# Carbide Insert Group Buy



## Andrew_K99 (Mar 1, 2012)

*PLEASE NOTE THAT THERE IS A MINIMUM ORDER QUANTITY (MOQ) OF 500 INSERTS. THIS GROUP BUY WILL NOT GO THROUGH IF THIS IS NOT MET.*

Based on the large number of carbide insert tool users I thought I would put together the following group buy. The inserts will be bought from Global Tooling.




 
The group buy is for 15mm x 15mm x 2.5mm carbide inserts with a 100mm [4”] radius; the corners of the inserts also have a small radius (as shown in the picture). These inserts are the ones used on the "Byrd" Shelix Journal (Helical) heads found in woodworking planners and jointers.

The price is *$25 USD for 10 inserts + shipping*. Shipping will be $5.50 within the US and $10 within Canada. This will be for up to 30 inserts. If you want more then this I will confirm shipping costs once I recieve the inserts to see how many will actually fit in the packaging. Note that as I am close to the US/Canadian border I will ship US orders via USPS and Canadian orders via Canada post.

The poll, which will run until March 14th, has been created to show who is interested and how many inserted you would be interested in. Please complete the poll ONLY if you intend to follow through with the purchase. I will use the poll information to contact you once it is confirmed. Comments below aren't required.

Once the group buy is confirmed I will allow a couple days for others to join to finalize numbers. Payments to me are to be made only once I have confirmed the group buy is active, you will be contacted with payment information. I will cut the order once 50% of the money has been collected.

If you have any questions please post them in this thread or PM me.

Andrew


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## BRobbins629 (Mar 1, 2012)

I would be in for 10 - Would you order screws as well?


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## Andrew_K99 (Mar 1, 2012)

BRobbins629 said:


> I would be in for 10 - Would you order screws as well?


Thanks for the question, I can and will source screws if that is desired. If Global doesn't have them I will get them locally. Cost I assume will be marginal (per piece) so I can throw one in for those that need it. If more then one is desired I will get pricing and let everyone know.

Also, for the DIY'ers that haven't made their own tool yet, I could source and supply a 1/2"x1/2"x9-1/2" long piece of steel at cost if you are interested (FYI 9-1/2" is the longest that'll fit in a small flat rate box).

AK


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## PaulDoug (Mar 1, 2012)

10 here


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## dexter0606 (Mar 1, 2012)

What does the group buy get us???
I just ordered the same 10 inserts from Global @ $2.35 USD ea ($23.50 plus shipping)


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## Phunky_2003 (Mar 1, 2012)

Minimum order of 500 should be 10 % off.  I've dealt with them before through a previous job.  Should make them about 2.10 each or so.


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## Andrew_K99 (Mar 1, 2012)

Okay, I've just explained it to Mannie but I will put it here as well.

As you may have noticed I am north of the border. Unfortunately the price gets bumped up to cover additional charges.

That said, global charges higher shipping costs.

For the US member buying direct:
10*2.35=$23.50 + $9 shipping (varies based on location) = $32.50, at $30 in the group buy that is a savings of 8%.

For the Canadian members buying direct:
10*2.35=$23.50 + $17.25 shipping = $40.75 (+ duty, HST and exchange), at $35 in the group buy that 
is a minimum savings of 16%.

Cheapest you'll find them (other than direct) $6 up to $15 each.

Waste of a group buy? Let me know. I had good intensions.


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## Monty (Mar 1, 2012)

When I went to the Global site and "ordered" 10 or 20, the shipping to me was $7.90, but if I ordered 30, it jumped to $11.45.


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## lsweeney (Mar 1, 2012)

I'm in for 10


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## The Penguin (Mar 1, 2012)

seems like a lot of work for very little savings.

especially having to get an order of 500 together


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## Andrew_K99 (Mar 1, 2012)

The huge saving will if you buy your inserts from a vendors as the cost is less the half the cheapest I've been able to find.  There is still a minimum of an 8% savings if you've ever bought direct.

Guess on a $3 item (which retails for $6+) saving 8% isn't enough 

AK


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## Finatic (Mar 1, 2012)

I'm in for 10


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## knowltoh (Mar 1, 2012)

Will these work with the Woodchuck Pen Pro?


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## Andrew_K99 (Mar 1, 2012)

knowltoh said:


> Will these work with the Woodchuck Pen Pro?



These use a standard M6 tapered/countersunk fastener.

FYI this is the standard faster for the insert that General sells.  Note that it is too long for a lathe tool.  http://globaltooling.bizhosting.com/products/knives-ick/spiral-head-knife-spare-screw.html

I am 90% sure these are the exact same insert that are or were sold with the Pen Pro, I cannot confirm this though as I don't own one; I made my own.

Do you know what the Pen Pro uses?

AK


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## BigShed (Mar 1, 2012)

I have put myself down for 10 as well.


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## Andrew_K99 (Mar 2, 2012)

22 hours in and almost half way there :good:.

Please note (forgot this in the OP) Paypal fees are included in the price, so the price to you is exactly as stated, no surprises.

AK


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## Chris Bar (Mar 2, 2012)

I have the 209HH that uses this insert, however my intent is to purchase them for a lathe tool (and as a backup for the 209), so I need someone's help here.

Have read that it is strongly suggested that folks not make their own tools using a piece of steel and an insert. Seems like a reasonably easy tool to make, but comments indicated that it is more than difficult and the probability of getting it right are almost nil.

Are _they_ full of it? The store bought tools are a bit pricy for my skill level, so the home-made tool idea made me quite happy, 'til_ they_ burst my bubble!

If _they_ are full, count me in for 10.  Will vote after I hear back.


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## Andrew_K99 (Mar 2, 2012)

They are indeed full of it, for the most part at least.

Effectively all you need to do if file (or grind) a flat spot to hold the insert and bevel the end of the tool.  You also need to tap a hole.  Making your own handle is straight forward.

Do a search here and you'll find tons of information and the things to watch out for (most common issue would be over filing the flat spot which could allow the insert to rotate).

If you have any question myself or many others that have done it will be glad to help.

If you stuck with the tapping bit, I could supply the steel already tapped for you, and my cost.  You'd have to file to suit.

AK


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## Andrew_K99 (Mar 3, 2012)

I've posted this on anther forum and over 100 are already wanted!

Based on a few requests all orders of 10 will receive 1 screw, so order 30 get 3 screws.

Also shipping costs are likely to be half or better than stated.  I used the information on Globals site for weight and their value is very high!  10 inserts will almost certainly fit into an envelope.

AK


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## bitshird (Mar 3, 2012)

Andrew_K99 said:


> knowltoh said:
> 
> 
> > Will these work with the Woodchuck Pen Pro?
> ...



Glad you only were 90% sure, you get to keep,10%,which is about what the inserts are worth. 
The inserts the Woodchuck Pen Pro uses are made in Germany by Tigra , and are alloyed to cut hard woods, The inserts from Global are made  in China and are primarily made for cutting MDF and wafer board, the  grain structure is larger.
 The sharpening which on the Tigra is done radially, while the Chinese is done from top to bottom. If you compare the two you'll find you are getting what you pay for.
 The Tigra inserts are quite a bit better, both in sharpness and in durability,  BUT they do use the same screw, and since you're buying the cheap inserts why bother with the Stainless screws. Also the Woodchuck inserts can be honed easier and sharper once dulled  since the sharpening  from the factory is done radially around the insert rather than up and down along the cutting edge.
All carbide is not created equal, When we first started making the Woodchucks we did use the 14mm from Global and it worked OK, then we tried their 15mm by 100.mm radius insert and it was OK but when we started looking for a 50 mm radius we were contacted by a bit 20 or 30 Chinese manufacturers, and by Tigra, their prices nearly floored me, but after arranging to have the mold made for the 50mm we bought 1000 of the 100 mm done from the same  carbide and noticed a difference right away, , By the way why not skip Global entirely and go to their supplier TY Carbide in China, Yup we even tried them, same stuff, but it won't hold up as well as ours or Easy Wood Tools,  inserts, 
Good luck on your buy,


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## Andrew_K99 (Mar 3, 2012)

Ken

I stated "are or were" used in the Pen Pro, thanks for confirming they were.

Also, where is your information coming from on the use of these inserts?



bitshird said:


> ...The inserts from Global are made  in China and are primarily made for cutting MDF and wafer board, the  grain structure is larger.


These inserts are designed for the Byrd heads used in planners and jointers to plane highly figured wood.  You don't use these machine for the materials you claim.

Thanks for the derail, hope you sell lots of $7 inserts.

AK


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## bitshird (Mar 3, 2012)

Andrew_K99 said:


> Ken
> 
> I stated "are or were" used in the Pen Pro, thanks for confirming they were.
> 
> ...



Andrew I wasn't derailing you,  You PM'd me last night about the screw size, I answered you and thought I'd check it out, but you said you didn;t know, and were 90% sure we used the same inserts, just correcting some misinformation, Sorry if you feel I was stepping on your toes.
Three years ago I did a direct deal with the company that Global gets theirs from, TY Carbide in China, talk about a deal from hell. 
 Global is a decent outfit, your best deal is on their 14 mm inserts we used to sell a lot of those when we made the first tool, and while those15mm x 100mm radius inserts are made to fit in to a  Byrd Shelix Planer head, they won't give as good of a finish for very long, but you're saving 4.00 an insert so if it takes 2 or 3 to do the same amount then what the heck it's a push 
But if I thought the Global inserts were as good as Tigras, I wouldn't be spending 375.00 a hundred for the 100 mm radius inserts,with a 500 MOQ.
 Check the ISO standard for the Global  inserts, see what the rating is and what the composition is, the ISO will give you the composition and the grain size, you're looking for Nano Grain.  Like I said, they'll work, BUT you're going to get what you pay for.
And the Global inserts have never been used in The Pen Pros, Only in the first hundred or so Woodchuck Model A which was our first tool with a radiused insert, we  quit making them about 3 or so years ago at that time the tool was 34.95, and the inserts were 3.75, but they weren't made out of Stainless with a Stainless screw either, which at some point you'll find the reason for. 
 If you think we are gouging look what Global charges for their 11mm back knife cuter, we only make a couple dollars from each insert. so hey what ever you want to think. Think it. We have brought only top quality tools and inserts to our customers, and we've stood behind our products, are YOU going to stand behind the quality of this buy?
Ken


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## Lucky2 (Mar 4, 2012)

Ken, for some reason I can't get into your site, I keep getting the message that the domain is for sale. Could you please look into this, I wanted to check out what you had to offer for tools. I am new to woodturning and am not familiar with them,  thanks.
Len


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## rkimery (Mar 4, 2012)

I'll take at least 10 here.  Could easily be 20 by the start of the buy!


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## Andrew_K99 (Mar 22, 2012)

Due to not enough interest the group buy for the carbide inserts will not be going forward.

I apologies for any inconvenience.


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