# Larger "standard" converter?



## PenHog (Jun 3, 2020)

Hi All,

I couldn't find anything about this doing a search on the IAP website, but my apologies if I missed it.

Sometimes I find that the standard converter runs out of ink fairly quickly, especially if I'm using a semi-flex nib. Is there a larger converter available that is compatible with Bock nibs? Does anybody on this forum make such an item?

Thanks,
-Max


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## duncsuss (Jun 3, 2020)

To the best of my knowledge, your options for "large capacity converters" are limited to the Pilot CON-70 and one made by Noodler's Ink which I don't remember the model/name.

Neither of these has a mouth that fits the nipple on the feed of a regular Bock nib unit.

Your best option might be to use your pen as an "eye dropper" - but this means you need a completely water and air tight barrel (including at the threads to the section.) If your pen barrel is acrylic acetate, this is probably a safe thing to do - if it's wood (without a waterproof liner) it could be a risky idea.

Hope this helps.


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## Mr Vic (Jun 3, 2020)

Another option would be the maxi international cartridge. Twice the capacity of the regular international cartridge. You can either use up the ink and then use a syringe to flush and refill with your favorite bottled ink.


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## PenHog (Jun 4, 2020)

Thanks for the replies!

*Duncan:* Yes, I really like the CON-70, but as you say, there's a compatibility issue. Eye dropping is fun, I have a basic FPR pen that I do this with, and the flow is great. But I was hoping for a converter solution, and it sounds like there isn't one out there.

*Vic:* I've heard of people doing this, but not of that particular cartridge, thanks for the info.

I guess I'm just surprised that nobody has put out a larger size of standard converter. Perhaps something with the K6 threads, but maybe slightly wider and/or longer would be great. Having played with a few filling systems, I still prefer the simplicity and easy-to-clean feature of converters.

Anyway, thanks again!
-Max


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## duncsuss (Jun 4, 2020)

PenHog said:


> *Duncan:* Yes, I really like the CON-70, but as you say, there's a compatibility issue. Eye dropping is fun, I have a basic FPR pen that I do this with, and the flow is great. But I was hoping for a converter solution, and it sounds like there isn't one out there.



I missed the obvious - if you are making the section yourself, you can make it fit whatever converter you like. I've made a section that takes the CON-70 for a customer who wanted to use an Esterbrook Renew-point nib. Just have to build a large enough barrel to hold it.


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## monophoto (Jun 4, 2020)

So-called ‘standard’ international cartridges come on both short and long versions - with the long cartridge holding about twice as much ink as the short version.  There are many suppliers of short cartridges, but relatively few make long cartridges.  And not all pens can accommodate the longer cartridge.

Standard international converters have about the same capacity as short cartridges.  I’m not aware of any converters that equate to long cartridges.

There are alternative pen designs that do hold more ink than short cartridges - eye dropper pens for example.  However, eye dropper pens can be messy To use and maintain and are generally used by pen aficionados.


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## Mr Vic (Jun 4, 2020)

This might also be an option a squeeze convertor. Not sure how much more it holds. Ed could probably answer. I've got some around somewhere and will check if I find them.






						Fountain Pen Converter - Long Squeeze
					

Long squeeze vacuum-style converters for fountain pens. Use these as replacement or as a preferred option to the ball style converters. These converters measure 2 3/4" in length.




					www.exoticblanks.com


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## Penultimate (Jun 4, 2020)

Greetings
You could make a piston filler, I’ve made two and they hold a lot of ink. An ink window is may be necessary. https://richardlgreenwald.com/?s=Piston&post_type=product
Another method is to make your own syringe piston filler or an eye dropper filler. This gives you a lot of design flexibility. 
Good luck. 


Sent from my iPhone using Penturners.org mobile app


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## PenHog (Jun 5, 2020)

duncsuss said:


> I missed the obvious - if you are making the section yourself, you can make it fit whatever converter you like. I've made a section that takes the CON-70 for a customer who wanted to use an Esterbrook Renew-point nib. Just have to build a large enough barrel to hold it.



Hi Duncan,

I'd be making the section myself; however, I'm confused as to how the CON-70 would "latch" onto the nipple (or whatever it's called) of the Bock housing. Without a firm attachment, I'd worry the CON-70 would slip out of the section with potentially messy consequences.  Did you thread the CON-70, or simply get a good-enough friction fit?

Can you offer any hints on what you're thinking design-wise here?

Thanks,
-Max


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## PenHog (Jun 5, 2020)

monophoto said:


> So-called ‘standard’ international cartridges come on both short and long versions - with the long cartridge holding about twice as much ink as the short version.  There are many suppliers of short cartridges, but relatively few make long cartridges.  And not all pens can accommodate the longer cartridge.
> 
> Standard international converters have about the same capacity as short cartridges.  I’m not aware of any converters that equate to long cartridges.
> 
> There are alternative pen designs that do hold more ink than short cartridges - eye dropper pens for example.  However, eye dropper pens can be messy To use and maintain and are generally used by pen aficionados.



Interesting, thanks for the info. I'd still prefer a converter, but I'm interested to see these long ink cartridges. Time to break out the Google-fu.
-Max


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## PenHog (Jun 5, 2020)

Mr Vic said:


> This might also be an option a squeeze convertor. Not sure how much more it holds. Ed could probably answer. I've got some around somewhere and will check if I find them.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thanks, Vic. I've seen these, but I've been warned that they don't hold much ink (I should probably verify this myself).


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## PenHog (Jun 5, 2020)

Penultimate said:


> Greetings
> You could make a piston filler, I’ve made two and they hold a lot of ink. An ink window is may be necessary. https://richardlgreenwald.com/?s=Piston&post_type=product
> Another method is to make your own syringe piston filler or an eye dropper filler. This gives you a lot of design flexibility.
> Good luck.
> ...



Thanks, Mike. Making a piston filler interests me. But I'm worried about compatibility issues with the Greenwald option. Someone (maybe you?) reported their experience awhile back with using these. While they worked, I seem to recall the item is already threaded, and this required the penmaker to thread above the existing threads. I also (and I could be wrong) worry about wall thickness if I try to use a Bock #6 housing with that item.

Of course, when I have more time, I'd like to try anyway, or experiment with making my own. But given time constraints, it's not at the top of my list (yet).

-Max


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## duncsuss (Jun 5, 2020)

PenHog said:


> Can you offer any hints on what you're thinking design-wise here?


Here's how I made a section to match the CON-70: it is not the only way, and next time I make another I will try an alternate approach.

Start by purchasing a couple of converters, and figure out the diameter of the aperture. I used a transfer punch set to get in the vicinity really fast, then fine tuned it by trial and error. The ones I have are really close to 7/32" - so I bought some 7/32" stainless tubing from McMaster-Carr or Grainger or Enco, I forget which.

Then I made a section to take the nib unit I was going to use, and glued a length of the stainless tube into the other end. 7/32 was just a little too tight for my liking, so I used fine grit papers to polish it down just a smidge for a tight-but-not-too-tight fit, and used a little silicone grease to make sure there was still a good seal.

Pix of my prototype follow.

My next one will be the reverse - the converter will push into a hole in the section (which is how the Pilot fountain pens are made) rather than pushing onto a tube.


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## jalbert (Jun 5, 2020)

I just made my own high capacity cartridge from acrylic, which screws into the back of the section. The mouth is wide enough to allow ink to flow freely out on to the feed. Using converters with nibs they are not designed for is extremely hit or miss. For example, the pilot feeds are specifically designed to seat up into the mouth of the converter and facilitate capillary action and draw ink from the converter to the nib. The hole in the converter is not large enough in diameter to allow ink to freely flow out of. There is quite a large gap between the nipple of a jowo/bock feed and the aperture of the pilot converters, which is problematic for consistent ink flow.


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## PenHog (Jun 6, 2020)

Hi Duncan,

Pretty slick, thanks a lot for sharing! That seems like a reasonable thing to try, and I _might_ be able to pull it off with my skillset. Thanks again!


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## PenHog (Jun 6, 2020)

jalbert said:


> I just made my own high capacity cartridge from acrylic, which screws into the back of the section. The mouth is wide enough to allow ink to flow freely out on to the feed. Using converters with nibs they are not designed for is extremely hit or miss. For example, the pilot feeds are specifically designed to seat up into the mouth of the converter and facilitate capillary action and draw ink from the converter to the nib. The hole in the converter is not large enough in diameter to allow ink to freely flow out of. There is quite a large gap between the nipple of a jowo/bock feed and the aperture of the pilot converters, which is problematic for consistent ink flow.



Hi John,

Thanks for the info! What you're saying makes sense. I might try as you suggest at some later date.

A major obstacle for me in attempting what you propose is that I don't know how the inside of the twist mechanism of the converter functions. I really need to find the time to pull one apart, see how they're made, and figure out if I can replicate it. We're low tech over here


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## jalbert (Jun 6, 2020)

Mine was just a tube that you fill with a syringe, not an actual converter.

__
		http://instagr.am/p/BXrBG2Cgf1-/


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## duncsuss (Jun 6, 2020)

PenHog said:


> Pretty slick, thanks a lot for sharing! That seems like a reasonable thing to try, and I _might_ be able to pull it off with my skillset. Thanks again!


You're welcome! I figure if I can pull it off with my skillset (I'm no jalbert by any stretch of the imagination  ) then pretty much anyone should be able to do it.

I won't ask for royalties on the idea - but please tag me when you post pix of your success.


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## PenHog (Jun 7, 2020)

jalbert said:


> Mine was just a tube that you fill with a syringe, not an actual converter.
> 
> __
> http://instagr.am/p/BXrBG2Cgf1-/



Thanks, John! That looks pretty nice (as usual).
-Max


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## PenHog (Jun 7, 2020)

duncsuss said:


> You're welcome! I figure if I can pull it off with my skillset (I'm no jalbert by any stretch of the imagination  ) then pretty much anyone should be able to do it.
> 
> I won't ask for royalties on the idea - but please tag me when you post pix of your success.



Will do


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