# Live Center V. Dead Center



## Sunami (Jan 4, 2016)

Can anyone explain to a newbie what the real difference is and when I would want to use one vs. the other. I understand that the live center spins and the dead center does not, I just don't understand when I would use one over the other.

Thanks!


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## stonepecker (Jan 4, 2016)

Live center goes in the tail stock.
Dead center goes in at the power end to drive the piece you are turning.


(You have no idea how long it took me to understand this.)


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## Carl Fisher (Jan 4, 2016)

Live center rotates and would be used on the non-drive side (tailstock)
Dead center is fixed and is used to drive from the headstock. 

If you were to put a live center in the headstock, the result would be that your workpiece would not turn. 

Some metal working uses a dead center in the tailstock, but I can't see you'd ever need to do that in our applications.


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## low_48 (Jan 4, 2016)

If you have been turning long enough, you'd know that dead centers can also be used in the tailstock. It takes a little beeswax to lubricate it in the wood. The old part? Back in the day you only got a drive spur for the headstock, and a dead cup center for the tailstock. They can also be used for metal lathes in the tailstock. Here it takes a bit of grease and works well since the lathe speed is lower than woodturning.


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## JimB (Jan 4, 2016)

If you are turning pens with the TBC method (TBC or Turning Between Centers means not using a mandrel) you would put the dead center in the headstock and the live center in the tailstock and mount the blank between them. The two centers go directly into the brass tube. Don't over tighten as that will expand the tube. Don't under tighten as then the tube will spin on the dead center. Correctly tightening is much easier to do then it sounds. Just a very slight adjustment to the tailstock is all that is needed. You do one barrel at a time.


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## Charlie_W (Jan 4, 2016)

In addition to what Jim just posted, you would use a dead center/live center when turning with Turn Between Centers Bushings, TBC bushings, these are machined to tighter tolerances  and will result improve your fit of the pen blank to the pen components.
These bushings are available now at Classic Nib and at LaserLinez (who machines these) Also, contact Brian Nikitas here on IAP for a custom turned set of TBC Bushings. These bushings will have a 60 degree cut in the rear for the centers to fit into.
Note: Some of these bushings are available with a hole drilled through for use on a mandrel in addition to between centers.


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## oneleggimp (Jan 4, 2016)

Believe it or not, Dead Centers were used in the tailstock of metal turning lathes fifty years ago (or so).  the work piece was drilled with a 60 degree center drill which formed a pocket beyond the 60 degree countersink.  That pocket was filled with a paste of White Lead cut with linseed oil and it kept the center lubricated.  When you stopped the cut, you'd back the tailstock quill out and add more white lead paste.  For wood at that time, you used a cup center which also did not rotate.  It had a point and was surrounded for a "rim" with a space in between.  You could put some parafin on the cup center to lubricate it.  I did see a couple of guys use lube oil to lube the cup center.  I never did.  The end grain of te work piece wicked up the oil and made it harder to get a consistent finish.


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## JimB (Jan 4, 2016)

Charlie_W said:


> In addition to what Jim just posted, you would use a dead center/live center when turning with Turn Between Centers Bushings, TBC bushings, these are machined to tighter tolerances  and will result improve your fit of the pen blank to the pen components.
> These bushings are available now at Classic Nib and at LaserLinez (who machines these) Also, contact Brian Nikitas here on IAP for a custom turned set of TBC Bushings. These bushings will have a 60 degree cut in the rear for the centers to fit into.
> Note: Some of these bushings are available with a hole drilled through for use on a mandrel in addition to between centers.



Thanks for adding that Charlie. My brain skipped ahead to sanding and finishing. I also use bushings for the turning part. I then remove bushings to do final sanding and finishing mounting the blank the way I described. I really should finish my coffee before posting.


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## Charlie_W (Jan 4, 2016)

JimB said:


> Charlie_W said:
> 
> 
> > In addition to what Jim just posted, you would use a dead center/live center when turning with Turn Between Centers Bushings, TBC bushings, these are machined to tighter tolerances  and will result improve your fit of the pen blank to the pen components.
> ...



Likewise for the sanding and finishing!


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## Sunami (Jan 4, 2016)

Thank you so much for the information! Slowly getting my brain wrapped around this process. I keep watching videos of how people turn kit less pens and everyone does them differently - so it's hard to keep track of what they are using and why! Same for the chuck vs. collet debate...but I won't go there now!


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## chartle (Jan 5, 2016)

There is a lathe in my mother's basement that my grandfather may have made.  In the tail stock is a 1/2 piece of sharpened threaded rod with a hand wheel and a large wingnut on it to lock it in place. Nothing live about it at all.

To change gears you pivoted up the motor and moved the pulley, all open. Its on probably its third old washing machine motor.


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