.


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## Curly (Jul 22, 2019)

Looks fine to me Jeff.

Mal lets face reality. You are a chatty fellow.


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## magpens (Jul 22, 2019)

@Curly
@jeff
There is no way that my post count is correct !! . . I mean .... look .... jeff has fewer than I do !! . . Get real, Curly !! 
I wasn't even very active for the first 5 years.  Then I had my post count hidden for a couple of years before the recent software change, but when the new software came along there was a huge increase compared to previously. . I got the shock of my life !! . I am not really a chatty guy in real life !!! . Seriously


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## mark james (Jul 22, 2019)

Looks great Jeff!  We appreciate your efforts.


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## LouCee (Jul 22, 2019)

I like it, looks like it's ready to go.  Jeff, thank you for all of your hard work on this.


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## jeff (Jul 23, 2019)

More4dan said:


> How about a calendar were we can post upcoming get togethers, shows, demos, etc. ?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Penturners.org mobile app


I have finally finished evaluating the available calendars and I think I've settled on one. I hope to get it installed in the next few days.


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## jeff (Jul 23, 2019)

I've heard a concern that there are too many photos on the proposed new home page.

Yes, there are quite a few, and they're there because over the last 15 years I've gotten the distinct impression that we love photos. 

Perhaps there are too many, and I'm certainly willing to reduce the number, but I'd like to get your impression just about the photos. Specifically, are there too many? Are they in the wrong spots?

THANKS!


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## jttheclockman (Jul 23, 2019)

Jeff being you are asking yes way too many photos. The featured Photo was always the main attraction on the home page and was a big deal to make it there and it meant something. Now it is the smallest photo there and gets drowned out by the large photos on the left that are to me distracting. Why do we need the members photos on the front page if you are going to have random photos that I assume will roll or change somehow make them smaller.  You asked and that is just one opinion. Make the center portion larger and take space away from the left side.


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## 1080Wayne (Jul 24, 2019)

I like the 5 recent member photos on the left , but perhaps just a slightly larger featured photo in the center , if you plan on having a featured photo . However , I have no problem with it the way you have it now . I think you are correct - people like photos , judging by the `it didn`t happen if there isn`t a photo`comments , and the admonishments to new members to post photos of their work .

 The wide variation in photo quality might be a concern in deciding what gets shown on the front page . I seldom am happy with my photography , so my pictures usually  won`t be posted . Please forgive me for exercising a small degree of editorial control on the front page by doing that .


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## jeff (Jul 24, 2019)

jttheclockman said:


> Jeff being you are asking yes way too many photos. The featured Photo was always the main attraction on the home page and was a big deal to make it there and it meant something. Now it is the smallest photo there and gets drowned out by the large photos on the left that are to me distracting. Why do we need the members photos on the front page if you are going to have random photos that I assume will roll or change somehow make them smaller.  You asked and that is just one opinion. Make the center portion larger and take space away from the left side.


So you'd recommend a layout like we used to have. All text except for one featured photo?


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## jeff (Jul 24, 2019)

1080Wayne said:


> I like the 5 recent member photos on the left , but perhaps just a slightly larger featured photo in the center , if you plan on having a featured photo . However , I have no problem with it the way you have it now . I think you are correct - people like photos , judging by the `it didn`t happen if there isn`t a photo`comments , and the admonishments to new members to post photos of their work .
> 
> The wide variation in photo quality might be a concern in deciding what gets shown on the front page . I seldom am happy with my photography , so my pictures usually  won`t be posted . Please forgive me for exercising a small degree of editorial control on the front page by doing that .



That's why I like the photos in the left hand sidebar. Previously I posted about 20 featured pens a year. That meant that lots of pens went unseen. I thought that the sidebar was a good place to give everybody a chance for some front page time.


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## leehljp (Jul 24, 2019)

I like the layout OK but was wondering if:
1.  the sidebar photos could be reduced by about 25%.
2. Could the Front Page Photo be about 25% larger,
3. and the "Member Photos" be shrunk a tad.

This would give more prominence to the main photo; Other recent photos would be seen, and last, I like the random old photos popping up so that we get to see pens of yesteryear.


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## jeff (Jul 24, 2019)

jttheclockman said:


> Jeff being you are asking yes way too many photos. The featured Photo was always the main attraction on the home page and was a big deal to make it there and it meant something. Now it is the smallest photo there and gets drowned out by the large photos on the left that are to me distracting. Why do we need the members photos on the front page if you are going to have random photos that I assume will roll or change somehow make them smaller.  You asked and that is just one opinion. Make the center portion larger and take space away from the left side.





leehljp said:


> I like the layout OK but was wondering if:
> 1.  the sidebar photos could be reduced by about 25%.
> 2. Could the Front Page Photo be about 25% larger,
> 3. and the "Member Photos" be shrunk a tad.
> ...


There isn't a "main photo". What do you mean?


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## jttheclockman (Jul 24, 2019)

jeff said:


> So you'd recommend a layout like we used to have. All text except for one featured photo?



No Jeff I am basically saying what Hank is saying. The members photos should not be there. (the ones you have under the feature photo)  They are replaced by the photos on the left which I am guessing are random photos that will roll and change. They should be reduced in size because they overwhelm the page. The Featured pen photo should be made front and center and larger. As I said that was a feature that was looked at being meant something. I know we live in a everyone gets a trophy society now but to me it was cool to see a top rated pen on the cover. Now I am bringing the past up here but I believe we do not celebrate those pens that are truely outstanding and Wow pens or if you may Hall of Fame pens. Put the members photos on the Forum page top if you like. They can be the old system of random past pens. 

As far as text goes I believe that an Introductory thread be the main topic and if you want list the forums available. To me less  is better looking instead of trying to put so much info on the front page. Let the members whett the appetite and then roam around. 

Jeff let it be known I am in no way trying to tell you what to do. You have done a great job so far and I am sure whatever you decide will be great looking and I will have no problem with it. We grow with the new look. You asked and I took the time to give an opinion which I am hoping other will too. I know you are trying to get others opinions because like you say it is the members site and they should have a say. But the other side of the coin  is too many cooks spoil the broth. Do as you see fit. Your work is truely appreciated. I think your photo should be on the front page.


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## jeff (Jul 24, 2019)

John, thanks very much for your continued contributions to improving our little corner of the world.

Just to clarity...

The member photos (in the center, under the featured photo scroller) are randomly pulled from the ~40,000 images in the photo albums. I hoped this would give a view into the archive of photos that have never seen the light of day. There are some gems in there that were never posted.

The photos on the left sidebar are the first attachments from the 5 most recent threads posted in SOYP.  I intended this for two reasons (1) encourage people to post in SOYP because for some period of time they'll get a few minutes of fame, and (2) to whet the appetite of people who see those and want to dig deeper (they're all clickable into the thread)

The featured photos (top of the center column) are chosen by me and promoted to "featured status". There's also a Featured Pens Page that shows all the featured pens and would be sort of an archive of featured pens. The idea of the slider was to make it super easy for me to feature some pens (selfish perhaps -- it's one click), and get into a regular rhythm of adding a new pen once a week.

One of the other reasons for all the photos was to encourage people to take better photos and to post more. With more chances to get on the front page, my thinking was that people would want their own great photos up there. So my intent was partly to motivate people to post photos.

All that said, I'll delay getting the new page up and I'll see how I can provide interesting content while reducing the number of photos from various sources.


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## Wayne (Jul 24, 2019)

Jeff, 

I'm in favor of eliminating the lh column of photos and replacing them with a second column of forum postings. One column of "What's New " my first view on the forum. Second column could be what you feel is required. RH column could be possibly reduced in width. 
Asking for thoughts doesn't always give you preferred layouts. You can never satisfy everyone, it's the old 5% rule.


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## Curly (Jul 24, 2019)

0.0005% here with my say.  

I'm fine with what you are doing Jeff. My vote is to implement it as is and see how it goes for a while and revisit it when you feel it needs a tweak or two.

I was okay with the pictures scrolling by too, although would have liked them to be on a slower timer. With me having the option I tend to forget to look through them. It is nice to see different pictures when I come to the forum and when going back to the home page after looking at a thread.

 I don't suppose there is a way for us to pick between manual and auto scrolling? Don't sweat it if it can't be done or is difficult to implement.

The nice thing as I see things now is that the Home Page is unlike other forums. I think it will encourage exploration of the site.


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## jeff (Jul 24, 2019)

Wayne said:


> Jeff,
> 
> I'm in favor of eliminating the lh column of photos and replacing them with a second column of forum postings. One column of "What's New " my first view on the forum. Second column could be what you feel is required. RH column could be possibly reduced in width.
> Asking for thoughts doesn't always give you preferred layouts. You can never satisfy everyone, it's the old 5% rule.



What would you like to see in a "second column of forum postings"?  Today the proposed page has:

*Center column tabbed section:* New Posts, Recent Threads, New For Sale Posts
*Right Column:*  New posts from the vendor forum

Thanks
*
*


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## Wayne (Jul 24, 2019)

jeff said:


> What would you like to see in a "second column of forum postings"?  Today the proposed page has:
> 
> *Center column tabbed section:* New Posts, Recent Threads, New For Sale Posts
> *Right Column:*  New posts from the vendor forum
> ...


First column would be: Home - What's New. 
Second column would be: Forums - New Posts.


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## jeff (Jul 24, 2019)

What's New isn't a feed, it's a block full of tabs (Latest Posts, New Posts, etc.)

I'll play around with some things and show some ideas.


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