# Friction polish over CA?



## LEAP (Jun 2, 2007)

I've seen a few posts where its mentioned that people have applied friction polish over CA. I tried it on a couple of pens and found that it looked great but on one that I decided to carry around for test purposes I see that the friction polish has dulled and is starting to wear off to nice shiny CA. what are your experiences with FP over CA?


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## wdcav1952 (Jun 3, 2007)

Phil,

I see no reason to put a friction polish over CA.  You are right in that the FP will usually wear away exposing the CA finish which is better anyway.  I would follow the CA with a coat of the protective wax of your choice.


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## LEAP (Jun 3, 2007)

Cav,
It was an experiment, to be honest I did not see the point either but decided to give it a try. It did teach my how quickly the friction polish will fade and wear off. It lost its gloss after a week or so and started to wear through to the CA a few days later. Think I'll save the friction polish for things that won't be handled very much.


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## LostintheWoods (Jun 3, 2007)

You're both right in there being no point in using friction polish over a CA finish. Having established that, why would you choose a CA base to establish a performance evaluation of a friction polish? You wouldn't---or at least shouldn't. A CA finish is a non-porous plastic surface, and the [shellac] friction polish just can't get any adhesion, so its not a reasonable test. On bare wood, though a friction polish will not last as long as a CA finish, it will last much longer than the week or so that you observed in your test.


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## wdcav1952 (Jun 3, 2007)

Good point, Shannon.

Also, Phil, you are on the right thought path for friction polish.  An objet d art is a better choice for such a finish.  Unfortunately, none of my work qualifies to be called by a fancy name like that. []


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## LEAP (Jun 3, 2007)

Shannon,
I understand exactly what you are saying. To bring up another related point, how does the FP adhere to the sanding sealers being used? If there are a couple of coats of sanding sealer being applied the wood surface can no longer be considered as bare. Many of us use thin CA as a sealer and that would prevent the adhesion of the FP. I guess what I'm getting at is if someone is going to use FP they need to apply it to bare wood or possibly a cellulose sealer.


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## DCBluesman (Jun 3, 2007)

There are reasons to use a friction polish over CA.  A properly applied friction polish can produce a "wet look" finish.  While that wet look cannot be maintained, as the friction polish wears there will still be a glossy finish left behind.  As for adhesion, the friction polish won't adhere as well to CA as it does to bare wood but if properly done, it can last weeks or months.  In my experience, friction polishes that only last a week are caused by old product or improper application.


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## LEAP (Jun 3, 2007)

Lou,
The wet look is a good description of how it looked right after finishing. It maintained that look for the first week or so then turned to more of a satin finish. as I continue to use the pen the satin look is wearing off to the shiny ca underneath. I'm probably a lot harder on a pen then the average guy. I take a lot of notes in an industrial setting so a pen takes a lot of abuse.  What are your thoughts / experiences on this as compared to a good wax over the ca? I've not used TSW but do tend to buff with carnuba wax before assembling a pen.


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## RussFairfield (Jun 3, 2007)

I use the shellac friction polish ove a gloss CA finish as a temporary protection because it will last forever in my pen case, and up to weeks or months in the hands of the user. 

Wax will deteriorate with exposure to air, meaning I will have to reapply and polish the pens in inventory to keep them looking good; and it can disappear in a day when the pen is used.

To each their own.


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## LEAP (Jun 3, 2007)

Excellent point Russ, I had not looked at it from an inventory maintenance point of view. I just checked the other pen I did that has not been used and it looks just as it did when I finished it. The one I'm using  never looked dull it just went from gloss to satin and is "wearing" back to a gloss.


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## kf4knf (Jun 4, 2007)

I often apply a CA finish to pens and sand through all the grits of MM.  Once done, I apply both sticks of HUT PPP.  It really helps bring out the shine.  So far I havent seen any after affects as the PPP is used as a buffing compound and not so much a finish. Little, if any PPP is left on the finished blank.


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## rd_ab_penman (Jun 7, 2007)

Phil, 
I have found that FP dose not adhere to CA. I use CA as a filler and sealer only and after sanded down to a miminum of 4000 grit I buff with Tripoli and finish with Caranuba. I also find that FP works well on bare material and so far seems to stand up to wear and tear.

Les
Red Deer, Alberta


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## Dario (Jun 7, 2007)

None of my pens that are CA finished had any friction polish on them.  For me, I don't think friction polish will help much (or any at all) so I don't apply it.

But as Russ said, to each his own.


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## RussFairfield (Jun 7, 2007)

Can't understand the statement about Shellac (friction polish) not sticking to CA glue. Shellac is the "universal sticker" that bonds to everything. 

I know of no finishing product that won't stick to the CA glue if the gloss is removed from the surface with 0000-steel wool or an equivalent sanding medium. You should be able to put any finish over a CA base. It will be strictly a mechanical bond, but the only bond that is stronger is when the two surfaces are melted together as with a lacquer on lacquer, or shellac on shellac.


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## RogerGarrett (Jun 10, 2007)

> _Originally posted by RussFairfield_
> <br />I use the shellac friction polish ove a gloss CA finish as a temporary protection because it will last forever in my pen case, and up to weeks or months in the hands of the user.



I second this.  I've been using CA finish for awhile now - but I always complete the process with Mylands - which gives a deep, beautiful finish.  In a sense, the shellac acts like a buffing compound - so when it does wear off, you have a bit more shine than you did before the shellac was added.

BTW - I haven't had much problem with wear after the fact - something that surprised me.  One pen went through the wash and still looks like it did the day it was made.  Wish I could say that for the shirt.[B)]

Best wishes,
Roger Garrett


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## PaulD (Jun 12, 2007)

Have you tried Renaissance Wax?  It seems to last a lot better for me then what you are describing.  I've gone to a general approach of light sanding, Mylands Woodsealer, light sanding, more Mylands if necessary, CA, rough micromesh, CA (repeating these steps as needed), Hut Ultra Gloss, fine micromesh and Renaissance Wax wrap-up. 



> _Originally posted by RussFairfield_
> <br />I use the shellac friction polish ove a gloss CA finish as a temporary protection because it will last forever in my pen case, and up to weeks or months in the hands of the user.
> 
> Wax will deteriorate with exposure to air, meaning I will have to reapply and polish the pens in inventory to keep them looking good; and it can disappear in a day when the pen is used.
> ...


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## Pipes (Jun 12, 2007)

In order to put the friction plish on over XA which would be wrong IMO . you would melt the CA and ruin the finish . You can however put it under CA as a filler  , []


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## soundman (Jun 30, 2007)

The instructions for the friction polish that is use specificaly warns against using it over any other finish as it will fail to bond.

cheers


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