# CA only vs. CA/BLO finish?



## wickford (Feb 5, 2009)

I've been trying to find a finish that can be completed quickly.  My normal finish is CA only (5 coats) then MM 1500-12000 wet.  What I don't like is waiting for each coat of CA to dry to apply the next coat.  So I thought after reading many tutorials on CA/BLO finishes on numerous sites I'd give it a try since it dries almost immediately and a pen can receive 5 coats in just a couple minutes.  

So I thought I'd do a comparison.  Here's what I found:

CA only finish produces a VERY shiney mirror like finish which I love.  But the CA/BLO only seems to produce a somewhat shiney "sheen" finish which is okay, but to me, its not as stunning.

Has anyone else tried this out, or is there a way to get a "mirror like" shine using CA/BLO?

Thanks for any advice, or suggestions...

Jeff


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## rej19 (Feb 5, 2009)

I only us BLO once to bring out the grain in the wood. I use accelerator between coats and can immediately apply the next coat. I try not to make each coat very thick and just apply more coats if needed. I have not noticed any sheen caused by the BLO. Everybody does it a little different!


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## Chasper (Feb 5, 2009)

I do CA with and without BLO and I can get an equally mirror-like shine with either.  I rarely use accelerator other than contact with a paper towel.  I've never waited for a coat of CA to dry, the contact with the paper towel cures it adequately.  Usually I apply  2-3 coats of medium followed by 2-3 coats of thin.  I apply with the lathe spinning at full speed and I think I keep the paper towel in contact longer than some turners do.  I MM after the final coat of BLO/CA.  If everything works out right (75% of the time) I take less than 5 minutes from putting down the turning tool to starting assembly.


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## GouletPens (Feb 5, 2009)

are you using the same CA with both methods (thin, med....) and are you using paper towels with both? If you're using thin with paper towels with one method and thick without on the other, that would make a huge difference (just an example). Paper towels and accelerant will solve all your problems. The BLO shouldn't really affect the curing time by itself.


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## marcruby (Feb 5, 2009)

You are correct - using BLO with each CA application produces a 'softer' finish than just working with CA.  Russ Fairfield noted that in his instructions.  Personally, I don't like that finish at all.  I've never tried using a single early application of BLO just to pop the grain -- I find that CA alone does a great job of bringing out the grain.  

What I do is apply three to four coats of medium thin CA using a finer grade of sandpaper between each coat and then take the surface up with micromesh.  I consider accelerant a waste of money.  It's about the maker being in a hurry, not about improving the finish.  And BLO is only needed if you want to use an odd accelerant that changes the finish radically.  The simple truth is that it matters little how you get the CA applied to the pen, once you get a decent layer of it built up you can sand and polish it to a high gloss.

My only complaint about CA alone is that it looks a bit plasticky.

Marc


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## GouletPens (Feb 5, 2009)

marcruby said:


> My only complaint about CA alone is that it looks a bit plasticky.
> 
> Marc


 Some might say it looks 'glassy':wink:


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## mrcook4570 (Feb 5, 2009)

Spray with accelerator between coats.  Speeds up the process quite a bit.


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## davinci27 (Feb 5, 2009)

I use acelerant with my ca instead of BLO.  I did CA/BLO for a bit but after trying just CA didn't see any reason to use the BLO.  I know alot of people don't like acelerant, but I haven't had any issues.  A few things to keep in mind.  I use thin CA and do about 8 - 10 coats.  I let the CA spin for about 4-5 seconds before applying the accelerant. Lastly I spray a very light quick burst of accellerant,  I don't soak it down.

it takes about 10-15 seconds for each coat of CA, so about 2-3 minutes total to apply the finish.


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## jttheclockman (Feb 5, 2009)

I will use blo to initial pop the grain if it needs to be but after that 4 or 5 coats of thin CA and no accelorator. I let the lathe spin and it dries it fairly quickly. I actually like the look the CA leaves. I too probably leave the paper towel in contact with the blank longer than usual. I wait to feel the towel jut get tacky and then stop. Has worked so far.


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## marcruby (Feb 5, 2009)

If you are going to use an accelerant remember to get it off the pen before putting on the next coat.  I expect that if you sand between coats that would be enough.  I have no idea what is in the accelerants but remember that between trapped solvent and accelerant you are handing someone an interesting chemical cocktail.  

Keep in mind that a paper towel is also an accelerant, depending on the amount of cotton fiber present.  Which is why I don't use one.  I find letting the CA cure on its own gives me the clearest finish.  I just set the blank aside for a half hour and go on to the next one.

Marc


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## ed4copies (Feb 5, 2009)

IF you use accelerant, when you put on the next coat of CA, it may get VERY HOT.

Be prepared.


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## TellicoTurning (Feb 5, 2009)

I use the accelerate but not every coat... If I use BLO, it's only on the raw wood, then follow with thin CA... otherwise I seal the wood with thin CA, then switch to med CA for the rest of the finish.  When I use the accelerate, it's only every other coat and on the final... Then I wet sand with the PSI sanding pads (MM I think) through all 6 grits, wiping the blank between grits with wet towel or my fingers and water.. then finish with a plastic polish.    I apply the CA with little foam sheet strips that I cut from the foam sheets that's wrapped around electronics... similar to the delrin strips others use.
(I'm too cheap to buy the delrin and have a number of the foam sheets from a few past purchases of DVD player, new computer for the wife, etc..... )


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## george (Feb 5, 2009)

Yes, I get just the same result. I work mainly only with CA, but just the other day some lady "complained" about the glossy look,when she was deciding on the pen. She said it looks like plastic and not at all like wood. I buffed her with tripoli and white diamond, and finaly with carnuba wax. That took some of the shine off.

I must try some Hank's method, that is going up to 12.000 MM and then down to 8.000 and 6.000. But are not sure if this blanks are buffed at the end.


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## bradh (Feb 5, 2009)

I use a BLO/CA method. Start with the BLO and end with CA. The BLO accelerates the CA set and smooths the CA to reduce sanding. The final coat is just CA giving the great gloss. I let the finish cure a couple hours before a final MM and buff.
I usually can do my finish in about 2 minutes, excluding the final sand and buff.


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## JimB (Feb 5, 2009)

You may be getting a build up of BLO. Be sure to wipe off the exceess each time.


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## leehljp (Feb 5, 2009)

Except for occasionally using BLO (or other oil) for "popping the grain" - I use BLO and paper towel because they both act as a mild accelerant - which was the original reason that I read here at IAP for using them. And I am sure it was from Russ.

In cooler weather (below 80°F,) I tend to use these two more. Above 75° - 80°, I rarely use them as I don't need them for their accelerant properties.

BLO and PT do other things such as smooth the spreading too, but that can be done with other things. 

This is strictly my personal use method.  One of the great things about this hobby is the numerous ways we can arrive at our finished product.


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## timberview4 (Feb 5, 2009)

*Buffed what...*



george said:


> Yes, I get just the same result. I work mainly only with CA, but just the other day some lady "complained" about the glossy look,when she was deciding on the pen. She said it looks like plastic and not at all like wood. I buffed her with tripoli and white diamond, and finaly with carnuba wax. That took some of the shine off.
> 
> I must try some Hank's method, that is going up to 12.000 MM and then down to 8.000 and 6.000. But are not sure if this blanks are buffed at the end.


 
Being fairly new to this I must ask....do you buff the pen or the customer


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## leehljp (Feb 5, 2009)

timberview4 said:


> Being fairly new to this I must ask....do you buff the pen or the customer



LOL, :biggrin:

George was referring to an experiment that I did some time ago which can be viewed here:

http://www.penturners.org/photos/images/940/1_2Cigs_2Fin_1Burl.jpg

In this experiment, I finished two pens the same including up to 12000 mm. Then I went back down the MM scale to 3200 or 3600 (forgot) and achieved a non-shine with a minutely' wood tactile feel. 

(It was argued that going up to 12000 and then back down was overkill, but my feeling is that I wanted the dull finish to be as perfect as the shiny, only without the shine. No cutting corners - so to speak.)


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## george (Feb 6, 2009)

leehljp said:


> LOL, :biggrin:
> 
> George was referring to an experiment that I did some time ago which can be viewed here:
> 
> ...



Hank, thanks for replying to this. So if I understand correctly, neither of the pens in your experiment was buffed at the end ?


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## leehljp (Feb 6, 2009)

george said:


> Hank, thanks for replying to this. So if I understand correctly, neither of the pens in your experiment was buffed at the end ?



You are correct. I don't usually use a buffer, only sanding, polishing and waxing on the lathe.


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## philb (Feb 6, 2009)

Straight CA here too, just use BLO to pop the grain on figured stuff, but most woods don't even need that. As ive noticed that Oak and BLO seem to make the CA less adherent.

Dont seem to notice any difference in shine, with BLO or without?
PHIL


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