# Narrowed it down



## badwin (Mar 21, 2006)

Okay I've narrowed it down to the Flat Top Fountain Pen and the El Grande Fountain Pen as my 2 choices.  This will be my first attempt at something different than the slimline.  I would like some advice on which kit would be the easier one to turn and put together.  Thought I would start out a little easy and work my way up.
Thanks
Brian


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## PenWorks (Mar 21, 2006)

Brian, not to confuse you, but I don't like either of your choices [)] JMO
I would try a Jr Gent or a Baron or a Ligero, both very easy to make.


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## alamocdc (Mar 21, 2006)

Actually, Brian, I think a Baron might better suit this step. They are easy to turn and are quite popular. JMO

EDIT: Man, do I need to learn to type faster. Anthony and I were at least in agreement. WHEW!


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## gerryr (Mar 21, 2006)

I can't say anything about the El Grande since I've never made one, but I've made the Flattop American and the Baron/Jr. Gent and agree that the Baron/Jr. Gent is quite a bit easier to make.  The FT American requires a tenon, the Baron/Jr. Gent does not.


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## JimGo (Mar 21, 2006)

> _Originally posted by PenWorks_
> <br />Brian, not to confuse you, but I don't like either of your choices [)] JMO
> I would try a Jr Gent or a Baron or a Ligero, both very easy to make.



That would be my recommendation as well.  I'd go with the Jr. Gen II's, since I think the threads have been fixed, and I believe the bushings are still the same between them and the Jr. Statesman II's.  Thus, you can change the look of some of your pens without having to get all new bushings and without having to learn a new pen (not that there's much to learn).


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## Geo in Winnipeg (Mar 21, 2006)

There's not a lot of difference between the El Grande and the Ligero but they need large drills. The Baron might be a better choice though because the drills are smaller - therefore smaller blank - easier drilling and they are more popular. Like gerryr said the FT American requires a tenon plus you have to be real careful with the assembly.


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## DocStram (Mar 21, 2006)

I went from Slimlines to El Grades.  I got a bunch of them dirt cheap in ebay.  I've made about 10 and have 5 left.  I'm looking forward to finishing that last one. There are a couple of reasons why I wouldn't buy more ..... as stated earlier, the drills are large ...... the bottom barrel's tube doesn't slide in very easily and I end up having to rat tail file the blank.  My biggest dissapointmet is the finished product.  The El Grande hardware always looks a little cheesey compared to the wood. The ones I have just look a little on the cheap side.
I'm looking forward to moving on to Barons.


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## wdcav1952 (Mar 21, 2006)

Now you guys went and hurt my feelings.  []  I like the El Grande as it shows off a blank really well given the larger size of the finished product.  With the same drills and bushings you can make the newer Churchill kit which has more metal than the El Grande plastic.  I find that my daily writer is an El Grande fountain pen with a fine nib.  As regards the cap blank, use a 13.3 mm drill and it fits much better.

This is not to pick on the Barons, as I love that kit; I just like to write with an El Grande as it fits my hand better.

FWIW,


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## alamocdc (Mar 21, 2006)

> _Originally posted by wdcav1952_
> <br />...I just like to write with an El Grande as it fits my hand better.


[:0]Boy an I glad you aren't MY dentist!!!! [)]


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## TerryBlanchard (Mar 21, 2006)

I turned an ElGrande this week and have great success eith it.  Do have a bit of trouble with the fountain pen drying out if it is not used every day.  Interesting that the Churchhill uses the same bushings and drill bit, I have wanted to try one of them but did not want to purchase more bits and bushings.  I like the Jr Gentleman fountain pen it is the smoothest writing, even smoother than my Cross fountain pen.


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## its_virgil (Mar 21, 2006)

I like the El Grande but a word of caution. The wall thickness on the ElGrande is very small. The pen is very sensitive to any glue inside the tubes close to where the pen parts press in. The thin wooden walls will crack or the plastic parts will break. 

Also, the ink flow problem is often the ink and not the pen. Get some really good ink like Private Reserve and that problem will stop. I just picked up and ElGrande FP that has not been used for 10 days and it wrote first try. The ink that comes in the cartridges with the pens or at Wal Mart is really cheesy ink. I just tested 3 other FP's, a Gent, Jr gent, and Baron and they all wrote the first try. 

Anthony Turchetta sells Private Reserve ink and some other brands also.

Do a good turn daily!
Don






> _Originally posted by TerryBlanchard_
> <br />I turned an ElGrande this week and have great success eith it.  Do have a bit of trouble with the fountain pen drying out if it is not used every day.  Interesting that the Churchhill uses the same bushings and drill bit, I have wanted to try one of them but did not want to purchase more bits and bushings.  I like the Jr Gentleman fountain pen it is the smoothest writing, even smoother than my Cross fountain pen.


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## arioux (Mar 21, 2006)

Brian,

El Grande is a good choice. Baron would be better but we can't have the in Canada, AZ don't ship here anymore and he has the exclusivity .  Unless some very nice guy, yep very very nice guys from IAP would do a fountain pen and bushing group buy for their nice nice fellows from up north[], you will have to go with one of your first two choices.  Mabe Fangar could sell some barons with is closed end pin chuck [ .  Well i had to try []

And follow Don advice about the ink, this is the difference between a great pen and a so so one.  Just put aside the ink that comes with the kit and give your custommer some good stuff.

Have fun

Alfred

P.S. Did i mention that it would be nice if someone would  do a group...........ok, i shut up.


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## DCBluesman (Mar 21, 2006)

I also sell Private Reserve in both bottles and cartridges.  http://www.heritagepens.com/products.asp?cat=20


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## thetalbott4 (Mar 21, 2006)

> quote:
> Originally posted by wdcav1952
> 
> ...I just like to write with an El Grande as it fits my hand better.
> ...



Or your proctologist!!!!!!![:0]


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## badwin (Mar 21, 2006)

Wow, thanks for all the replies fellas.  Unfortunately arioux is right, the pen kits we get here in Canada are limited.  The 2 sets that I mentioned in my original post just came on the market with leevalley and I don't think I'm good enough yet to tackle a tough kit.  I would order a different set from the US but the duty gets me bad everytime.  Oh well I guess I will continue having a blast with the slimlines.  I actually have had okay success selling these @ $20 per pen.  Maybe leevalley will offer something new soon.
Thanks
Brian


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## arioux (Mar 21, 2006)

Brian,

You can order almost every pen kits from suppliers in the states an cheaper than in Canada.  Almost every reseller ship to Canada.  I don't want to start the argument as to know wich one is the best because for me they are all good.  Don't order directly from the manufacturer,tey are more expensive but Beartooth wood (Berea) Woodturningz and Pens of color (PSI)are great people to deal with.  CSU don't have distributors but they are nice person too.  Even with postage, it's almost half price including the exchange rate and there is no custom fees on pen kits, only fed and prov sales taxes, if you parcel get pick by Post canada.  Many times, the parcel just go thru and no taxes are charged.  And you have a lot more choice.  AZ don't ship to Canada but there is only 2 or 3 kits that are not available thru beartooth wood  (Baron, Olympia and Atals i think).  The home page of IAP has the links to these suppliers.  The best exemple is the Cigar pen, you will pay $6.20 CDN at Lee Valey, most of the reseller in the states sells them from $2.75 to $3.00 US (less than $3.50 to $4.00 CDN!!!!).  An other good reseller is Wood pen pro, he import his hown kits and are very good too.  Shipping won't be an issue, since they all use flat rate envelope or boxes so if you limit your order to less than about 50 kits, shipping should be around $10.00us. Shipping at LeeValey for 50 kits would be around $12.00CDN . By the way, Lee Valey sells Berea kits

Hope this helps you,

Alfred

Ps. Did i mention that a Baron group buy for your nice Canadian neib......... ok ok , no more[}]


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## arioux (Mar 21, 2006)

Brian,

Forget to add, i will be orderring some cigar pens pretty soon, i you are not confortable with ordering from the states, let me know and i can add few kits for you. It won't impact my shipping cost if you don't order more than 10 kits, over that, well it won't impact that much anyway 1 or 2$ . So you will just have to pay postage from Montreal to you.  Let me know if you want some or any other kits, we can work something out.

Alfred


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## badwin (Mar 21, 2006)

Alfred
Thanks for the good info.  Have you ever tried to order from Jacques Coulombe.  I tried to email them about shipping prices and some other info and got no replies.
Brian


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## alamocdc (Mar 21, 2006)

> _Originally posted by thetalbott4_
> <br />
> 
> 
> ...


That's very true, Scott, but he is a dentist IIRC.


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## alamocdc (Mar 21, 2006)

> _Originally posted by badwin_
> <br />Wow, thanks for all the replies fellas.  Unfortunately arioux is right, the pen kits we get here in Canada are limited.  The 2 sets that I mentioned in my original post just came on the market with leevalley and I don't think I'm good enough yet to tackle a tough kit.  I would order a different set from the US but the duty gets me bad everytime.  Oh well I guess I will continue having a blast with the slimlines.  I actually have had okay success selling these @ $20 per pen.  Maybe leevalley will offer something new soon.
> Thanks
> Brian


Have any of our Canadian friends tried to do a bulk order directly from Berea? They might be willing to ship to Canada, and might even sell you Barons under the circumstances. If that doesn't work, I'd be willing to help you guys out, but it will have to wait a few weeks.


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## arioux (Mar 21, 2006)

Berea ships to Canada, i often take advantage of his pencrafter program.  I'll check with them about the Baron, mabe it will work.  If not, i could handle a group for my Canadian fellows.  Thanks for offering, really nice of you.


Alfred


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## wdcav1952 (Mar 21, 2006)

> _Originally posted by thetalbott4_
> <br />
> 
> 
> ...



Damn, I didn't see either one of those coming at me!! []


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## wood-of-1kind (Mar 21, 2006)

> _Originally posted by badwin_
> <br />Alfred
> Have you ever tried to order from Jacques Coulombe.  I tried to email them about shipping prices and some other info and got no replies.
> Brian


Jacques is now simply selling PSI kits. His prices are reasonable but it still makes economic $en$e to purchase from the US. Taxes, exchange aside, importing is still cheaper than purchasing here in Canada. Lee Valley is not price competitive although they have expanded their lineup(Berea) JMHO.
-Peter-[]


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## JimGo (Mar 21, 2006)

> _Originally posted by wdcav1952_
> <br />
> 
> 
> ...



How could you see anything past those hands?


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## alamocdc (Mar 21, 2006)

Great one, Jim! [] Of course now I have to dry off my keyboard, monitor and desk 'cause I just spewed water all over the place when I read your post!


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## gerryr (Mar 22, 2006)

Hey, you guys are going to William feel bad.[][]


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## wdcav1952 (Mar 22, 2006)

> _Originally posted by JimGo_
> <br />
> 
> 
> ...



Wow, good thing I'm not the sensitive type![]

Billy, you recall correctly, I am a dentist.  Over the years, though I have been occasionally called something associated with proctologists!!! [)]

BTW, thanks Gerry for the support, but they didn't hack off any of my sense of humor during my recent surgery. [][)][]


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## alamocdc (Mar 22, 2006)

Damn, Cav, now I have to clean my keyboard and monitor off again. This time it's milk and Cheerios! [:0]


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## gerryr (Mar 22, 2006)

At least it wasn't pickes and ice cream.[][]


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## vbatwork (Mar 22, 2006)

Hi Brian,
I haven't turned a FP yet, but I really like the El Grande RB kit. It's true it is thin walled, but I'm relatively new to turning and manage okay. I love to see all the wood on a big pen like that and customers like that its lighter than a cigar because of those walls.

- John


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## chigdon (Mar 22, 2006)

I have turned the Flat Top and hated it.  It was one of the early kits I turned and wished I never had.  I agree the Barons are the best kit out there and are affordable, great quality, and easy to turn.  I don't really turn cigars any more but they were always one of my favorites to turn and assemble and are big enough to show off the wood.


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## tnilmerl (Mar 22, 2006)

EL Grande is large and light.  Like the option to have monogram inserts in cap.  Good characteristics.  However, parts are mostly plastic.  Poor quality IMHO.  Assembly relatively straight forward.  Be careful when pressing parts on to barrel.  Since parts are mostly plastic, it's easy to 'shave' the plastic when pressing in the parts - uber bad.  My center rings have all loosened after a few months.  Of course the rather large diameter forces you to either buy the 3/4" pen mill or trim the barrel with a sander or some other means.  

There are other, better quality kits for your money.


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## TomServo (Mar 23, 2006)

Just as an FYI, I've been bringing stuff up to canada for George (winnipeg) - I live just on the US side of the border and go up once a week to visit my fiance.. A group buy is certainly a possibility.

edit: Should we call it The Great White North Group Buy? ;P


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## arioux (Mar 24, 2006)

Hi,

Thanks to Lou (DCBluesman)suggestion, I just talk with Jim at Bearea and ask him if he would ship the Baron to Canada if i could put an order together of 100 or so pens and he said no problem. Price sturcture would be the same as AZ.  Postage cost from Bera to me won't be an issue since i already have an order to send him of over 100 different kits and other stuff so it wont add that much to my actual postage if i add few more kits.  Anyway. i'll figure everything out and I will be posting in the group buy section this weekend.

Alfred


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## alamocdc (Mar 24, 2006)

That's great, Al! I thought he might. That saves me the trouble, but I'd have done it if he hadn't been willing.


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